pete roper

That's an interesting pic. The bike has what appears to be the hi-cam motor in? Is that one of the early publicity shots? Or are they the fabled 4V heads for the pushrod donk? Pete

The 'G' doesn't really compare with much else. I'd think probably some 600/750 monster and a Buelly-thing. Any Guzzi is always going to be handicapped in terms of power, wheelbase and weight in comparison to anything even remotely *modern*. I was heading into Canberra yesterday and the local dealers demo's went the other way, a black Griso and a black Breva. Seeing a brace of modern Guzzis on the road was so rare I did a u-turn and gave chase, rounded 'em both up in Bungendore and sat with 'em while they had a coffee and discussed the bikes. One of 'em was BMW rider the other one was coming off a VTR, the BMW bloke thought that the Breva needed a screen and the bloke on the Griso thought, unsurprisingly, that it was underpowered, coming off a VTR you would think that . The problem is that because the Griso is an '1100'cc bike ordnary folks expect it to have the performance of something like an FZ Yam in terms of power and speed. The fact remains that with Guzzis you have to effectively forget about what the cubic capacity is, it simply isn't relevant. I think of my Griso in much the same way as I'd think about a slightly overweight 600cc machine from virtually any other manufacturer. No, it's not overly fast, yes it's heavy, but I personally find a bit of weight very handy on a road bike and it's stability and steering are second to none. I don't want a 'Racer for the Road' if I did I'd definitely NOT be riding a Guzzi from any year! I'll also try to steer people away from them if this *is* what they want, simply because they will be horribly disappointed. That's the reason why something like these 'Comparison' tests, (even if you do believe that the journo's are objective!) can't really tell you a lot. They'll always pit the Guzzi against something unsuitable and then make quantatative value judgements based on irrelevancies. You may not agree, that's fine but it's my Pete PS. The Griso demo is for sale at a substantial discount I believe. It's only got 600Km on it and needs setting up a bit better but if anyone's looking for one it's at Gecko in Canberra. Pete

The problem with the Surflex plates only, in my experience, effects the early, shallow spline, type. In the late eighties the company deepened the splines from 2mm to 4mm. It's only the early ones that chop out thusly. The best option with the early clutches is simply to replace the input hub with the later deep spline type and fit the deep splin friction plates. The deep spline design is also a lot less wear prone. Pete

Sorry, I don't. I don't just have $1,200 parts 'Hanging around' unfortunately. Next time I'm down in Melbourne I'll see if Moto One have one on the shelf and if they do I'll take some pics and post 'em up. Pete

The way the splines of the friction plate have erroded is very reminicent of what happens to shallow spline Surflex plates for the early twin platers. In that case the damage occurs because the splines in the plate centres don't match the splines of the hub, they are about 1mm too long and considerably wider so there is more ability for them to rattle around on the hub. It's not unkown for them to chop out in less than 15,000Km. It's not a hardness issue, I had the centres and the hub checked for hardness at the Australian Mint and they were well within spec, (Can't remember offhand what that was ) so it was purely a size and thrashing problem. With the single plate clutches, especially those with very light flywheels, the damage does seem to occur quicker than with the twin platers. The last Scura clutch I saw had a bit of wear on the plate splines but the hub was really quite badly worn, this was at a comparatively low mileage. Why it should present like this I have no idea but sitting with the clutch pulled in for long periods at idle and a low idle speed will both contribute to premature wear. Pete

Loud knocking noise before it stopped running on one cylinder? If so it's probably run it's big ends due to oil starvation from a loose filter or pick-up exposure. Pete

Plates despatched today to; Ratchet x2 Pierre x1 Rocker x1 Chicago Mark x1 Roger Pritzel x1 Jason Bales x1 Jens Lyck Hansen x2 VA Sean x1 Let me know if there are any problems or they fail to arrive! Pete

That was very, very cruel. I suppose somewhere back in the mists of time there may of been a worse handling, more under-braked motorbike than the CD 175 but I can't actually think of one off hand. I had one as my ONLY form of transport from when I was about 19 till I was about 20. Horrid beyond belief, but unkillable! It tried to kill me a couple of times though! Pete

