Weegie

I'll wait until the replacements arrive and when they do I'll measure all 4 primary and secondary then post them up

Phil was helping me out and setting me straight with this, but I thought it ought to be brought to the attenion of any of those you unfortunate enough to have one of these engines and needing to check the cam timing because the manual is (how shall I put this) ambiguous On the cams for the Daytona RS (non US & Singapore) Page 84 This tells you to go to 69.5 degrees on the exahust After BDC for 1mm of lift I'm ASSuming "feeler" is dial gauge and "induction" is lift as also added in there just to spice it up some more Fig 11.51 clearly shows the Degree Wheel at 69.5 degrees After BDC. (just to re-enforce the point) I just dread to think some poor RS owner out there taking bike to shop (let's say for belts change that ends up a little pear shaped).....................................mechanic gets web manual and religously does it to the book!! Checking out Page 89 on that page they give me 2 sets of cam timings for the RS version (non US & Singapore) & none for the RS version (US & Singapore). Clearly the Centauro and RS for US & Singapore are the same so the top timing diagram refers to these models & the bottom diagram refers to the RS (non US & Singapore) Looking at the bottom diagram and text on Page 89 Cam timing Exhaust Lift (1mm) 63.5 degrees Before BDC Inlet Closes (1mm) at 69.5 degrees After BDC So my best guess is To set the Cams Establish TDC on each of the cylinders Obtain 63.5 degrees engine rotation on each cylinder Before BDC & check for 1mm of lift on the relevant Exhaust Cam Follower/Pushrod If anybody else knows different please come and correct my stupidity, I've spent a good bit of time trying to make any sense of the instructions and when I finally did (thanks to Phil) I then find it's wrong

Closing this out as it's not going anywhere I got a spare set of BAE 850s off a Ducati from the Bay of Fleas, cost me as much to ship over the pond as the price of the coils, but at least I've got a couple of spares Should you need them, don't limit your search to Guzzis, Ducati used them and probably some of the other Italian suspects to

Primary for normal coils that I'm used to on Tontis and the like are usually a lot higher 5 Ohms, Guzzis don't need really fast saturation time AFAIK. There is still the perrenial threads about Dynas burning out with 3.0 Ohm coils on the older bikes However perhaps these coils are a different design but with no information I haven't a clue. Seems though a lot of modern coils seem to have lower primaries.

Gotcha docc I see on the data sheet that the switching load is 35A but the rated load is 20A, that's sorta misleading

docc, going off topic for a second Just asking a question, why are the Panasonic underated? I haven't when through the whole spec, but providing the Panasonic are the sealed type, which look like the type Grim has, both relays are rated for the same same loads 35A NO 20A NC

No Dave I tried searching and couldn't find any spec sheets, all I can measure would be the Primary and secondary coils, but they seem a bit of a mystery It's not a biggie it was just a thought that perhaps somebody had replaced a set with Dynas or the like John

Just wondered if anybody put anything different onto their bikes in place of the stock BAE 850 coils. I'm relocating the coils from their original position up at the front of the bike in an attempt to install a larger oil cooler on a Magni Australia (Hi Cam engine identical to the Daytona RS and Centauro). The only suitable place I can find is at the rear of the bike above where the rear shock is. They are going to be a bit of pain to fit due to their shape and one has a broken shroud on the LV plug, so I thought about replacing them They work well enough but measuring primary resistance I got 0.6 Ohms which is very low. John

Thanks Phil. I still wonder what the manual is trying to tell me?? Common sense indicated that would be the way to go and the confirmation is much appreciated John

Phil Looking at your build thread it appears, although I'm asking the question really, that what you did is as I stated, and looked at the exhaust valve lift in relation to valve timing, or was it when it came off the cam? Either way if for example the exhaust cam position is checked relative to the crank, then both inlet and exhaust are fixed for that cylinder. Then move on and do the other side. I don't think that's beyond me just need to purchase a dial gauge and a clamp or mag base (which won't work on a Aluminuim block but I could build up something to sit close to the cam), which I'll do. As it's not a huge job to get into the belts and cams, I think I'll just build the engine up and try it again. If after the intended mods it's still overheating then I can strip it off to get to the belts and check the valve timing. If I can relocate the coils it also relieves me of the tedious task of having to take the coils and their mounting bracket on & off. No clue if it's the same as Guzzi's approach but on the Australia it's a Heath Robinson designed PIA. I already know about the verniers on the cams and I agree it's elegant, but they aren't something to be messed with unless you have the right equipment and more importantly know exactly what you're doing John

