Kiwi_Roy

Yes use all the same 5 pin variety. There are many brands of the same relay, it's a standard automotive configuration, I'm sure the Panasonics are just as good, The Omrons are either made in USA or Italy. Over on the Wild Guzzi Forum Johnr lives in Invercargill, he probably has some stories about Burt Growing up in NZ we used to hear stories about the crazy old coot and his Indian, but he was a bit before my time. You can find a lot of information and pictures just by googling Bert Munro I grew up in Wanganui, we had Percy and Rod Coleman of IOM fame.

Tom, are you saying there are four different bearings on the one bike? Sent from my shoe phone!

Welshguzzi, I'm sure the air temperature sensor sees abnormally hot temperature when parked with a hot engine but as soon as the bike starts to run the fresh air should cool the sensor down, check to see if it's still in the airbox where it should be. Its only if you do away with the airbox the sensor should be re-located. You can measure the sensors from the ECU connector. with a cold motor air and oil temperature will be roughly the same.

I know they are common bearings, everyone should have a set available even if you have no intention of changing them out yourself. Lets start a list of the different bearings required so we can have them on hand. I tried a simple search but I couldn't see one. Don't just go from memory, I know mine gets the bikes mixed up. If you are about to or have recently changed a bearing list it here somewhere along with the year and model front or back, head race etc.

If you ride in the rain or pressure wash the bike they may only last a couple of tire changes They are so cheap they should be changed with tires I reckon. On a trip last summer I noticed an intermittent squawking noise, I finally figured it was from the front wheel The bike was one I bought in Denver and rode back to BC I rode 60 miles back to a bike shop to find a bearing, it felt fine with just 1-1/2 bearings, now I always cary one on a trip. http://s1304.photobucket.com/user/Kiwi_Roy/slideshow/Misc%20Pics/Wheel%20Bearing BTW, I didn't butcher the pinch bolt they are all new now.

I guess I should have said the relays numbered from the front of the bike Relay 1 - Start - this must be a 5 pin as the normally closed contact 87A powers up the headlight relay either directly to terminal 30 or the relay coil, it turns off the headlight while the bike is cranking Relay 2 - Headlight - this powers the light of course but also the tacho, idiot lights and most important the Voltage regulator for charging Relay 3 - Side-stand/Neutral - must be energized unless you have the stand shorted out in which case it serves no purpose, (some models of Guzzi use the normally closed contact) Relay 4 - ECU - this turns the brain on Relay 5 - Injection - this powers up the injectors, pump, coils All the spine frame bikes I have seen have the relays in that order but Luigi might have swapped some around to make it interesting. If you look into the relay sockets you will see the un-used pins are empty The relays are a standard automotive product made by many manufacturers, and used in various vehicles, I have seen them in Jeeps for instance.

Buy all 5 pin relays, the only slot that requires 5 is the start relay but they work in all slots so you can move them around I guess Guzzi saved maybe 10c per relay when they used 4 Yes the Z2247-NDs from Digikey are Omrons, The last batch I bought were made in Italy, the Guzzi can hardly reject those. Keep the old relays they are good for projects like headlight relays, horn relays or just plain spares. BTW a bit further back about the temperature sensor, remember if you take the airbox off to fit pods you need to re-locate the sensor or it will get super hot sitting with the heat from the engine, I extended mine up to the headstock area where its in the breeze and doesn't sit there cooking if the bike is parked with a hot engine, that must mess the mixture up if you re-start and the sensor is measuring very hot air.

How would I know if they are OEM or not, I doubt Bosch make their own brushes, it's a specialty business. http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=37_161&products_id=598 Brushes do come in different grades depending on the application, I will try another source. It may be something common to all the Bosch alternators, I am pushing it to the limits with heated vest & gloves about 60 Watts from memory It's not a problem I am really concerned about, I only posted it in case someone else was noticing a shortage of Amps Without running heated gear it would probably not be noticed. Those look like the real deal http://www.euromotoelectrics.com/Bosch-Alternator-Brush-Kit-BMW-R-Airhead-p/boalt-brushesx2.htm

Out of curiosity I took another look at the alternator last evening (remember it was only showing the first sign of weakness) the ground brush was dropping 298mV but the positive brush was dropping 670mV, after touching up the rings with emery this dropped to 88 & 100 mV. Now I cut my teeth on AC & DC machinery but I don't have a good explanation for the high initial Voltage drop. Cheap Chinese brushes? Something plating out on the positive slipring? Update: I posted the problem on an electrical forum, one of the electric motor Gurus posted the following. "Not so long ago, low Voltage rectifiers were built from copper with a thin oxide layer. And ordinary brushes in DC motors are known to have a slight rectifying property. That is probably what you are seeing" It's interesting, I have never heard about this but the guy who responded has forgotten more than I will ever know :-). I may try a different brush material see if it does the same.

