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I love my 2008 2V Norge, have had it since new, and it's a spectacular machine. I also love my 2015 4V/8V Griso, also had it since practically new with just a few hundred miles on it. Both are outstanding bikes. Mileage wise...I get about 40-42 mpg on the Norge consistently and 42 MPG on the Griso, although having recently put on a Termignoni pipe, for some reason I'm now getting 45 mpg...not sure why yet...but it sounds great, and getting better MPG...why should I complain? Both bikes are set up for touring with side bags, tank bag and rear bag/case. Both are running Beetle maps and are properly tuned with Guzzidiag and regular maintenance which is spectacularly easy to do. If I had to describe the difference, I would say the 2V engine has to work just a bit harder at higher speeds, but is an all day bike and loves to run, never gets tired, it does like higher octane gas or preferably ethanol free or Top Tier gas. The 8V engine has gobs of spare power, lopes along very easily so you're never really using all of its capability. The "sweet spot" on the 2V engine is around 4k rpm, the sweet spot on the Griso is 5K and above. Norges are spectacular touring bikes...you will need to customize it a bit with the proper windscreen, seat, possibly Helibar risers on the earlier models, maybe lowered foot pegs (not too low or it will bump into the side stand). Both models are keepers, if you're truly interested in a Norge, and you're reasonably mechanically inclined, it would depend more on the quality of the bike cosmetically and mechanically that would make the difference in buying between the 2V or 4V models, but I do give the 4V a slight edge in terms of performance. Prices are very reasonable on both models. Range wise...the Norge easily gets 220 on a tank...one time I stretched it to about 240...I was on fumes by then. The Griso I believe has a gallon less, so 160-180 is probably realistic...I usually tank up around 150...have never pushed it to the limit completely. Either way, by then I'm ready for a stretch!

"looks like the beginning of a beautiful relationship"

BMW, putting the flat in flatulent for 102 years yes, I own a 1250RS

I really liked the look of the R9T Racer and sounds like yours is just so mate....Nice But yeah, no BMW has the soul / character of a Guzzi! Cheers

I've often thought that if I were able to have a second bike it'd be a big ( ish ) single. A 500 Bullet but they discontinued them so maybe a Himalayan 450 or even the newer 650 twin in teal which bears a passing resemblance to a bullet. Or a Triumph 400 single or a Vitpilen 401 ...I kinda like these especially in white! Any of these would be great for a wee blat round the back-roads here which are remarkably like UK country lanes / roads. All conjecture I'm afraid as the minister wouldn't have a bar of it..... Cheers

@PJPR01 That's a pretty glowing review! Especially considering you have that Gold Wing. There is one 50 miles away from me for sale, looks very nice. When the weather improves I plan on a Stelvio run to see it. I don't see it as a fast mover, saleswise. I was surprised how many I saw at the National Rally, from all over. I don't think I have ever seen one around here on the road. A woman who is well known in the rally circles won Longest Distance award. She rode from New Hampshire on her Norge. If I remember correctly there was a husband/wife team that rode one each there.

I think my definitive guide to rollerisation is posted here. It covers which models the factory say were flats but experience says some later than listed 2012 engines were still flat tappet. I’ve never heard of a 2013 plated bike with flats. In my experience unless a flat tappet motor is really ‘Ridden to Death’ rollerisation fixes the problem safely and effectively. For the layman I would say yes, seek out a post-‘12 model but as someone who has more experience than most of this issue I would say there is nothing to fear from a flattie engined bike as long as it was addressed when first the problem was detected via either noise or inspection. If it’s just some poorly maintained and neglected dunger that has been owned by Cletus the pig-f*cker and maintained by his seven toed cousin from the next holler over I’d say run a mile but there are numerous ‘Tell Tales’ that are easily checked on inspection that will enable you to easily identify if it’s likely to be a ‘Good-‘un’ or a ‘Bad-‘un’. Probably time I did a proper write up on that. Personally my opinion is that if you’ve ridden a properly tuned and mapped 8V you’d never look at a 2V the same way again.. And don’t get all ‘In my face’ over the odd numbering nomenclature. It’s just the way it is. Get over it. Even I’ve managed to…..

Bit like mine ... Sulking under cover in the carport! I wasn't gunna ride in 40 degree heat last week so she'll have to wait till next one for a gallop. And you wouldn't read about it, it's 13 and raining today! You can't say we lack variety in weather down here eh, so fingers crossed I get a ride in next week. Cheers Cheers

I just put that through deepL.com, just for fun to see what comes out. This was translated as this and putting that back through to English, it gave me this Funnier in German, but still good in English, I reckon.

Owned a 2014 Norge and had it for around three years before I moved on to a Stelvio. If your leggy you might find the cockpit a little snug but these machines are much better in the twisties than what many riding acquaintance's had thought. Very good all day high speed touring tool IMHO. I did a beetle flash and left everything else factory stock. Ciao

Curious on the comparison between the two from a riders perspective. I've owned a 4V, 2008 and am looking at getting another Norge and thought I'd ask the group about it. The cam issue aside, any input between the two ? Thanks !

Yeah, that’s it.

Seven months to South'n Spine raid XXI . . . no pressure. Hey, but pressure is what "pressure angles" do best!