100% ditto this. If you ride your bike hard I would also recommend one of my sloppage sheets but others find that they don't have a problem. Pete

OK, USA buyers and those who weren't able to get one of the sheets I took to the UK. I'm now back in Oz. Those of you who have paid by paypal, please let me know and I'll get the sheets out pronto. Those who so far haven't and are still interested please send me an email to motomoda@optusnet.com.au and I'll start getting things organized. There is a paypal account linked to the above email address. I did post up the costs for single and multiple sheets to the USA and Europe, I think they are in one of the earlier threads on the subject so check back. If not I'll go and price it up again. Sorry about the delays on this but what with my Mum dying and Jude's Mum developing dementia things have been just a trifle hectic!! Pete PS costs. To USA 1 sheet- $20AU 2 sheets- $36AU 3 sheets-$53AU Europe 1-$25AU 2-$46AU 3- $67AU The sheets themselves cost $155AU. I suggest that you simply Google up a currency converter and do the conversion into the currency of your choice, yes, I'll probably take a small hit as the *true* exchange rate and what is given by banks to the punter is a bit different but I'm not going to die in a ditch over it. Yes, there's an element of trust involved here, I usually find that trust works just fine with most people in the Guzzi community. Anyone who seriously robs anyone else ends up getting 'Outed' pretty quick and finds themselves pretty unpopular so lets just do it this way.

RAM aftermarket is a happy thing, although I'd better qualify that by saying I've heard of no complaints or failures. The twin plater works fine for me in my Griso and in many other V11's. I have heard of problems with it slipping in very highly tuned 4 valvers but I've never experienced it myself. You pays yer money and takes yer pick. If you do g with the twin plater make sure that you get the ten spring version, not the eight spring. Pete

I fly out of England tonight. I'll be back in Oz Thursday morning, I'll have a bit to do and will need sleep but I should be able to start processing payments and shipping the sheets early next week. Pete

Oh, sorry. I wasn't aware that I was expected to take pictures of and post up detailed analysis of them on this site or any other. All I'm doing is expressing my opinion and sharing information I've gleaned from a variety of sources, some of them *official*, some of them *unofficial* and my own personal observations. The two flywheels are different, whether the one used in the Scura was redesigned by Guzzi or RAM matters not one whit. The fact is that the ones in the Scura have a tendency to fly apart. All I said was that if I owned on it would be at the top of the list of parts to change out for something else. Whether other people choose to do so is entirely up to them but the suggestion that I'm saying things for purely scurrilous reasons is, I'm sorry, absurd! Pete

Information from seeing both the original and the Guzzi designed unit. Reason for the change would probably be cost above all, less material or inferior material in the Guzzi designed unit. I have no idea why they would specify a different unit apart from sheer bloody-mindedness or cost, two things Guzzi are famous for . I have never heard of one of RAM's original designs going tits up, I've only installed a few of them though but I've been around Guzzis for 30 years and if something is unreliable I usually hear about it soon enough. I know of at least four, probably as many as half a dozen Scurra clutches going west in Oz though. If I owned a bike with one in it would be coming out as a matter of urgency, but that's me, nobody is forced to take my advice or believe what I say and I have no vested interest in trying to get people to replace parts that are perfectly serviceable. pete

Guzzi got RAM to make the single platers for the Scura etc, the problem was that the silly sods decided to re-design it and then get RAM to make it to their specs. The fact that the RAM unit had been around since Jesus was in nappies and worked just fine was of no consequence, Guzzi went ahead and stuffed about with it and their version breaks. I've seen a couple of 'em let go now. When i was talking to Keith a few days ago I was strongly urging him to bin the Guzzi unit in his, I'd do the same to anyone with a Scura or (?) Tenni that has this unit but the RAM aftermarket unit is a HAPPY thing Pete

It looks like an out-take from a comedy show called 'The Chaser' which airs on ABC. Generally it is quite funny and some of it's political satire is witheringly mercilless. They don't always hit the spot but their strike rate is pretty good. Pete

I think an apology is in order Gary. My mistake, I'm sorry. As you may of read I've been under a fair bit of stress of late and I mis-interpretted your original post. Pete

