Making a Cushier Cush Drive

[Guest ratchethack]

Gosh Dave, that just about covers every possible variation we might see in our weather. No way the AGW believers can ever be wrong. Be sure you send Uncle AL a big check to feed his ministry and ease your concience.

 

Dennis

Dennis, like me, you've made the "mistake" of applying earth logic. I sympathize, my friend.

 

Please allow me to help.

 

I've been conducting a long-term comprehensive analysis, attempting to identfy and comprehend causes of other-worldly logic, which to earthlings still capable of thinking for themselves, and therefore not susceptible to kultural poisons of indoctrination and GROUPTHINK mind control, can be particularly troubling, even disturbing. . .

 

It seems that a surprising number of hyper-naïve and super-gullible adults have swallowed entire extraterrestrial world-views, by which such a patently absurd notions as, "Global Warming causes Global Cooling" makes perfect sense -- and yet, by the same illogic, the reverse, "Global Cooling causes Global Warming" is not only impossible, but entirely incomprehensible.

 

35 years ago, when the Man Made Global Crisis du jour was Global Cooling, the extremely gullible among us likewise fell for the exact opposite illogic, and the whole thing was turned around the other way. Then, "Global Cooling causes Global Warming" was what they said when the mounting facts and data eventually piled up high enough to make their idiotic JUNK SCIENCE appear as ludicrous as it does today.

 

You see, whatever "The Crisis Du Jour" happens to be, the abject absurdity of this only goes one way, depending on the leading popular delusion of the times. . .

 

An interview by Neil Cavuto with Greenpeace Director of Global Warming Steven Biel from Friday of last week (see YouTube video at link below) illustrates how scientifically unsupportable, mindless GROUPTHINK dogma based on other-worldly logic can actually be presented without cracking a smile -- something any rational earthling would find impossible to demonstrate.

 

Watch for a smile here. I could find nary a trace. This guy is good. He actually repeats his hysterically berzerk crap over and over, with a frown! He starts out by saying that hurricanes are stronger and more frequent because of Global Warming, even though that silly lie has been overwhelmingly disproven, debunked and exposed on a continuous basis for decades by countless legitimate Blue Planet scientific analyses in the fields of climatology, meteorology, and planetary geophysics. He gets more unbelievable from there.

 

You can't make this stuff up -- not on the Blue Planet, anyway.

 

Record hot or record cold (either way) -- "Everything" is evidence of man made Global Warming!

 

a direct quote:

 

[Years of record breaking, unseasonal low temperatures, snow and ice storms is] "exactly what Global Warming looks like."

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEF1rhIdQYI

 

The fools are still stuck on stupid. As Cavuto astutely observes, they just wanna "have their icicle, and suck it too."

[GuzziMoto]

I think if you want to push your mumbo jumbo on others, that's fine. Please start another thread in the correct place. This is a thread on V11 cush drives.

[gavo]

I think if you want to push your mumbo jumbo on others, that's fine. Please start another thread in the correct place. This is a thread on V11 cush drives.

 

hear hear less mumbo jumbo more cush drive fact, if u want to sprout get a soap box

[dlaing]

Gosh Dave, that just about covers every possible variation we might see in our weather. No way the AGW believers can ever be wrong. Be sure you send Uncle AL a big check to feed his ministry and ease your concience. <_>

 

Dennis

My check went to Obama.

Amazed I had anything to give after king George Bush and the Republicans damaged the economy.

Watch out Obama is replacing bureaucrats with AGW believing scientists! Crichton rolls over in his grave...LOL!

Science not media hype has shown that man have had an effect on global warming.

Modeling has shown that weather extremes will be a result of greenhouse gas build up, but that does not mean we AGW believers are proven right everytime there is a record breaking drought, rainfall, hurricane or temperature. It is simply consistent with the model.

If you wanna buy into news stories that suggest a cold spell means their is no global warming, that is your choice, wrong as it is.