Hi Marty Thanks for the input. I really know nothing about any of these variables in regard to this engine. It's a stock Daytona RS HiCam engine, running a 16M ECU as those bikes do. Ignition timing is governed by the Phonic Wheel and it's not possible to alter that AFAIK as it installs onto the Jackshaft (or service shaft as Guzzi call it) using dowels. Injection is the same (fixed by the wheel & map) apart from balancing each side, which is easy to do. Valve timing is whole different ball game and looking at the manual, I struggle to understand what it's trying to tell me. I could probably do it although I'll need to purchase some dial gauges and mag bases. Phil might help guide me, I'd have thought all I would have needed is to determine crank angle using a degree wheel and dial gauges on the cams to see max lift on either inlet or exhaust at the appropriate crank angle for each cylinder, but if that's what the manual is telling me it's bloody long winded. When it did overheat on me, it certainly didn't seem to lose any pep and was still pulling well on the way back home, after letting the engine cool somewhat. The plugs looked fine and didn't show any leaness, as for the headers TBH I never looked, besides they are now Ceramic coated. Now Need to think some more about my next course of action now

Thanks guys in that case I'll just leave it be I wonder if anybody else has any other data on pressures. It's not really a biggie now as I know that the pressure is good and I can get back to putting it together rather than tearing it to pieces Phil and Chuck you both have been a fantastic help and stopped me spending countless fruitless hours doing surgery I didn't need to Just got to build it back up again, get the front subframe back on then relocate the coils so as I can install a larger cooler (well that's the plan). Still a lot of work but if this lockdown ends the bike might see the light of day before the riding season finishes (and I get too old to ride the damm thing) John

It would appear so Phil I looked on the other head nothing. Then checked it with a thin piece of bicycle cable and it appears closed but still deeper than I'd like and the cable bottoming is no guarantee that it still isn't a leak path Any ideas on sealing, you think JB Weld would be sufficient or is a head removal and strip in my future? John

I'm not holding out much hope here as very few mount a pressure gauge onto their bikes or even test it. However if anybody out there has information from their motorcycle I'd be interested. This all started with a HiCam I have and was related to both overheating and oil pressure, anybody who frequents Wild Goose should be well aware of the problem as I've posted about it until everybody there is sick to the back teeth with it.......................so I came here . I can't be bothered going into the details about the overheating, but I thought the overheating and low pressure were linked, now I'm starting to think that the low pressure isn't a problem at all and for close to 2 years I've been chasing a ghost. Recently I've gained a little more information, but its left me with a whole raft of questions that leave me baffled and confused. Lucky Phil came onto WG and started to assist, nothing definitve came of that, except I gained a lot more knowledge about these engines and I'm grateful for all his insight and time that he invested. Starting from what I'm used to 2 valve engines 4 bar (58 psi) relief pressure, cold oil idle 65 psi or a little above (I assume the relief valve gets overwhelmed and pressure builds a bit over the valve setpoint) Hot running above 3k approx high 50s or low 60s psi Hot idle 15-10 psi usually Hi Cam 5 bar (72 psi) relief pressure (larger oil pump), cold idle 50-54 psi Cold to 3k, approx 70 psi (that test was done on a stationary engine and turning the pump with a drill, from experience it doesn't matter much if the engine is rotating or not) No hot data to speak of right now, as the bike was only run once and was overheating so I haven't got a data point where the temperature reached an equilibrium So I start to chase the missing pressure, the relief valve is set higher and I'm at least 10 lower perhaps 15 psi. I'll let Kevin_T chime in if he wants to give his side but he stated on page 5 of Phil's HiCam build thread he never seen the pressure higher that 53psi on a Centauro (another C kitted HiCam) Then fortuitously a buddy tests his Hi Cam engine, all of these HiCams are C kitted, just for completeness Cold idle 52-53psi Blip on cold to 3k approx 70psi (actual running engine) Let it get warm (but not stabilised just for a few minutes till the heads are warm, perhaps 10 minutes idling) 48psi One more thing, When I removed the rocker carriers (which also locate the cam followers) and left the head oil feed holes to the rocker exposed then cranked the bike the oil pressure on the gauge dropped from 50psi to 32, cold oil. These feeds do not appear to me to be that large, so the 18psi drop was a surprise. The green arrows are the exposed feeds I wonder is the pressure I'm seeing system wide or is the pressure switch tapping point I'm measuring the pressure from badly placed, it never was after all meant to really represent true system pressure. The take for me is there probably nothing wrong with the pressure on my engine but I'm left wondering why the readings are so low. The V11 went back from the Hi Cam's 21mm lobe pump to a 16mm but drives at a higher Crank/pump ratio and I hope to get some data on that soon Anybody who had data they could add would be of interest to me and possibly to others .