Yup, or you could perhaps buy a few off me and take into account the time and effort I went to to design the thing? Yup, I have no copyright or patent, you can do it. Perhaps that makes me a sucker, but I have to admit I'll be a bit pissed off if you take my work and plagiarise it. My price is, after all, scarecely exhorbitant. Pete

The plate won't prevent the oil fromsurging backwards completely. The rectangular hole has to be there as the oil pressure relief valve sits proud of the top of the spacer where the plate fits. Also there has to be some space for the oil to return to the sump while the engine is running. Although most of the oil seems to end up in the front left hand corner, (Why I'm not sure, centrifugal/cyclonic forces would seem the obvious answer.) I felt that it was going to be necessary to have other *holes* as well in different parts of the plate, hence the larger than strictly necessay OPRV hole and the fact that the right hand edge of the hole through which the 'Filter Mount and Thermostat Munt' sticks is straight rather than being contoured to fit more closely around the fitting. Remember, the oil starvation only seems to be a problem under really fierce acceleration in the lower gears. The plate doesn't have to completely prevent the rearward slop of the oil, it only has to slow it doen and inhibit it enough to ensure that the pick-up isn't exposed. As I mentioned in the earlier thread the IDEAL solution would be to dry-sump the motor but that would require a scavenge pump and a whole lot more weight and complexity. With the plate I'm not looking for a *perfect* or *Ideal* solution. What I'm hoping I've achieved is a simple solution to the pick-up exposure problem to prevent bearing damage. As I also stated earlier IMHO the CORRECT level for the oil should be just below the plate which coresponds to the bottom of the block. When the plate is installed it is worth marking the dipstick at that point. While by doing this you will be adding a bit more oil and therefore will slightly increase the crankcase pressurisation the plate will help prevent oil expulsion by reducing windage so it is unlikely that the breather system would be over-taxed by the extra oil volume. Since many people have already started running their 'Broad Sump' Engines over-full to combat the loss of pressure problems I can't see this over-pressure causing any sealing problems. Pete

The new sump, (and all it's internal stuff.) will bolt up to a V11 block I'm almost certain but the new sump is considerably deeper and would severely compromise ground clearance I think. Hitting the picks really hard coming into a corner and having the sump rub on the road is *not* a good look While I haven't actually done any measuring for comparison I think that the Breva and Griso motors sit a fair bit higher in the new frames allowing the use of the new, deeper, sump. I can only assume that since the adoption of the alternator in the valley of the motor it was considered that worrying about a lower centre of gravity was tossed out the window. Having said that I in no way feel that the handling of my Griso is in any way compromised by this. Mind you, as I often state, I ride like Gumby so it probably wouldn't make any noticeable difference to me if I had a baby elephant sitting on the tank Pete

Uh, I suppose I'd better sort the payment out for the plates keith has got? Sorry, I have been 'Otherwise occupied' . Anyway, I reckon that all things taken into account £70 each is what they should cost plus post and pack. So if Keith can work out what that would be within the UK those wanting 'em can send cheques made out to P.Roper to Keith for that amount and he's kindly offered to ship 'em out for me. I still have some of the first batch in Oz so anyone who is in the UK or Europe who missed out and wants one I can post from Oz but since I was coming over here I flung a few in my carry on luggage to reduce the postage but obviously I couldn't bring that many as in bulk they are HEAVY! It looks like I'll have to do another run as well, Todd want's some for MPH in Houston and I'm not sure i have enough to cover pre-orders from the USA but now the design is finalized it's simply a matter of ordering more and getting 'em cut so it shouldn't take long. Keith. Thank you for doing this, (Graham offered as well but at that time I still thought I was going to cope with it, I was wrong.) I'll email you my Pommy bank details for where the cheques need to be deposited. Pete

