pete roper

On re-reading I see you are absolutely correct. A misunderstanding on my part fostered by my inate distrust of Journalists who should all be rounded up into football stadiums and shot. Pete (Who also understands that most people feel that way about motorbike mechanics )

This is actually inaccurate and shows the bloke hasn't done his homework very well. The Motor used in the Breva and the Griso does have substantiakl changes over the one used in the V11 and 1100 CAli variants which actually quite surprised me, miserable old cynic that I am The most important thing is that the rod/stroke ratio has been changed. The new motor uses substantially longer rods which will help reduce vibration and other power robbing effects as well as reducing the stresses on the rods themselves and sidethrust on the pistons. The extra length has been coped with by reducing the deck height of the pistons and le reduced side thrust has allowed the use of shorter skirts on the slugs as well. So although the motor is externally dimensionally the same the actual rumpy-pumpy bits inside have changed somewhat. For people who have built revvier Guzzi big blocks in the past one the easiest options was to use the earlier 70mm crank rather than the 78mm item and getting longer rods made by Carillo or someone. Although in terms of outright power the top tuners like Amadeo Castellani found that both short stroke and long stroke motors produced much the same the added torque of the longer stroke crank was more usefull on the track than the over-rev capabillity of the short stroker. With the new configuration one can have the best of both worlds and in a road motor this should be a splendid thing! My one concern really remains the question of whether it will be possible to cam the buggers up a bit? With the 1100 motors the rod big ends pass very, very close to the cam lobes, even with the standard cam, (Very similar to the P3/SS of old.) Going to something with especially more lift may make for bits biffing into each other, such are the limitations of the old block! To my eye though the changes wrought seem like good ones. My assumption is that the twin spark heads have simultaneous firing. staggering the sparks could also pay small dividends but we're talking 'Final Option' type tuning here, even so, it has the potential for fun. I love the fact they've gone for lower gearing! Sorry, but I really don't need a machine that can do over 120mph, in fact I don't really need one that can exceed the 'Ton' by much, having something that goes like a cut cat up to 100mph is far more important to me than theoretical top speeds that rival the space shuttle. If I want to go faster than that I can get in something with 'Boeing' written on the side . Pete

Duh! One thing I was thinking it would need, (For a fat old fart like me who reckons being hung out in the wind has whiskers on it!) would be some sort of screen, or better still a cockpit fairing of some sort. Is the factory planning on offering such things? Not that it's an issue, Givi make a universal cockpit fairing, (A mate has one on his Mk IV LeMans.) that would probably do the business. Just call me old fashioned but i tend to think it's a bit daggy to simply buy all your bits from the aftermarket catalog, it reeks of HD style desperation and lack of imagination to me. Bars? Well, if they are 7/8th bars then it will be easy. If they decide to use fatties then I can see it being a bit more of a chore but not insurmountable. Something a bit lower would definitely be on my shopping list. Pete

Interesting reading that review. S'funny really, all that hyperbole about stuff you can read in any review of any modern motorbike and what's the bottom line? The bloke likes it, but my guess is that he hasn't ever ridden a Guzzi as a Guzzi is meant to be ridden so his comments mean not a lot. While I haven't ridden a Griso, or even a Breva, yet, just looking at the Grisso says a lot to me. 'Power Cruiser'? Wouldn't know what one was if it bit me on the balls! 'Streetfighter'? Gave that up years ago, I hate having to talk to policemen in a 'Proffesional' role! Nah, what I see in the Griso is a T3 for the 21'st century. And if you think that is an insult you've got shit for brains. I like. In fact I like a lot. In fact I like so much I think I'm going to put a pre-order in next week. If I can get the first yellow one off the boat I can run it in and then start the search for making it better than stock. Lets face it, that's what everyone who ever bought a T3 did! Times may change but people don't, not me at least Pete

