More power from the 1200 8V

[Guzzisport]

Thinking about how much more grunt I could get out of the new 1200 8V motor...

If I ported and polished the heads, remapped the FI with a power commander, added cams and improved airflow in and out (via new intake and new exhaust) what additional power do you think could be gained from this motor? I think the compression ratio is already pretty high so I did not think pistons would add that much. Balancing would no doubt add a lot to the driveability .....

As an indicator I have just added cams, TPO beast intakes, Termignoni exhaust, power commander, matched injectors and a full dyno tune and easily pulled another 12 hp out of my air cooled Ducati Sportclassic 1000cc 2 valve motor. I would guess that with the same treatment as well as a bit of head work I may see another 15 hp from the Guzzi motor taking max hp to say 125??? maybe 130???

I know there is a lot of good knowledge here... thanks for the help in advance.

Cheers

Andrey

[callison]

I read somewhere that someone had already taken a close look at the engine construction of the 8 Valve and came to the conclusion that it was pretty close to maxed out for potential as it is. There is room for additional stroking though and we've been hearing rumors of a 1400cc mill for a while now. Considering the anal-retentive management at Piggio and the current economic state of the world, I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for it.

[pete roper]

Yeah! Wow! Great!

 

There is no PC available and it dosn't look like there will be for a while. I reckon another 10HP should be easily achievable with map modifications.

 

Who are you going to use to grind your cams? and to what profiles? The stock cams ae already fairly hairy, especially for a 4V motor.

 

I'm working on mapping options. It's not easy, there isn't much available for the W5AM and nothing is cheap.

 

All this sort of fantasy stuff is great. Unless you know a shitload I don't it all sounds like flannel to me.

 

pete

[Guzzisport]

So Mr Roper.... a rather negative response was not what I was looking for.

My enquiry was in search of a POSITIVE response and constructive assistance.

 

I gather from your opening line "Yeah Wow Great" that you think the enquiry is some sort of fanciful flight of imagination.

If a PC is not available now then it may soon be, or may be paid for to bring closer to market, and it is most certainly not the only form of aftermarket control possible.

With regard to the cams, the stock cam profile is supplied by Guzzi for the general market and some modification for additional performance will be possible. Cam grinding is not Space Shuttle construction.

I mentioned head work ...... and if you are familiar with people like MBP in Canada you will realize there is plenty of potential for improvement.

Increasing airbox capacity and improving exhaust flow are also possible and relatively simple.

 

"All this sort of fantasy stuff is great" ........ what a negative and down beat response.

There's no fantasy here (mate). With head work, improved breathing and better mapping lots of things are possible. Perhaps you are looking at this from a "what can I buy off the shelf" approach, which is not my expectation. Guzzi's are a TINY little part of the market so I would not expect a lot of well developed after market products but this does not mean it is not possible.

 

Lots of things in life come down to attitude don't they!

[John in Leeds]

Lots of things in life come down to attitude don't they!

 

Yep!

[Guzzisport]

Just to elaborate on what I have been thinking;

Like MANY Guzzi fans, for decades, I have wished Guzzi would produce a real sport bike. (I have looked at the Ghezzi Brian stuff but the looks are not my cup of tea).

Most modern bikes lack soul (and a visible engine), and my V11 sport showed me that there is another Italian bike that can give you goose bumps other than a Ducati (no irreverence implied to other marques!). If you think about what really gets us going with our bikes, a large amount of the emotion involved comes from looking at a gorgeous hunk of engine. Think about a Vincent, Laverda, Ducati, Harley etc etc and you will realize that modern design has lots its connection with this key component of our lust for some machines. Guzzi's have great looking engines in my opinion.

 

OK so I want a real sport Guzzi. Well unfortunately I missed out on the MGS 01. So what to do ????..... how about taking a Griso and;

1. Put an Ohlins front end on it with brembo radial calipers and BST carbon wheels front and rear (or PVM , Marchesini or similar).

2. Custom triple clamps from Speedymoto or similar.

3. New clip on bars with rizoma controls etc.

4. Ohlins rear shock.

5. New exhaust a la MGS 01 and improved intake.

6. Engine work to get power up around 130 hp.

7. New body work and tail section from carbon fiber to help get weight down.

Stuck with the carc unfortunately, works OK but looks crappy.

 

Yeah Yeah Yeah don't start going on about the cost alright.... I Know!! ..... its OK for me, I can afford this hobby.

I think this would be a killer bike and most of us will die waiting for the Guzzi bosses to do this. I don't want to wait.

[richard100t]

Just to elaborate on what I have been thinking;

Like MANY Guzzi fans, for decades, I have wished Guzzi would produce a real sport bike. (I have looked at the Ghezzi Brian stuff but the looks are not my cup of tea).

