Kiwi_Roy

Just when we think you are on the way it starts to play up again. The fact that the sidestand switch doesn't allways work could well be a problem, it might mean that the ECU relay is dropping out check that out for sure, if you pull relay 3 and wrap a strand of bare wire around the two large pins this should short it out or jamb a short wire in the socket. I show a test lamp connected to the old petcock fuse to monitor the safety circuit I was wrong about measuring the voltage at the petcock fuse you need to measure the common Voltage supplied to the coils, injectors and pumps, can you swing your Voltmeter Positive over there either to the positive on a coil or pump or wrapped around the 87 pin of relay 5 ECU Wiring.pdf Check the two fuses and relay 4 & 5 are nice and tight in their sockets. If the Voltage at the coils is ok and it's still misbehaving check also the voltage at pin 87 of relay 4 Check that the ECU pins 23 & 24 are zero Ohms to the battery Negative Pull the seat release lock off and make sure the main battery ground behind it is good and tight. In an earlier post you told us how the bike started playing up after hitting some railroad tracks, at the time we thought it was the regulator, perhaps it was something else loose. The Voltage at the coils may go up or down a little bit with the battery but it should be rock solid. I would also check the way those LEDs are wired, it seems like they may be part of the problem, can you sketch out the changes the PO made? Perhaps the additional load is just too much> Measure the current between the regulator and battery under all different scenarios with the motor at idle and normal speed. The manual says the alternator puts out 350 Watts but thats when new, the magnets get weaker with age.

I would definately check the voltage directly across the coils to chassis, there may be something dropping it there and perhaps the injectors are not opening cleanly as they should, Make sure the ground to the ECU is in good order, I forget which pin it goes to The Petcock fuse would be a good spot to pick up the coil Voltage Pull out the safety relay R3 and short between the 2 contacts just to be sure nothing is dropping the ECU out e.g. Sidestand Switch, I had a problem with mine running rough a year back it was a dirty ignition switch.

Wild Guzzi are back up and have been for weeks What really peed me off on a Recent trip to China the site was filtered out by the great firewall of china

Thanks for the positive feedback, I should mention that I first became aware of it when I came across an old thread from dlaing from December 2005. I have no interest in promoting the Electrosport just trying to help out.

Why are those two things bad? They aren't bad at all if properly done. We know that bad charging is a common issue with the V11s, the ground is almost non existant and the 30 Amp fuse suffers from melt down. Not that these cannot be fixed. What I really find problematic is the way the Ducati Energia senses the battery Voltage downstream of the headlight relay relying on a certain amount of Voltage drop to set the battery Voltage.. After market headlight relays, loose relay socket or additional load play havoc with the Voltage at that point causing the regulator diodes to fry. Connecting the regulator direct to the battery takes a whole lot of variables out of the mix. If you look at the more modern Guzzis this is what they do. http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/2008_California_Vintage.gif This one still shows a fuse, others have eliminated that. http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/2008_Bellagio_940.gif The ESR10 does come with lugs to bolt directly to the battery and an in-line fuse but one could elect to discard it and use the bikes own, just make sure it's in good order first.

Much as I like the original Ducati Energia regulator it has its faults and the design is about 20 years old. I was looking on the Electrosport website, they make regulators for every sort of bike imaginable. They have a pull down menu for selecting the replacement regulator, however this will suggest a direct replacement for the OEM Ducati. The ESR515 in the case of my 01 V11 Sport http://www.electrosport.com/regulatorrectifier-ducati-1-phase-charge-light-output.html This regulator is not exactly like the Ducati, it has modern electronics however it still relies on grounding through the case and uses the bikes original wiring through the 35 Amp fuse. I would like to suggest a different regulator for the single phase Guzzis - The ESR510 http://www.electrosport.com/ducati-single-phase-regulatorrectifier.html This regulator connects directly to the battery positive and negative similar to the later model Guzzis eliminating the problem with bad grounding and Voltage drop across the headlight relay. It also still uses the bikes Charge Light I have engaged in a discussion with Electrosport on this, they agreed the ESR510 is a superior regulator but mentioned some owners are reluctant to do the wiring change. Just one thing I must mention, I have not actually installed one of these yet but with a 1 year warranty, what's to loose? I notice that for some Guzzi models the site recommends a regulator with Molex connectors and what appears to be a 3 phase regulator, As far as I'm aware the V11 Sport and V11Lemans all use the same single phase alternators, perhaps you could give me some feedback on that. Thanks Roy

Good find, I searched all over town looking for red caps and leads, they are unobtanium I finally managed to find some on MG Cycle Can you add the link?

I'd pitch in some money if someone else will research the customs thing. http://www.swva.net/jkenny/ Which ones does he need? I have the later model square head with the through holes myself, just love em

In a diferent picture. My sidestand clip is broken too, you don't need that.