The current can is nothing special in the V11 series. Stick in a 620 x 8 or some such, flow the heads, play around with inlet and exhaust tract lengths, lighten the valvetrain. There's heaps of stuff you can do. Changing the 'pooter per-se won't get much, the nice thing is that Cliff's unit is so flexible you can adapt it's delivery for all sorts of extensive mods without a whole lot of farting about and the MM system is a bit limited unless you have the ability to flashload programs into it. If you're stsrting to do extensive engine mods then you do need to be able to play with the parameters a fair bit, that though is Cliff's field, not mine. Yes, it will be costly. The thing is that cost seems to be of little concern to some people. The reason I'd do it is because it ould be fun to see what I could get out of it. I don't need much power, I'm the 'Sultan of Slow'! Pete

OK, so if I buy a Griso and slut the donk up a bit and ask Cliff to come on board and design a decent 'pooter and map for the wretched thing do you think that there would be a sufficient aftermarket to make it worthwhile? As I've said often before 70BHP at the rear wheel is plenty for me but pulling another 20 out of the new donk shouldn't be too hard. Do you think enough people would be interested or am I barking up the wrong tree? Look, neither Cliff or I expect to give up our day jobs providing stuff like this for weirdo, obscure, Italian motorbikes, I dunno if he'd even be interested, but it could be fun and bring in some beer money. Pete

I was always amazed that you found the V11 such a handfull? I haven't had enough experience to know what works and what doesn't with 'em so it's interesting to find that you've found tyre choice so critical. Tyres are always a very personal choice but the newer Guzzis seem to be particularly picky when it comes to rubber. Oh well, I suppose I'll find out all about that when I get my Greaso Pete

I actually like it a lot better than the Breva although obviously I have yet to see it in real life. If I were to get one there would definitelly have to be some changes, first and foremost that horrid bit of scaffold that hangs of the back would have to be tossed! What's the point of having a pointy 'Bee's arse' on the thing if you then hang a sodding great piece of plastic and pressed tin munt off it. Yes I know it's a number plate hanger, I'll knock one of them up out of a tiny bit of stainless with an LED 'Number plate light' (What do you mean it's too dim officer? Is it really worth taking me to court over?) in about five minutes. Then there's that can. That's gotta go. The Cat Con is a PITA too, luckily it isn't a requirement here yet so that can go into the bin for when it's on-sold too and I'll nip up to Mittagong and get Saintune to bash something up, along with some sort of heat shield for the pipes near where my leg sits. I have my doubts about the location of the il cooler too but time will tell if it's neccessary or not, if not it can be taken off too, it's only extra weight otherwise and I'm not going to be using the bike for delivering takeaway Pizza in Mount Druit in summer! While I'd love to see something that looks more like the MGS I'm now far too old and fat to actually RIDE something like that any distance. The Pig's riding position actually looks almost civilized so even an old shagnasty like me should be able to ride it at least long enough that I can wait until my colostomy bag needs emptying before I have to get off! I like the idea of Luggage too, I know it won't be particularly stylish but luckily I'm so incredibly hansome that nobody ever looks at the bike I'm riding after I've taken my helmet off and the convenience would outweigh the damage to my ego. Jude might get on the back as well if she knew she could carry stuff in bags that wouldn't let water in and didn't smell like they'd been used for smuggling corpses for the last twenty years Nah. I reckon I could come at one of them. Pete

A quick chat with Dave revealed what I'd thought. The 'Cardano Reactivo' swingarm business is simply an enclosed version of the V11 parallelogram system. The bevelbox per-se is still a separate item suspended on bearings, (Hopefully better ones than the crap system on the V11.) in the inside of the ugly great swingarm which is *dry* with the yokes and trunnions still as per the 1100 sport/V11 system. this does of course beg the question of how one gets at them to lube and inspect 'em? Perhaps that will be explained in the training manual. I'm really looking forward to getting inside one of these things Pete

Just spoke to Dave, clearances are 0.1mm inlet and 0.15mm exhaust. 4 and 6 thou basically for us old fashioned bastards Incidentally, he's also forwarding all the training stuff they have for the new Breva to me. If you're interested I could post it on to you if you send me your email addy. Just send an email to motomoda@iimetro.com.au Pete

