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It seems to me that the whole world needs advice on this subject.

Hi John, the procedure as I understand it is as follows. The ECU goes thru an initial process to determine the engines rotational status. Eg, which cylinder is where and in which state, compression or emptying the bucket. This is governed by the toothed wheel attached to the camshaft and the engine position sensor and takes several engine rotations. After the status has been established and verified the fuel phase table takes over. This table contains rotational degree values which are the starting point for the calculation of coil discharge and injector opening time. They are used in a backward calculation. Which makes sense if one considers that the behaviour of any coil is depended on voltage (and coil design characteristics) and the logarithmic charging characteristics. So the tooth wheel and the missing teeth provide the starting point for the capcom-ops in the code which do the pulse-counting. This starting point (from a rotational point of view it's behind TDC) is in fact the point at which the circuits are opened again. Meaning, the point at which the discharge of the coil or the opening of the injector end. So the calc looks like this: Endpoint (fuel phase table value) + coil charging time/injector opening time = coil discharge start/injector opening The code also contains a trim table to take care of the voltage dependencies. Eg, lower voltage requires a longer coil charging time/injector opening time to achieve the same effect due to the slower coil saturation. So, the answer to your question "Does the ECU vary the period it opens" is yes, it does. Based on the terrific analysis of the components used in the 5AM ECU done by John Th. we know that the current draw is used as another factor in the 5AM (and presumably later generations). I don't know if this current draw was already used in the 15M/RC. Cheers Meinolf

Absolutely not easy with all the 2 - 3 - 4 abbreviations, jargon in another language. Happy riding bike’s has nothing to do with language. IPA time here Cheers Tom.

Wrong end of the stick means "am I mistaken" and the abbreviation of assembly is "Assy" not assay. I once had an Aeronautical engineer (pommie girl about 25) hand me work scope instructions for a repair to the airframe on a 737. I read through it and went to her office and said I'd need the instructions amended. She looked a little surprised when I advised her that the term "greasy print" ,as in "please send the hard copy of the results to the structural engineering office" wasn't really acceptable on a legal document. The connotations that the guys working on the plane were going to be "greasy" of course and would dirty up important records probably wouldn't be to popular either. Ciao

Cheeky bugger. Don't forget that you still owe me a beer. And it's spelled sensor, not sencer, dammit. Youth of today mutter mutter...

You might touch a good point here. A car or motorcycle is a machine but it is considered by many users a consumer good. When treated like a machine it has substantial longer life. If you ride an Audi or BMW like a world touring championship competitor, you will need a sponsor for an annual drive train replacement. My Peugeot 306 Break just past the 560.000 with no drive train parts replaced so far. Not a very inspiring car by the way 😀.

No Hi Cam engine has ever used the 15M ecu as standard John. It was either the P7/8 or the 16M. Ciao

I went to the show on 12 December, had a good discussion with the team on the Norton stand. They will initially build a batch of 28 Commando 961’s to fulfil outstanding orders from the Garner era. Following that batch they advised that any future limited production would depend upon customer interest. I added my name to their list. I don’t know how they will resolve the Euro emissions compliance issue. The Garner era bikes were Euro 4 compliant, but it’s a low output motor already equipped with a 3 way cat, so maybe they could meet Euro 5 with some tweaking of the ECU. They explained about the QA & production engineering improvements that they have made since TVS acquired the company. I for one hope that TVS invests in Norton for the long term. The Garner company was chronically under capitalised & poorly managed

@Meinolf Wow that's a fantasitc piece of work and terrific explanation, thank you so much. I'll need to read it a few times to take in, in its entirety. The ECU is doing even more than I imagnied, I knew it was complex before, but that's even way more advanced. So if I'm reading your explanation correctly (still taking it all in) then the ECU has control over coil saturation times and can and does vary them dependent on various external factors. If that is the case then obtaining a stick coil to suit is a possibilty, not for now, it's very useful to have some rudimetary understanding (not you're explantion of course, more my limited intellect.) That's given me an insight into an area of the ECU that I just had no clue about I am most grateful John

Sorry, no Kindle version of the second edition. The publisher of the first edition retained the digital rights. Here is a link to 1st edition Kindle.

Off topic ! This forum ?

Hi John, I can probably contribute something, but need to know which ECU you are referring to. Cheers Meinolf

a beer? id say a few more... one day we will catch up... ya seen my new ride... so soooo... different to the v11 crap will have to try n shrink a pic...

I only speak American English, but pretty sure "please let me know if I've got the wrong end of the stick" is inviting (especially @Kiwi_Roy) to suggest edits or ammendments to the diagram changes. I see both the "RH Assay" and "LH Assay" on the diagram referring to the handlebar switchgear. "Assay = "assy" = "assembly?" (My English translated Owners Manual wiring diagram refers to those as "RH device" and "LH control device.")

Thread drift noted and approved. Continue the story...

Yeah, I tried that with some wild chick I dated in college and it didn't work, either . . .

@stewgnu has drawn up another wiring diagram with emphasis on the relays and the relay addition to address "Startus Interuptus". He'll be along to clarify and comment on the purpose.

What makes people thing these "special kit" ecu's and their "special mapping" are so "special". Ducati Termi kit ecu's were rubbish and just added fuel everywhere and you paid big bucks for the privilege of getting nothing. It was 99% marketing and feel good factor. This one has an extra 200rpm, big deal, it's a rounding error change. All ecu mapping is one big compromise as it's designed to work globally with different fuels and safe on all bike variables. Mapping a std ecu on an individual bike on a dyno is the only way to truly optimise the mapping. You can get decently close swapping custom maps but never optimal for each particular bike on local fuel. I've compared the std 2000 V11 mapping and the "Titanium" mapping and the only difference I can see is the Titanium mapping from 4000rpm and 36.8 degrees of throttle has between 3 and 5 deg more ignition advance, that's it. The rpm limit is the same as the std 2000 V11 Sport map. Massive waste of money from what I can see. Ciao

^^^^

Haha - well, I am down to three functioning bikes now. But there are always interesting options out there.

well.. um.. he can't seem to stop buying motorcycles

Is there nothing this guy can't do? A great motorcycle rider, an accomplished mechanic, an excellent story teller, a spring manufacturing production manager (with global reach), and now a published author. Wow.