pete roper
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Posts posted by pete roper
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Your Guzzi has a Differential? Why? Is it a trike?
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While I won't be buying one there is a lot to like about the new RE range. I'm a big fan of SOHC motors, especially for road bikes, and I keep hearing good things about the twins although I haven't ridden one. If they put that delightfully simple engine in a more modern chassis I'd really be sitting up and taking notice.
As it is, despite my lack of desire to purchase another motorbike I'm severely tempted to purchase a Himalayan to do a lap of Australia on. I'm hearing nothing but good about them from people who don't want to go fast and if I'm doing a lap or figure of 8 around Oz it won't be fast. The price is very hard to go past, they appear reliable, parts are cheap. What's not to like.
Like Phil I have much faster and more capable bikes for eating miles or acting the goat on. Something that will plod along at the legal limit and won't have a cow if pointed at some dirt highway while being able to carry one fat bloke and the stuff he needs sounds just about ideal.
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Yes.
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If you are seriously interested in a 'Special' Daytona I have a friend in the US with a Daytona RS. Like all US RS's it's an 'A' kit bike but in all honesty they are a much happier thing than the 'C' kitted bikes. You also get a variety of improvements with the RS package, broad sump, better pork chops. Anyway I'm pretty sure he'd be willing to sell it to the right parson at the right price. He only ended up with it because it's previous owner sold it to an Australian who only after he'd bought it found he couldn't import it here. So it was bought as a 'Mercy buy'.
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Until I see more and better pics I'm not ruling anything in or out.
Really need to see some exploded parts diagrams to see what's going on.
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Riley also used a Hi-Cam design. It's actually a good, if limited, design.
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Yeah, we're locked down solid too. Trez boring.
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Get rooted!
Actually if you wanted me to make a list of the things that shit me about the 8V we could start with the shitty plastic oil pump gear and move on from there. How about a crank with no sludge trap that they sold as being '30% stronger'? My fat, pimply arse! It was just a way of saving a machining operation. I could rail on for hours but there's no point. It's still a magnificent engine, way better than the 'Old' Hi-Cam but it's not without faults and some of the penny pinching shits me to tears!
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Look, Phil, I agree, it offends me as well, but it's the way it is. Us going puce with disgust and rage over it won't change the minds of the scroll beetles at Piaggio.
one of the things that shat me off big time with the 8V big block was that they used a pressed in bearing for the front main. If you bugger your front main you're supposed to get a new crankcase!
Luckily though the actual case casting retains all the mounting bosses etc. for a replaceable bearing and the depth of the front main and journal/bearing dimensions haven't changed from earlier engines so although it will require a bit of buggering about I'm pretty sure an earlier, replaceable, front main could be fitted. Both case and bearing housing will need machining, (You need to have a gallery in the outer edge of the bearing housing to allow the oil for the under piston sprays to circumvent the bearing housing.) but as long as you get the measurements correct it's entirely doable.
It's the reason I still have my original crankcase still. Once I'm retired I'll actually get around to doing it. My bike might even end up with its original engine number back!😆😎
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Lots of Piaggio products use a pressed up crank Phil. My Mana has the same set up. I really never give it a moments thought.
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How many people wear out a motorbike nowadays?
While I too am not fond of the throw away concept the fact is that as long as the components are essentially recyclable it makes a lot of sense.
Having just given my Griso a 140,000 km freshen up I see nothing that can't be repaired. Whether it will be possible due to parts availability in 20 years time is another matter but that won't matter to me......
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I've had two doses of AZ, no side effects apart from the penis falling off thing but I managed to stick it back on with gaffer tape and blu-tac. It doesn't get much use nowadays anyway.
Annoying side effects of the magnetism, I ended up dangling off the diff housing of a Land Cruiser on a hoist by my head at work and they had to pry me off with a crowbar......
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5 hours ago, biesel said:
I have just found this from 2011:
https://www.rideapart.com/news/257347/miguel-galluzzi-on-the-new-moto-guzzi/
"We are also working on a new engine that will be lighter and smaller. The new Guzzi product range is going to be simpler. We are going to have the small displacement (750cc) as we always have, we are going to have something in the middle that is going to be 1,200 or 1,300 and we are going to have the big block. From these three lines of engines, we are going to work to develop new models. The middle is going to be a big middle. Guzzi is about big torque engines, there is not going to be a small displacement, nothing like that."
What happened? It took 10 (!) years.
What happened is the world changed and business realised it had to change with it.
It's not 2011 any more, any more than its 1981, no matter how much some old men with their heads in the sand want it to be!
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Basically it can fall until it's below the level of the pick-up.
Oil has three functions, to clean, to cool and to lubricate. As long as there is a supply it can do all three but the lower the volume the hotter it will run so the less well it will cool. The amount of contaminants in it will proportionally increase as the volume diminishes so it's like trying to wash yourself in dirty bath water. It will keep lubricating though to the bitter end. It's only when flow to the bearings is interrupted that chaos and destruction ensue!
Of course the lower the level the greater the chance on a V11 of the pick-up being exposed under acceleration and if that happens? It's all over Red Rover! In a matter of seconds!
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Why? Why "Shite to that"?
What upsets you so much about alternative technologies?
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Nah. It handles like what it is, a pretty good early 1970's chassis. I'm not knocking it. I think the Tonti frame was a brilliant design for it's day. The world has moved on a long way though.