The biggest issues in the valve clearances are going to be in relation to the coefficients of expansion of the various *bits*. Unless something has been radically changed the new motor will still be using chilled cast iron cam followers, aluminium pushrods and the rocker carriers will still be alluminium as will the heads and barrels. The valve and seat material I would not think would have a super-critical effect on the necessary clearance. The earlier round fin models had cast iron rocker carriers which should expand less than the later aluminium ones but factory settings for them were actually a lot larger than those for the later, squarefin, models, most of which also had a warmer cam which tradition dictates should neccesitate a slightly bigger clearance. In my experience all the earlier specs are very, very conservative. I run my roundfins, with warmer cams, at 4 and 6 thou inlet and exhaust. For the V11's the factory specified 2 and 4 for the USA and 4 and 6 for elsewhere. Despite the very small clearances for the US market, prompted I'd guess by a requirement to reduce noise, I've not yet heard of a V11 motor burning it's valves due to using the smaller clearances although I have heard of some of them running badly when very hot, ie when coming to a standstill after being thrashed or idling for long periods in heavy traffic on hot days. Reports from the UK suggest that the Breva 11 does run hot, although that could be poor set up but to meet the new emmission regs for Euro 3 I'd guess that they do have to run almost critically lean and a decent tuning centre should be able to improve on that if the computer is anything like the V11 one, if only by the rather crude method of playing with the TPS setting. I would think that probably setting the tappets at 3 and 5 thou inlet and exhaust would be a fairly safe compromise but just to make sure I'll try and talk to Dave, the tech advisor at the importer here in Oz, today and see if I can find out what the factory recommends. Incidentally, talking with the importer's ep at the rally I attended at the weekend where I saw the Breva 11 he said that the Oz/NZ market was the only one outside of Europe to of got the Breva 11 yet because when the importer's rep visited they managed to scam a deal whereby the European production was 'Skimmed', a sort of '10 for *you* 2 for *us*' type deal so that we actually got them before the US release which has been delayed because of the need to redesign the evaporative control system for the Californian market . Possibly I'm being overly cynical but perhaps also there is a wisdom in sending some Brevas to us where they can be seriously tested in a considerably, and consitently, more hostile, (read hotter.) environment than is usual in Europe and any problems that may occur will manifest themselves here rather than in the far more important and lucrative American market. After the farce of the Hydro Lifter models I'd think it imperative that Guzzi be absolutely certain that the Breva isn't going to turn out to have similar failings if they want to maintain any sort of credibility within the american marketplace. Look, I really did quite like the Breva. To me it looks far bigger than it actually needs to be and far too much of the *motorbike* was hidden under acres of plastic shite and bodywork but it really is effectively an *all new* model in every respect apart from the motor and clutch and that is really a huge step forward for the company. I'll be even more interested to have a close look at the 'Bouncer' or 'Football Hooligan' whatever it's called when it makes an appearance next year. Get one of those, take as much of the extraneous munt off as possible, replace that god-awful muffler and paint it rattle-can black and I reckon it could be a winner!!!!! Pete

Carcano, the last of the great designers from the glory years of Moto Guzzi has passed away. In the last year and a half or so we've lost Tonti, Todero and Carcano. Raise a parting glass and think of what a wonderful legacy they've left. Pete

The old dual plate is very simple, it's just the *Opposite* of what people expect When you pull the lever the slave cylinder pushes onto the thrust bodies in the back of the gearbox. They in turn push on the pushrod which sits in a thrust cup in the middle of the pressure plate at the front of the clutch. Behind the pressure plate are a number of springs, (10 I think on the V11's) which are compressed when the clutch is pulled *in*. This relieves the clamping force on the two friction plates and the intermediate plate so the crank and flywheel can spin independently of the input shaft and clutch hub. As the clutch is *released* the springs cause the pressure plate to clamp the friction and intermediate plates against the ring gear and Hey-Presto! Drive to the bike. The important thing to remember on earlier models, but which is pretty much irrelevant on the V11 due to it's hydraulic clutch, is that the plates wearing causes the free play in the system to diminish, not increase. With a V11 with it's greater power output I'd expect the clutch to start slipping prior to the slave cylinder reaching the point of bottom. Pete