[dlaing]

Sorry, getting back to the topic, which splines wear out?

Rear wheel? Fly Wheel? Engine side? tranny side? Shaft drive? tranny out? bevel in?

I guess nobody knows?

I am sure Greg does, since he has seen them feathering off in the direction of deceleration.

My splines at the rear wheel still look new to me after at least ten rear tires. Maybe I need to look closer for signs of wear???

[gstallons]

Getting off the subject of global warming, I try to use anti-sieze lube or dry-film (multiple coats) graphite on any splines such as input shaft, clutch disc, rear drive hub and drive shaft. The dry film graphite on clutch disc because tou don't want anti-sieze or grease getting in the friction surface of the flywheel/pressure plate components.

[Skeeve]

This is a very interesting conversation, but I'm not sure how it affects the cush drive in my Italian motorcycle!

 

N-Butyl rubber is an imperfect elastomer [aren't we all?], so that when it's cold it gets hard and its hysteresis goes up [ie, "you don't back out as much as you put in" differential.]

 

So you need to put in more holes if you live where it's cold [rainy Seattle] than where it's warm [sunny Sandy Eggo]...

[dlaing]

N-Butyl rubber is an imperfect elastomer [aren't we all?], so that when it's cold it gets hard and its hysteresis goes up [ie, "you don't back out as much as you put in" differential.]

 

So you need to put in more holes if you live where it's cold [rainy Seattle] than where it's warm [sunny Sandy Eggo]...

Thanks Skeeve, that may explain why Greg describes his cushes as chrome-moly hard while mine are about as soft as my tire or running shoe sole

Look at that, maybe we were arguing about nothing, again.

Drill baby drill, all yee cold weather riders, but I still think the acceleration cush pads needs fewer holes.

PS Let go of my Eggo!

[Greg Field]

I think Skeeve has nailed it.

[Guest ratchethack]

N-Butyl rubber is an imperfect elastomer [aren't we all?], so that when it's cold it gets hard and its hysteresis goes up [ie, "you don't back out as much as you put in" differential.]

Very true and agreed in full.

So you need to put in more holes if you live where it's cold [rainy Seattle] than where it's warm [sunny Sandy Eggo]...

A little counterpoint here, if I may? Well of course I may! . . .

 

N-butyl rubber NEVER appears in a monolithic, pure form in any product, as pointed out some 6 months back in this thread. N-butyl rubber is ONE COMPONENT of millions of flexible products, all of which are made up of not only N-butyl rubber, but many more different grades and formulations of other component compounds in varying blends and proportions in products of widely differing properties. All are all highly engineered in complex combinations for specific applications, all very specialized, differing widely in countless ways from from one product to the next.

 

Everyone has replaced many kinds of highly consumable "rubber" items on many vehicles that have deteriorated and become hard and brittle (wiper blades or coolant hoses for 2 examples). Though all may be black in color and feel very much the same to the touch, this doesn't mean that tires, motor mounts, coolant hoses, seals, windshield wipers, or cush drives are made of the same material and all behave the same way! Many other kinds of rubber products on vehicles outlast the vehicle with no apparent hardening or deterioration at all, and with no need for replacement wotsoever (seals of all kinds, for example). Each is an entirely separate and distinct compound from the next, each formulated for entirely different applications.

 

Again, as I observed 6 months ago in this thread (and still unchallenged) I have never seen any post from anyone anywhere on any Guzzi Forum who has discovered either ANY hardening or ANY deterioration of a OE Guzzi cush drive blocks wotsoever -- and that covers all Guzzi cush drives since the first, some half-century back.