What will cause bearing damage to an engine that has been assembled correctly? Inadequate quantity or pressure of oil, that's what. Greg went to the trouble of fitting a guage to his bike and found that under hard acceleration the oil pressure dropped to next to nothing, if not an indicated ZERO, when accelerating into freeway traffic. That to me would indicate that there IS a problem. As would the factory blurb on the Breva/Griso motor which states that one of the many improvements to the engine is a complete re-design of the sump and oil delivery system TO AVOID LOSS OF PRESSURE . Even the factory admitted obliquely that there was a problem with the 'Broad Sump' design! If the bearings aren't getting oil they WILL die. No if's or but's. The reason why it's a problem on the 'Broad Sump' models is because the pick-up is quite far forward, the sump is 'Broad' but not as 'Deep' as earlier sumps and they also had a more rearward pick-up AND it was right at the bottom of the sump rather than being a pipe poking down towards the bottom of the shallower sump. Under hard acceleration the oil WILL slop rearwards. Under certain conditions, I'd guess if you are going uphill and leaning to the left it would be worst, the pick up is more likely to be exposed. If the pick-up is exposed then the low pressure area in the pump will be filled with air rather than oil and air is a pretty crap lubricant for a plain bearing. So, is the plate a necessity? If you don't accererate uphill to the left, hard, and always are scrupulous about slightly over-filling your sump then no, it probably isn't. If you DO do any of those things then there is a risk of damage. I'm not, and never have said that if you don't fit a sloppage plate your engine will immediately melt into a lump of smoking slag. I'm NOT 'forcing' people to buy them! It's simply a choice that is now open to people. Basically though, if I owned a 'Broad Sump' model I'd be fitting one because I reckon that spending a small amount of money on such a thing is a worthwhile insurance against torching a crank! Even buying at 'trade' from Italy I can assure you that a V11 crank is NOT a cheap item! I know, I wanted one for a race bike and couldn't afford it! Pete

If you look at Greg's post on the definitive proof of pick-up exposure under hard acceleration it is pretty plain that it does happen. If you're running zero oil pressure then damage will start to occur immediately. This doesn't mean that the big ends will instantly go out to lunch but they WILL be damaged. In the case of the machine that started this thread my guess is that it was exposing the pick up during hard acceleration. Whether the light came on or not is a moot point. The switch that operates the light opens at some feeble pressure, less than five PSI I'd guess, so it's quit possible for the pressure to drop dangerously low without the light coming on. Add in the fact also that there will be a time delay, not only for the switch itself to close but for the globe to start to incandese (Sp.) and the rider to notice it. I know that in bright weather it's quite hard to see some lights on the dash and if you're accelerating HARD in the lower gears I know of few peple who are peering at their dashboard while they do it . So, probably there was some shell damage already. While on the dyno the pick-up exposure problem as was noted by someone else above, won't be an issue, BUT running the engine at High RPM/High Load on a dyno IS stresfull and my guess is that this was simply the 'Straw that broke the camel's back.'. I noted that when I installed the dipstick while I was installing the sloppage sheet prototype on a Centauro that the level indicating 'Full' was a good 10-15mm low with the dipstick screwed in. I didn't think to check with the dipstick resting on the threads but this would have to be a *better* indicator of the correct level. Having said that I think that the 'Sloppage Sheet' is probably the best solution on offer an used in conjunction with ensuring the oil level is correct, (ie, just below the level of the plate when installed.) I am pretty certain that it will prevent any recurrence of the pick up exposure. I may be a rat-bag but I don't consider myself to be a *complete* charlatan . I wouldn't of bothered making the wretched things if I didn't reckon they would work. Anyway Greg has one which he's going to fit to his Coppa/Billybob when he has time and once that is done we will, hopefully have some sort of definitive answer as to whether my theory is correct. All I know is that the Proto as fitted to a customer's Centauro has caused no problems but I don't think he said he's ever seen the light come on apart from once early in his ownership when he'd let the oil drop way too low. Pete

Sorry Al, I thought I'd posted up a list of shipping prices before I left for the UK? If I overlooked it I'm sorry but as I'm currently in Cambridge waiting for my Mum to die the sheets aren't exactly my highest priority right now. I apologise for this and will get back to it as soon as this sh!tfull situation is resolved. Pete

Because I'm having such a sodding awful time here at the moment I've flick-passed the sloppage sheets to Keith Baldini who has kindly offered to distribute them for me. He'll no doubt post up details of where and when to send money. Sorry about this but I'm basically not in a position at the moment to do anything but cope with family issues. Pete