As I said above, I don't really know. My guess is cush springs rattling about but also the one Scura clutch I saw the gearbox input boss was very badly worn so if this is coupled with a low idle speed and/or poorly ballanced throttle bodies it could be backlash in the boss splines or even between the dogs on the pinions in the box. I really have little experience with the six speeders, I've never had a six speed box apart so anything I said would be pure conjecture. pete

I think Keith has it right here. I dunno why the single platers rattle with the lever *out* but My guess is that there are probably cush springs in the pressure plate system somewhere that will lash about when the clutch is not in use. I can't remember offhand as the only single plater I've seen was a busted one I got sent out of a Scura and I took the remains of that to the tip last week so I can't go and check, sorry. Pete

Now THAT my friend is beginning to sound like a plan Pete

Paul, I'm longing to ride one! The thing is that the bloke from the importer who turned up on the Breva at the rally wasn't offering test rides. My closest official dealer and I have various 'issues' so I probably won't get a test ride there and anyway, he doesn't have a demo bike . That means that I have to ride to Sydney to get to plonk my arse on one and take it for a test ride. Now Sydney is about 2 & 3/4 hours away from me down a very boring expressway. If I want to go and ride a Breva I have to book ahead and then take a full day off work to go and take a short test ride in a city. Brilliant! I'm really looking forward to it, but common sense dictates that I can't drop everything simply to go and ride a bike I probably won't be wild about anyway. It would also make more sense for me that if I do decide I want one I wait until they start apearing 2nd hand so that somebody else takes the big depreciation hit that comes with being a new purchaser. Pete

Guido, I actually preffer the looks of the V11's. The early, short-frame, models really tempted me for a while but it really didn't do anything I wanted $17,000 better than my old Tontis, and that remains the case with the new Breva. This is NOT, I hope people understand, me slagging off the bike. It's just ME saying that it probably isn't necessary or right for ME. Hopefully in the next few weeks I will be able to actually get a ride on one and I'll give what I hope will be an objective appraisal but remember I don't particularly like *modern* motorbikes which doesn't mean that they aren't good, just that they aren't my cup of tea, any of them I've currently ridden. If you look at it from my point of view for the cost of a new Breva I can buy, modify and complete my 'El-Vert' project, register and insure it for a couple of years and still have a heap of money to spend on travel and beer AND I'd have a pretty rare and unusual motorbike, not unique, it's been done before, but probably the only one in Oz. I find that far more *fun* than having a 'New' motorbike, but that's me. Pete