Could not agree more with both Lucky Phil and Pete Roper's posts Although Joe and me often correspond (got a mail this morning from him) I have no skin in the game whatsoever. Steel is the only way to go for material, Pete's seen countless wrecked engines with alloy gears and I've had a few acquaintences over the years send me photos of their personal horror stories. I installed gears as I preferred the simplicity of design (although designing a gear set is a far from simple process), it was something less to think about, no lash, no adjuster to check etc: Standard setup works very well there is no denying that, so in the end you pays your money and takes your choice

I have Joe's gears in a Sporti 1100, LM 1000 engine and in a HiCam. The HiCam engine currently has issues totally unrelated to the gearset at the moment. I know of a few others who have them installed too, and never heard anything but positive things said. Apart from the cost, Joe's gears are more expensive than a lot want to pay. IMHO Joe's gears are the only viable alternative to chain sets, and after emailing him a lot over the years I can personally vouch for him Anyway this might also help if you want to enquire https://woodburymotomedia.com/moto-guzzi-timing-gears-by-joe-caruso/ John

Even though it's not revving hard I think I've got a flavour of it, sounds really really good. Can imagine that given some throttle it would be real howl, thanks for that. Of course this has now really got me thinking

Beautiful bike & of course the pipes just look amazing the way they curve and swoop Got any video? It would be nice to hear how it sounds

Why Thank You Kelly that is so kind of you to go to the effort of posting up and thanking me for the gearbox article. The gearbox isn't difficult, the hardest parts are getting these dammed nuts off the back and front after that its no harder than a Meccano set (if you're old enough to remember Meccano) I'm no mechanic just a bodger, guy's like Lucky Phil and Chuckee are the real artisans and both of them have been more than generous with their time and perhaps other members I still need to get to know For electrical issues Kiwi Roy is my main man and I see he's here too. At the moment I'm looking at a low pressure issue on the Oz's HiCam engine that's being going on forever. Now I have a plan of action, based on Phil's advice. In 2 or 3 weeks time after having completed these checks I've got to make a decision on should I tear it to pieces myself or ship the engine down to a trusted engine builder and just let him get on with it. John

Lol I'm starting to feel at home already. Phil & docc, just stop it, I know about these exhuasts and they are stunning, always fancied them. Now you've got me wondering, don't know if Magni's still up and trading right now. Perhaps I'll drop him a mail Hi Tim, well the 1100 might just have stopped leaking since you seen it. Chuckee, no real story, posted as Old Jock on WG as it was a brew in my local, a pint of which would stun a horse. Weegie is a shortening of Glaswegian used by residents of that other city to the east of us (capital of Scotland) and isn't a term of endearment Phil your correct of course on the Australia (or Oz as I irrevantly know it as) I think Ted Stolarski was a dealer and racing them in the 80s or 90s and when Magni brought out the bike it was named the Australia in Ted's honour. 2 batches built First in 93, I think 75-80 built used a tubular frame similar to Sfida 1000s and Forcelle Italia forks. The engine was the standard Daytona Hi Cam Second in 98, around 50 built, used the beam frame like Guzzi's Daytona and Sporti (and the Sfida 1100 and Sfida 1000 4V) and Paioli forks. The engine was a C kitted Hi Cam identical to the Daytona RS They planned a far larger production run but Guzzi couldn't provide them with the HiCams hence the low numbers John

Thankyou so much to everybody, to docc for providing the link, to Phil (whose already educating me big time on the HiCam engines) and to everybody else kind enough to pop in and welcome me Looking forward to getting to know you all So the Red Headed Step Child that is proving to be a bit of a challenge, when she's fully clothed which she hasn't been for some time The other bike shown there is a Sfida 1100 just a Sporti given the Magni treatment. Probably not his most attractive design, but eye catching nonetheless......possibly a love hate design. I've had people tell me it's an abomination and others that it's good looking (in a strange way), reminds me of some girls I went out with. I've added a few farkles to the 1100, which probably hasn't done much to improve it John

So after being on WildGoose forever I thought I'd come on here, I post as Old Jock on WG, but went for a change of moniker Don't own a V11 so what the hell am I doing here? Well I've got a bike with a HiCam engine in it that's giving me endless trouble and may be getting another, glutton for punishement I was attracted by the legend that is Lucky Phil, I see some other of the "usual suspects" too and some of the technical topics on here are first class As I couldn't find an introduction section I just thought I'd post up here and introduce myself. John