I have an old scratched up pair of head protectors I could send but it would be nice to send our new friend a pair of Joe Kenny's I expect we might have trouble getting them through customs, any ideas? Roy

The hot starting problem is well documented. Suposedly it's vapour lock, the heat from the engine boils the fuel in the tubing under the tank, The pump is not able to pump vapour. There are all sorts of ideas on insulating the piping to prevent this. Hopefully someone can fill you in, here in the Great White North it's not an issue. Ok no one else jumped in, heres one thread on the subject http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=17321&st=0&p=185033&hl=vapor%20lock&fromsearch=1entry185033

This is what I am trying to say Test Lamp Ideas.pdf The first winter project on my V11 Sport was to add LEDs to each relay base It lights up like a tree

If the fuel pump fails to prime it's probably because the ECU is not getting power from the safety circuit. Guzzi Wiring - Simple.pdf There are several things it could be, the side-stand switch a dirty ignition switch or kill switch. A friend with a LeMans found a wire broken off the ignition switch, Using a test lamp If you have the electric petcock you can monitor the safety circuit with a lamp connected between the fuse and chassis. If you don't have an electric petcock pull relay 4 and wrap one lead of the test lamp around the coil pin at TP-f with the other lead to chassis. The side-stand switch on my bike quit a month ago, to get going I just wrapped a bare wire around the 30 & 87 pins of the middle relay. Next time it happens flick the ignition switch a few times, it might be just a dirty contact there

Craig Replacing the panel lamps LED Panel Lamps.pdf http://www.superbrightleds.com/moreinfo/miniature-wedge-base/74-led-bulb-1-led-wedge-base/226/ http://www.superbrightleds.com/moreinfo/empty-bases-sockets/168194-wled-solder-contact-wedge-base-socket/703/963/ I would also add a 1K resistor across the oil pressure light, mine tends to come on when the switch gets wet

It's been arcing away for a while, probably started out as just a little corrosion. Early Honda Goldwings are known for that only they end up smoking the stator which calls for a total strip down. In their case the recommended cure is to chop the connector out and solder the wires together before it happens. As Lucky Phil says, individual bullets are better. I pulled the cover off my alternator, one wire was just hanging on by a single strand. Moto Guzzi, making electricians out of riders for 90 years

The voltage is regulated at 5 Volts as you say. Perhaps the injectors are a bit slugish in opening with low voltage. Cliffs MyECU takes Voltage into account but I don't know about the stock unit. One things fairly certain the mixture seems to be Voltage related. It's very strange for sure.

Craig, Yes there are all sorts of tests can be done, lets start with the simple ones. First check the bike wiring Unplug all the wires from the regulator. Now with your multimeter measure the resistance between the battery positive and the connector where the regulators red wires connect to the loom. - should be very low resistance With key on measure the Voltage on the red/black wire where the regulators black wire plugs in - should be 12+ Volts. Measure the resistance between the two yellow wires coming out of the alternator, should be ~1 Ohm Now the regulator. If you have the diode test function on your multimeter put the red lead on one yellow regulator wire, black lead on the red regulator wire - should read ~ 0.5 Volt, the other yellow should be the same. Report back Roy

I have been saying for a while now, after market headlight relays cause a charging problem with the Ducati Energia. I had no idea it would effect the running in this way. Thanks for the update. Roy

Sorry, I got a bit confused, the thread started and died in 2003 I guess Cash1000 owns it now As Docc says 13.5 is low for 3000 revs, try adding a short ground strap between the regulator case and a timing cover screw, see if that does anything. (scrape the case and put a little grease on the joint to stop it corroding) Do you have after market headlight relays, these can cause a drop in voltage. You must be into riding season down there now eh! Roy

these bikes need good positive voltage to run right. the huge voltage drop can be the reason bike runs bad.. fix it and all the other stuff might fall right in line and work fine. Fotoguzzi I'm slowly coming to that conclusion also. With aftermarket headlight relays the battery looses half a Volt because it no longer benefits from the voltage drop through the standard headlight circuit, (the regulator senses the Voltage downstream of the relay). At one time Ken had a diode added to boost it back up to the normal level. I think this era bike would probably benefit greatly by upgrading the regulator to one of the more modern ones where the connections are made directly to the battery Positive and Negative. Such as this 2004 EV http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/2004_EV_Catalytic.gif However I don't have any direct experience with these regulators, perhaps they also come with their share of baggage. My old girl seems quite happy with any Voltage but I have a MyECU that compensates for Voltage fluctuation, I just assume the stock ones do too.

I have a version that I stripped most of the non English text out of. It's quite a large file but prints out on about half a tree. Send me a PM with your e=mail address i will attempt to send it to you. Roy

That's very interesting, I think you are onto something. The Ducatti Energia regulators I have pulled apart have all been set at 13.8 Volts but with the stock wiring they charge battery to about 14.5 Volts due to Luigi's Voltage drop through the headlight relay I have worked with several owners who were having charging problems but none have mentioned the bad running like that. I believe the bikes ECU compensates somewhat for slight change in Voltage opening the injectors a little bit longer for low and v.v. for high. I also know from experience if the Voltage goes very high (16+ Volts) the ECU will cut right off. Where abouts do you have your Voltmeter connected, directly to the battery posts or somewhere at the headlight bucket? (depending on how it's wired the reading could have a different meaning) Have you added a good ground wire to the regulator case, I can't stress that enough, just a short wire between the case and a timing cover screw. Charging Circuit Problems2.pdf Do you have after market headlight relay/s,? (relays can rob the battery of 0.5 Volt or more because it defeats Luigi's plan) How are your LEDs wired, direct to the battery of some part of the harness? Did anything else happen between running fine and running lousy like a stop and start? Test Point Layout.pdf I suggest you test the resistance of all the switches in particular Note 4, 5 and 8 PM sent

Some Guzzi manuals show the small connection coupled to the manifold which would effectivly cause it to vary fuel flow according to manifold pressure. I think this must have been the case for early injection systems. The injectors operate in the choked flow region not effected by manifold pressure, it's all about how long they are open. As Tom M says, don't connect anything there (I wish Luigi would snip it off)

Yes, I believe so, mine just started playing up also, might be a good opportunity to replace the pawl spring while you have the side cover off.