I haven't ridden it yet, but I got to sit on it at the NSW Guzzi rally last weekend. Bugger me it's un-necessarily big! God alone knows why, probably trying to appeal to the American market. Anyway, from what I could glean by pawing it and sitting on it everything is very *modern*, ie, it's covered with a whole load of useless crap to disguise the fact that it's actually a MACHINE and make it look like it's a 'Lifestyle Accessory'. Fine if you want that sort of thing but to me it's just ugly and pointless extra weight! I can't comment on the rear CARC system as I haven't been able to see any exploded pictures of it and on the bike you have few clues as to what happens within the swingarm. Obviously though it's going to be some sort of enclosed variant of the V11 set-up which seems to be fairly bulletproof. I personally don't like all the crappy chrome/plastic bling on it, in fact I passed comment that if ever there was a machine crying out for an all-over coat of rattle-can black this was it. Needless to say this led to a rather stiff reply from the importer's rep who had bought the bike along Look, it felt comfy to sit on, the riding position was very upright and easy to live with and it has a dashboard full of widgets and lights to tell you where you've been, where you're going, how old you are, your shoe size and when you next have to go to hospital to have your rectal prolapse put right. All of which is bloody useless complication to me, but I'm NOT who the bike is aimed at so just because I think it's stupid junk doesn't mean that it has any real downside apart from adding weight and complexity, and people seem to love that, as long as the wretched thing can still go stupidly fast, (on paper at least!). Six speed box looks a bit shorter than the *old* six speeder, not having actually ridden it I can't say how it actually performs. All the rest of it is basically bog-ordinary *modern* motorbike. Do I want one?????? Well, that's a good question. Yes, I would like one to play about with. I'd like to work with Cliff to build a decent exhaust/efi combination for it and try to manage all the awful emissions munt and performance stranglers it's fitted with, (Don't get me wrong. I'm all for environmentally friendly. It's just that IMHO the cost of adding and manufacturing all the crap like Cat-Cons on small volume manufactured bikes in terms of environmental pollution over the life of the machine makes it a false ecconomy!!!!!) Would I want one as a replacement for what I currently own? Honestly? No. Why? Because what I currently have does everything I want and has that ellusive content, 'Charisma' that I found sadly lacking in the Breva 11 . Yeah, yeah. I know. Get with the programme, get modern, don't live in the past, yadda-yadda. Sorry, but I don't subscribe to the 'New has to be Better' philosophy. The local Snap-On man was trying to sell me a U-Beaut $700 digital torque wrench the other day. It was a lovely tool, but I didn't need it. He didn't make the sale either. This isn't to say that the Breva 11 won't be a great bike, and maybe the Greaso, (Which I belive is Italian for 'Stand-over Merchant' ) won't also be a great bike. It's just thatI don't think, even if I had one in the garage, I'd find myself taking it's keys off the hook in prefference to those of the 'Vert, the SP or the Hot-Rod, (Which doesn't have a key Pete

I for one was delighted to see the poms win. Our elite sportspeople are a repulsive lot coached at expensive facilities at the public expense they behave like arseholes and never give anything back to the public that paid for thier educations. They earn absurd amounts of money for doing not a lot and then complain bitterly about what a hard time they have swanning around all over the world where their dreadful behavior, and especially their mysoginistic attitude in he case of the males, gets them into trouble and sullies our name abroad. Well done the Poms. Thoroughly deserved!!!! Pete

I agree wholeheartedly with Ratchethack's sentiments here and like everyone else virtually I'd have to say that a Balabio is NOT a beginners bike. Yes, it may be pretty and you may of fallen in lust with it, but it is a large HEAVY motorbike. One other point, don't be duped into thinking that because some of the machines suggested as alternatives have smaller engine displacements they are necessarily less powerful. Apart from the fact that as a novice you really don't need a lot of power, (Some of us who have had 35 years experience don't need a lot either ). The power to weight ratio of something like an SV 600, (A lovely little bike by the way.) is probably better than that of the Balabio and it would definitely be easier to ride. By all means buy a Guzzi, they are a lovely machine, I've owned them almost exclusively for 20 years and although I don't have a V11 variant I would certainly recommend one. But not to a novice. If you don't fancy a trailly to learn on any 250-600cc twin from the Japanese manufacturers is just about ideal. Buy one a couple of years old and learn the lessons on that. Then, after a couple of years if you still want to buy a Guzzi. Avoid at all cost any 'Super-sport' model from any manufacturer. Not only are they finicky to ride but they are absurdly demanding and require huge amounts of set-up to work well, they too are not for a novice. Pete

Great! I'd never thought of one of those, and I could wear my ass-less chaps under my best frock too Brilliant why didn't I think of it? Pete

Hmmm, sorry, but you can't just have a pinion made. Crownwheels and pinnions have to be lapped together and you certainly can't have one made with fewer or more teeth than standard because even if you could get the toothform to match the different number of teeth would require the axis of te pinion to be moved appreciably closer or further away from the crownwheel. If you were to do that you'd need to reposition the drive box in relation to the rear wheel or run the wrear wheel with an offset to the centreline of the bike. pete

Top stuff. Glad it worked out! Pete

Ah! But that would be ugly and CHARACTERLESS!!!!! That's a completely different thing . Sorry, I really despise modern BM's. the old ones weren't crash-hot but the new ones are AWFUL!!!! Pete