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They'd never be able to make competitive 'Modern' power with an OHV set up. The reason the TB/s are central and the exhausts exit on the outer edges of the heads you can tell it's a DOHC set-up as the cams have to run in the same plane as the crank.
if you look at the Caponord 1200 motor you can see a lot of similarities.
I can't do photo's here, I always forget how, but if you look at a Caponord engine in the parts list you can see where the idler gear shaft I and then the two camshafts under the head cover. It's standard Piaggio/Aprilia design and mimics a lot of the engineering in the Rotax motors used in the RSV twins.
I'm looking forward to seeing what else is in the motive unit.
People we're always wingeing that the Gen 2 Hi-Cam *Only* made 100hp. I always found it amazing that it did! It's a very compromised design but it will make 100 rear wheel ponies and not a lot more, no matter what people claim. To get serious HP and meet E5 a DOHC and water cooled powerplant was the only way forward. Unfortunately the forced adoption of OBD II protocols spells the death knell of remapping by aftermarket sources and home tuning. From here on in we're at the mercy of the manufacturers.
Bring on the E bikes and whatever comes after them and let's stand at the stern rail and wave our handkerchiefs in farewell to dirty old fossil fuels! Our grandchildren will thank us.......
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It's interesting that there are already two prototypes. Note that you can't see an obvious exhaust in the picture above while in the 'Spy' pics one is clearly visible on the left of the bike.
The heads haven't been 'Turned', it's just the only real way to run a DOHC system if you keep the longitudinal crank. You could keep it 'Conventional' by driving the cams with bevel towers I suppose but it would be hellishly complex, sap more power and be heavier.
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1 hour ago, Scud said:
@pete roper do you mind explaining exactly what a reactive drive is and how you can tell this bike doesn't have it?
No torque arm from the bevelbox like the Spineframes or, in the case of the CARC bikes, the reactive bridge within the bevelbox. This works to separate the reactive forces of the drive, (As you accelerate/decelerate the pinion tries to climb up or down the crownwheel.) by delivering them directly to the frame. This means that to far greater degree than with a *Fixed* system the drive is separated from the suspension functions meaning a shaft drive bike will handle more like a proper motorbike. It wasn't so important when engines were only making 40-50 hp. Nowadays? Far more important. Looking at this thing there doesn't appear to be a reaction rod and the bevelbox is bolted solidly to the swingarm. The swingarm is very long which is another way of lessening torque reaction but cruder and less effective.
If you look at it holistically it's an interesting package. Seems cam drive is typical Piaggio/Aprilia with a chain to an idler shaft in the head and then the cams geared to the idler, (That is to a degree speculative but the circular *Plug* in the back of the head looks like the idler shaft spindle plug on something like a Shiver or Caponord.)
Throttlebodies in the valley, side exit exhausts as you would have to have with a DOHC design. Downdraft induction means modern power outputs are possible at last. It still looks like the gearbox is behind the engine but there is no recognisable bell housing so maybe a wet multi plate clutch? Where it is positioned will be interesting.
Look, it's, at first glance, a lot better than I was expecting. I was genuinely afraid they were just going to throw a water jacket and an extra plug at the V85 motor which is a miserable little thing. This at least is a *Modern* engine. The styling is neither here nor there. This can be the basis for several platforms and models and Piaggio seem to be following the Aprilia lead established with the CARC bikes of launching the *New* product in a 'Plain Jane' model, (The Breva was the first CARC big block and its styling was not exactly eye catchingly beutiful!)
While I would of preferred something that started the move away from fossil fuel power this is to me the next best option. Will I be buying one? Hell no! I'm very happy with my current fleet and I'll be very surprised if when it's launched here it has a price tag under $25,000. Sorry, I'm not willing to shell out that sort of coin on what I see as a dirty, outdated technology. My current dirty, outdated technology will see me out and I don't owe a penny on it!
I do hope it is a raging success though and spawns many, prettier offshoots.
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Actually better than I expected. A lot of mixed styling cues. I can see lots of of Centauro, some really weird throwbacks to the V75 of the early '80's, (A 750 version of the Lario motor. It was awful. We had one bloke buy one from the shop I worked at in London and it dropped a valve in Reading on his way back to his home in Bristol! It didn't get 80 miles! Hope that isn't a portent!). I need to see more.
I don't like the bevelbox which is obviously styled on the BMW box and worst of all, no reactive drive! Just an enormously long swingarm! What the @#!#$# are they thinking!?!?
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2 hours ago, po18guy said:
If it has a CVT, I'm gonna puke.
What's wrong with CVT? I doubt it will but if they were building a tourer I'd be rapt with a CVT. Like my Mana on steroids!
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I've been trying to find clearer pics from the side but if I squint and hold my tongue at precisely the right angle it does look as though it might have an exhaust pipe coming out of the side of the head and if it does that would indicate a DOHC layout which would be promising. There's enough height in the tank for one or more central throttlebodies as well which would mean downdraft induction and the possibility of modern power outputs.
As I've said I won't be buying one, I'm happy with my current fleet, they'll see me out. If it is a genuinely *New* motive unit though I'll be thrilled.
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I just hope it's something more ambitious than another 2 valve pushrod chuffer with a water jacket.
I too can't believe that they'd invest too much in a redundant technology and no matter what replaces them fossil fuels have to go, no matter what angry old white men say.
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Most people who dismiss the CARC series bikes and especially the 8V's have never ridden one, much less one that is correctly tuned and mapped.
Their loss.
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I have heard it explained many times that Guzzi V Twins are somewhat inspired by automotive practice...
in Technical Topics
Posted
Better.