 

Ever feel the temp of the Guzzi rear wheel hub after a 50-mile ride? Hot weather or cold, it gets WARM either way -- just like the tires. Hysteresis of any compound of N-butyl rubber will produce heat when it's repeatedly flexed. In the Guzzi cush drive, the forged steel webs of the drive plate heat up from this internally-generated heat from the flexing of the rubber drive blocks. But the cush drive blocks are also subject to incoming heat flow through the drive plate that's generated from the bevel gears and bearings in the bevel drive through the bearing carrier. It's a near-certain probability that if cush drive blocks were made from the same N-butyl and other rubber compounds as windshield wipers, (or urethane of unknown properties mixed up in someone's garage by someone without a clue about what they're doing, for that matter) that it wouldn't hold together more than a few rides under normal use.

 

The tires we choose for other than wet, snow and mud conditions tend to be very similarly suitable, regardless of ambient temps. Once up to operating temp -- cush drive or tire -- I suggest that ambient temp is similarly nearly 100% irrelevant to the operation of cush drives, and variations within several tens of degrees Fahrenheit (or even more) make next to ZERO difference to the performance parameters one would properly require from a cush drive (record shattering low ambient temps or no).

 

. . . But o' course, that's just me.

 

NOTE: Hey Greg, I've been trying to eschew the parenthetical. Seriously.

 

But (alas and alack!), as you can see, I've failed. . .

 

It would seem that despite the sincerity of my intent, once again I've bit off more than I can eschew.

[Greg Field]

 

It's always a great day when one can eschew something.

 

Happy New Year!

[savagehenry]

DAMN!!! I can't believe we've got WAY over 300 replies (22pgs)?!?!? on plunking holes in some little rubber bits ... ...and barely 3x that on the "HOOTERS" thread...God bless you little freaks, HAPPY NEW YEAR!!! S.H.

[dlaing]

DAMN!!! I can't believe we've got WAY over 300 replies (22pgs)?!?!? on plunking holes in some little rubber bits ... ...and barely 3x that on the "HOOTERS" thread...God bless you little freaks, HAPPY NEW YEAR!!! S.H.

Maybe this thread needs more photos of naked cush drives?

Happy New Year and monolithic elastomers to the masses!

[al_roethlisberger]

Very cool and helpful post Greg.

 

Some years back I tried to open my cush drive just to check and see if the pucks were lubricated since this is a well known oversight from the factory, but I too found at least one button head bolt to strip immediately and left it for "later".... and later never came

 

I think I'll be giving the bike a good full maintenance this Spring, and this will be on my list as I have always considered the lash from engine braking to be be a bit harsh, and this may be part of the issue.

 

This would be a great FAQ addition.

 

Thanks,

Al

[Skeeve]

Back from the dead!

 

Resurrecting an old topic! Just stumbled across this item on evilBay; seems someone has been data mining & decided that the long production of essentially the same final drive made up for the low production #s and that making urethane drive wedges for Guzzis makes sense after all.

 

Want a wedgie?

 

Since that link will go bad in a month & in the interests of posterity, here's a cut&paste:

 

"Moto Guzzi cush drive rubber set, 12 pieces, big twin cush drive models 850T to 2001

 

The set you are bidding on is black in color not blue as the picture shows

 

Polyurethane rubber upgrades better than New! Why Polyurethane rubber? Looks and feels the same as natural rubber but lasts 10 times longer!!! Race car steering and suspension proformance parts,as well as Industrial machinery have long known the advantages of polyurethane over natural rubber components. Polyurethane parts have superior .... Impact cut and tear resistance, Resilience and memory under repeated flexing, Gas, Oil and solvent resistance.

 

Clauss Studios & Manufacturing http://www.claussstudios.com/index.html

 

We are always looking for no longer available parts to remake. If you have parts or ideas of what we should be making next please let us know!

 

Made in the USA quality Reproduction molded plastic and rubber working on a classic Motorcycle ,Car , Scooter ? parts that are no longer available or tough to find ?not any more ! i specialize in making the impossible part for that restoration. rubber grips , floor mats , grommets , pedal pads, tank pads. Plastic knobs grills , levers, tail light and turn lenses etc etc .. click on the "ME" icon after our ebay name for a link to our web site ."