Not at that price! It is a looker though. I know it is completely different from the top of the line Stelvio, but compare rider's aids and electronics. Any bike made today for over 20k could at least have blind spot warning. That is a safety feature I love in my cars and would be a great addition to any new motorcycle. To my knowledge, even the new RT doesn't have that. Moto Guzzi does.

Lots of different flavours available, not only manufacturer but type. I have a similar mod on one of mine, now redundant as a H4 LED bulb is installed. I just used some spare Panasonic mini relays I had to hand (similar in size and form factor as the OEM relays on the bike). As long as they are 12V and 20A or greater current capacity with a normally open contact they'll be more than up to the job. Diodes on the relay coils shouldn't be necessary for the application. What I would do is what @audiomick already suggested and purchase not only relays but also bases. Makes the job neater, the terminals more secure and if anything went wrong a damm site easier to change out.

Depends on what 8 valve model you chose. The 2010-2013 had the notorious flat tappet issues and even if they have been rollerised a later model would be a safer bet. Remember if it's a flat tappet engine then it's going to fail guaranteed. I think either 2012 or 2013 was the last model from the factory with the flat tappet engine. Phil

@WeegieNow thats what I like. Bang for the buck for a beautiful machine. Nice gem for the road!

That's quite funny! Well...a British Flat = A European/American Apartment...I can see why the Translation engine didn't quite work as planned. The Orange Bomber/Beemer looks great...would love to drive one and see how it sounds. A friend at work has one of the limited edition or anniversary edition R9T's...lovely bike....it's a pity it's only used as a commuter bike, never for longer rides. Maybe we'll see one of these Orange BMW's around town...next week is a Guzzi Demo day at a local dealership...maybe someone will ride in on a Beemer to test ride a Guzzi!

Another penny dropped a couple of hours ago, probably the last one on this topic. Initially, it was the low beam playing funny buggers, then @Tennitragic swapped the green wires on the relays. After that, it was the high beam with the peculiar behavior. As long as it was the low beam playing up, it was likely the fuel sensor providing the path back to the battery minus. In the high beam part of the wiring loom, between the high/low switch and the headlight, or the way the wiring is now the new relays, there is also a connection to earth through the high beam indicator on the dashboard. With the green wires on the relays swapped so that the high beam was playing up, both the fuel sensor and the high beam indicator provide a potential path to "earth". I'm now content to believe that there is no fault as such in the wiring, but merely "weak spots" that only showed up because of the incorrect connection of that one green wire to plus instead of minus.

Brilliant. Now I just have to figure out how to translate that appropriately for the German forum.

Somehow, she looks sulky and bored to tears.

I've got an 2017 R9T Racer, picked it up about 3 years back for £7k with less than 3k miles, thought it wasn't a bad deal So far I've had no problems and really like it, good linear midrange, but IMHO they aren't as engaging as the Guzzis, a little less soul. The stock suspension is pretty dire, replaced the rear shock with a Wilbers unit and an Ohlins cartridge kit in the forks, transformed the bike The other thing I miss is the exhaust note, I've got a Zard on mine, so it's louder than stock, but the exhaust note is flat and monotone. The riding position on the Racer is pretty extreme, radical clip ons and stretched over the tank. That doesn't appear to be the case though with the R12 I know nothing of the R12S but I do really like the looks, the grumblings on the Beemer forum I'm on is mainly the price. A few have purchased one, but yet to see an owner's report. My Racer, its beem modified a little since the pictures, nothing too radical though

Not until they sort out the saggy tits.

Future? That looks retro to me. They are cool, but I don't think a 230cc bike would sell well here. A 400cc - 500cc single would be a better option. The wife and I own two smaller bikes, a pair of Husqvarna 401's. They are great fun to ride. But I am glad they are as big as the are engine wise, I don't think I would enjoy them nearly as much if they were 230cc. In fact, I wish they used the larger KTM single. Even KTM realized they needed more power, as this year that line of bikes gets a longer stroke and more torque. The new ones also get a better dash, ours have a dash that is nearly useless, and they get a larger gas tank it seems. An extra gallon of gas is huge when it only holds 2.4 gallons to begin with. It sucks having to fill up every 100 miles or so.

Hi all, picture of my Scura S608 - proud owner and still going strong on trackdays 💪

Worth 12 minutes of your time. Phil

My somewhat educated opinion is if I was buying a Norge I would rather buy the 8V version. But that is in part driven by already owning a 2V Griso. The 8V engine is not exactly the pinnacle of design engineering, but it does make more power then the older 2V engine and in a more interesting way from what I understand. It does tend to get worse fuel mileage than the 2V engine, it seems to lack the combustion efficiency of the 2V engine, so if fuel mileage is more important to you then power that could be a consideration. But for me I can't imagine wanting to ride more than 160 miles before stopping anyway. I get that some do, but I need an occasional stop, might as well be for fuel.

A quick look at photos of 1977 Le Mans seems to backup your memory. Anyhow, having those upper tubes protruding so much is odd.

I do not remember the forks protruding so far above the upper triple. Later forks? This is one that would have to be thoroughly inspected in person.

The Stray Cats were so "out of the box." Brian Setzer, man!