Most modern bikes lack soul (and a visible engine), and my V11 sport showed me that there is another Italian bike that can give you goose bumps other than a Ducati (no irreverence implied to other marques!). If you think about what really gets us going with our bikes, a large amount of the emotion involved comes from looking at a gorgeous hunk of engine. Think about a Vincent, Laverda, Ducati, Harley etc etc and you will realize that modern design has lots its connection with this key component of our lust for some machines. Guzzi's have great looking engines in my opinion.

 

OK so I want a real sport Guzzi. Well unfortunately I missed out on the MGS 01. So what to do ????..... how about taking a Griso and;

1. Put an Ohlins front end on it with brembo radial calipers and BST carbon wheels front and rear (or PVM , Marchesini or similar).

2. Custom triple clamps from Speedymoto or similar.

3. New clip on bars with rizoma controls etc.

4. Ohlins rear shock.

5. New exhaust a la MGS 01 and improved intake.

6. Engine work to get power up around 130 hp.

7. New body work and tail section from carbon fiber to help get weight down.

Stuck with the carc unfortunately, works OK but looks crappy.

 

Yeah Yeah Yeah don't start going on about the cost alright.... I Know!! ..... its OK for me, I can afford this hobby.

I think this would be a killer bike and most of us will die waiting for the Guzzi bosses to do this. I don't want to wait.

I think what you may be interested in is called a Griso Zero model. I forget who does the kit, but I THINK its the Firestarter people. Anyway do a search on the Griso Zero & see if thats the look you're going after.

[Guzzisport]

Richard

Thanks for the helpful suggestion. I have seen it.

Here is the link;

http://www.guzzisti.it/page_builder.php?fi...l/zero/zero.htm

Tail piece, exhaust routing and a few other details not really for me but this is the closest thing to what I was thinking. This is not an attractive back end for me;

http://www.guzzisti.it/moto/special/zero/images/Zero11.jpg

Thanks for the input......... it shows that it is possible to do something.

[Guzzirider]

Why not buy an MGS01 and make her road legal?

 

I know at least 3 guys have done this in the UK.

 

You already get the Ohlins and over 120 bhp.

[Guzzisport]

I have never seen one for sale. Its an idea but availability is the thing.

The service intervals are very close together from what I understand and don't the pistons or rings need replacement every few thousand miles?

[dabore84]

A liquid cooled version of the msg01 for the road. A super sport and a naked version. Griso as a power cruiser. Stick with other models and drop the sport and breva.

But we all know this is not going to happen.

[Guzzirider]

I have never seen one for sale. Its an idea but availability is the thing.

The service intervals are very close together from what I understand and don't the pistons or rings need replacement every few thousand miles?

 

Easily available- 2 for sale in my local dealer and the factory still make them in small batches when they get a few orders.

 

I believe the service intervals are written as if you were using the machine as a race bike so road use should be fine.

[Guzzisport]

Mr Guzzirider..... are you serious? .. contact info please..... and the factory still makes them?? Were they made in the Guzzi factory, assembled there from parts supplied by Ghezzi or built at Ghezzi? (please excuse the ill informed nature of the questions and thank you in advance)

[belfastguzzi]

Mr Guzzirider..... are you serious? .. contact info please..... and the factory still makes them?? Were they made in the Guzzi factory, assembled there from parts supplied by Ghezzi or built at Ghezzi? (please excuse the ill informed nature of the questions and thank you in advance)

If you are serious about wanting a hyper-sports / race Guzzi you should check round the Moto Guzzi website pages for information.

On the UK Guzzi site you will see information on the MGS and the current price quoted is £17,619.00. Sterling prices have risen quite a bit across the board.

New MGS bikes can be bought for £15,000 to £17,000.

 

Trying to make a Griso into a MGS-like race bike doesn't make sense. It's the wrong configuration and it weighs a ton and a half.

[Guzzirider]

Here is a privately owned one for sale- not sure if Robin has found a buyer yet:

 

MGS01 ad

 

If you want fast, Bruce is selling the Raceco Daytona- it you want a fast Guzzi this is the one to get- I remember being passed on the straight at Cadwell by this monster and the sound and presence is awesome:

 

Raceco ad

 

If you want a new MGS01, last time I was in Moto Strada they had two, and were converting one to road use:

 

Moto Strada

Unit 3, The Sidings

Thackley Old Road

Shipley

BD18 1BN

 

Opening Times

9AM - 5:30PM (Monday - Saturday)

 

Tel: 01274 592500

 

Email: enquiries@motostrada.co.uk

 

I think there are a few others sitting in UK showrooms across the country- not much appetite for a race only bike costing £17k at the moment so you could make an offer and get yourself a good deal.

 

I'm sticking to slow Guzzis they keep me out of trouble