As Zooter says, something like an EV is much more comfortable and easier to ride. The Daytona is a wild beast in comparison Welcome to the forum

MG Cycle brushes - they look pretty normal but I may swap them out, I just posted it as another thing to check for Sent from my shoe phone!

The charging was dropping off on my California II. it wouldn't maintain Voltage with my heated vest on so I took some measurements. I found the front-most brush had about 1 Volt drop from slipring to the brush (new brushes recently) so the alternator was not getting fully exited, there seemed to be some sort of insulating film on the rings. I applied some fine emery paper to the rings while idling, it fixed the problem for a hundred miles or so but I see it starting to re-occur. This is a high mileage bike 107,000, I'm wondering if the front seal is leaking slightly and coating up the rings. The bike doesn't need to be running to check the Voltage drop, just turn the key On. Measure the Voltage across the two brush leads then measure the Voltage between the sliprings, we can compare notes.

The temperature thermistors can be had from www.Digikey.com part No BC2730-ND for a few cents each, I bought 20 but I have given most of them away already. Actually the thermistor you need is 3,000 Ohms at 25°C Vishay part No NTCLE203E3302SB column 2 on page 3 of the datasheet.

Just blindly replacing stuff is no way to troubleshoot, use a simple step by step method. A small light bulb attached to a pair of wires is a great troubleshooting tool, better in many ways than an expensive meter. A 12 Volt LED is the best because it won't get broken like a glass bulb, I usually carry one on my bike when traveling. Always test your light by touching the battery first. Assuming your failure to start is the starter not turning over. Attach the bulb to chassis and to a point somewhere in the start circuit for example to the 85 pin of the start relay, then you will see it lights whenever you press Start. Next time it fails to start look at the light, if it's not On you know where to focus, back towards the start button. If it is on then you move to a different location perhaps 87 of the start relay or the solenoid trigger terminal. You can also use your lamp as a crude Voltmeter to check the battery Voltage while trying to crank, if it appears to be flat make sure you also try it on the negative terminal, this will pick up a bad ground. (an LED might be a bit tricky there because the polarity would be wrong) A word about my favorite LED from www.superbrightleds.com the type 194 specifically WLED-R-90 substitute G, A or B for R depending on the colour you need. Why do I like this one? It has a bridge rectifier built into the base so you don't have to worry about polarity, the rectifier takes care of that. If you are building a panel all you need to do is drill a hole and glue it in from the back, it doesn't need a lampholder. It glues nicely into the V11 idiot light system eliminating those flakey rubber lamp holders.

Won't start is not giving us much to go on. Do you get a click from the start relay? Do you get a clunk from the starter solenoid? Have you measured the battery Voltage while trying to start? Have you measured the Voltage across the starter itself? Does the headlight go out when you press start? Have you wiggled the bars from Lock to Lock? (bullet connectors on the clutch switch under tank)

60 billion sheep can't be wrong

When you get the tank off pull out the ECU relays 4 & 5 then find the bullet connectors (59) Check they are clean and tight, they have a bad reputation. http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/1999_V11_sport.gif the 2004 shows the same wiring so chances are the 2002 is the same. When you turn the key on and press start you should get 12 Volts at the LH bullet connector Then check the clutch switch it will be open circuit until you pull the clutch in then should read From the RH connector you should be able to read the resistance of the start coil to chassis, about 100-120 Ohms. Why did you pull the 2 ECU relays? Trust me, there's lots of gas left in the fuel pump, I know I have sprayed it around several times, taking the relays out disables the pump.

Footgoose, your Guzzi is fine, there are a few minor problems with charging that's all. The regulator is not well grounded I recommend adding a no 12 wire between the regulator case and a bolt on the engine. Some experience overcharging due to excessive Voltage drop between the battery positive terminal and regulator black wire. (Normally about 0.6 Volts) The Ducati Energia regulator draws about 15 milliamperes on the black wire so it's connected after the headlight relay so it doesn't run the battery flat. After market regulators directly connected to the battery draw less than 1 milliamp but even that will flatten the battery over the winter, if you ride the bike every week or two no need to disconnect, I pull mine off over winter.

Yes Start relay to headlight relay, the regulator taps into the red/black wire half way along the tank (lets call it the Tap Point) then I think it splits again one wire going to the connector on the left, one wire going to connector on right, The (Tap Point) is where the Voltage is held to about 13.8 Volts by the regulator so if you change the headlight bulb for a higher Wattage the battery has to put out more Voltage to achieve 13.8 at the Tap Point. By the same token if you take load off the headlight circuit e.g. with separate headlight relays fed from the battery the battery Voltage drops to 13.8 Volts. Adding two relays powered from the battery into the headlight bucket is one way of reducing the Voltage drop across the switch and tiny wires to and fro, I reckon my light went up about 20% The other option which I prefer is to tap into the wire from headlight relay by the LH connector and run it to a single relay in the bucket. Energize the relay for High, default back to Low Use one of your old relays. There is a switched battery Voltage source, Relay 4 the ECU there's very little load on that relay and the regulator black wire only draws about 15 milliamps. If you add a diode in series it will boost the Voltage up from 13.8 to 14.4, don't even think about it with a direct connected type. Relay No 3 is probably spare on your bike (if you have done away with stand switch), it could be used between a direct connect regulator and battery Yes, removing the start relay from the headlight circuit can be done, if you elect to go with two relays in the bucket powered direct from the battery it's not necessary as the Voltage drop is now low. With just one relay it's not as simple because the Start relay is powered direct from the battery via a fuse, the headlight would stay On with the key Off Most Guzzis feed the Start relay from the ignition switch, that is stupid IMHO because the start solenoid draws about 50 Amps as it slams the starter into mesh, that's what causes Startus Interuptus in all other guzzis right to the latest model. None of the schematics show the solenoid correctly, it has two coils, one draws 40 Amps, the other 10 Amps.

Danl, I tried unscrewing the holder with no luck, I got so mad I grabbed it and wrenched, popped right out. Spray a little soapy water around the grommet, that might help.

Phill, as you have seen the Voltage drop through the headlight relay (it must be about 1 Volt) is causing the overcharging because the regulator thinks the battery is flat so it cranks up the charge. On my 2001 V11 Sport the headlight current also passes through the normally closed contact of the start relay (most bikes use that contact to just feed the headlight relay coil) Eventually it will take care of itself by melting the diode leads off inside the regulator then you will have an under charging issue. charging current to Voltage is some sort of exponential relationship I found just wiggling the relays in their sockets caused the Voltage to drop back to normal (about 0.6) One option is to add headlight relays powered direct from the battery bypassing the existing wiring so you don't get the Voltage drop Or fit a direct connected regulator like the Electrosport. then put a single relay in the headlight bucket to select High/Low filament, you will notice a significant increase in brightness.

I also run the Omron GH8N-1C2T-R-DC12 the Z2247-ND is just a number that Digikey add to it for their purposes. The last batch I got were made in Italy so the Guzzi can hardly reject those eh! When you order relays consider purchasing a couple of microswitches Digikey CH290-ND Cherry part No DC1C-A1AA, they are not an exact match for the clutch & brake but pretty close. www.digikey.com in the search box Z2247-ND or CH290-ND Radio Shack used to stock a microswitch with a roller lever, tear the lever off and it works too, that's what I have on my clutch at the moment, it's not waterproof but refuses to die.

I was working on my bike so I tried, yes you have to wiggle and pull hard, the grommets are fitted into tabs welded to the chassis so no fear of breaking those.

Craig beat me to it Sent from my shoe phone!

Zooter, when I went to school in Aotearoa we still had dental nurses, they would often give you a few drops of Hg in a drill box. You took it back to class and dropped it on the floor. I guess that explains my odd behaviour eh! Sent from my shoe phone!