Stupid newbie question (FAQs read, search done :) )

[Ryland3210]

The first time I used the Widder vest, it was about 30 degrees, wearing an insulated jacket on top of that. Within 15 minutes, I was sweating, so I bought a temperature controller. I find it does the job at the lowest setting, which I suppose also must cut power consumption. I have not seen the need for heated grips, but that is something to think about if you are going to take rides of more than 30 minutes in really cold weather. I just don't know if heated gloves will be enough, they probably will. My rule of thumb, based on experience riding for many years before anyone had thought of heated clothing, is that I could stand almost anything for about 25 minutes. On trips longer than that in the winter I used to wear ski mittens.

 

Widder recommends thin clothing under the vest, because the closer it is to the body, the more effective. They have done a good job of avoiding hot spots to make that practical. Insulation goes outside the vest.

 

On battery capacity, some have solved battery clearance concerns with smaller, but lower capacity batteries. That is not something I would consider, even without heating clothing. More capacity means more reserve, faster absorption of current when the alternator is pump amps, more starting amps in cold weather, and generally longer life.

[tmcafe]

The Widders have leather fingers and palms. The back of the forefingers is covered with suede. That is very handy for wiping raindrops, etc. off a face shield or goggles. The fabric balance is claimed to be waterproof. I find them very comfortable without hot spots. The gauntlets are bulky, but I like that because it is insulation against the cold. They slip over my jacket just fine. Good insulation on the backs of the hands and fingers as well. The collar around the next extends up under the helmet as well. There seems to be plenty of power available from my Cafe Sport to run them, and I cruise at typically 3,000 RPM. I have no experience with the Gerbings. Both companies have good reputations. Widder claims to have been making this type product longer than anyone else. I have been thoroughly satisfied.

 

Here is a picture of the connection to the battery. The Widder's cable came with the in-line fuse. I didn't have to buy anything. I also included a picture of the seat mod before I filled the hole with black silicon rubber. You can see the white foam within the triangular shaped cuttout. The Battery bracket picture shows how I bent it in the same places as the original, changing a pair of 90 degree bends into about 120 degrees to lower the battery's bottom about 1/2 inch to clear the seat.

 

Thanks for the pictures and comments, thanks everybody for their input on the heated gear. From what I can tell, the alternator is borderline. The Widder gear should draw less than Gerbing, hence Ryland's success in running both gloves and vest, and problems with Gerbing counterparts overtaxing the charging system. I guess gloves should be better than any heated grips. They may also draw less juice. At high speed and in cold weather, the heated grips will eventually become ineffective. The Widder vest is fine for me, nicely made and warm enough. I kept it on for many hours in temps around 25 at highway speeds. Often I'm okay riding with only the heated grips, but the length of the ride will eventually seal the deal. So yeah, get a vest if you plan on riding for long hours in winter temps.

 

The 350 watts are cranked out at 5k rpm, not 10k. But if Ryland can cruise at 3k and still wear the vest and gloves, I feel hope. Of course, how about if you keep them both on, and add high beam to the total. Hmmm... Anyway, whatever gloves I get, I guess they'll be the ones than draw less power.

 

Ryland, I understand how you wired your electric gear, that's easy enough for me . I also see the cut in the seat and the bracket. I'll have to maybe print the pics when I look at the battery and underneath my seat, to figure out exactly what's happening so that I can fix it the way you did. I totally agree that the smaller battery is a poor fix. I'd make better room for the original one as you did.

[docc]

I seem to recall the grips draw a little more than half the gloves' 33 watts. (Gerbings)

 

The shop manual shows both a table and a chart on page P34 which shows output of 23.50 D.C.Amps (282 watts) at 3000 rpm, 27.50 D.C.Amps (330 watts) at 10,000 rpm.

 

Cruising at 10,000 so you can stay toasty may be a bad idea.

[Greg Field]

I have a Gerbing's jacket liner. When cranked full-on, with the headlight on, the system voltage falls to 12.5. During the day, I keep the headlight in the park position (I have the Euro switch). I'm working on a way to fit a larger alternator, like the one I fitted to my Eldo.

[tmcafe]

I have a Gerbing's jacket liner. When cranked full-on, with the headlight on, the system voltage falls to 12.5. During the day, I keep the headlight in the park position (I have the Euro switch). I'm working on a way to fit a larger alternator, like the one I fitted to my Eldo.

If you find a way, that would be great. Why can the R1150R come with a 700W alternator at about the same total weight as the Guzzi? Although they're great looking bikes, Guzzis could easily be riders' bikes as well: sturdy, easy to maintain and operate. A bigger alternator would be such a useful thing to add...

 

OTOH the Gerbing jacket uses more juice than the Widder vest. Some, like Ryland, have run both gloves and vest (Widder) at cruising speed. I may get the Widder gloves if they're drawing less power than the Gerbings.

[tmcafe]

I seem to recall the grips draw a little more than half the gloves' 33 watts. (Gerbings)

 

The shop manual shows both a table and a chart on page P34 which shows output of 23.50 D.C.Amps (282 watts) at 3000 rpm, 27.50 D.C.Amps (330 watts) at 10,000 rpm.

 

Cruising at 10,000 so you can stay toasty may be a bad idea.

I haven't seen this spec in the shop manual yet, but I'll look for it. Hmm... that wouldn't sound too good. The owner's manual, OTOH, says 350W @ 5000 rpm. Maybe they changed the specs a bit from one year model to the other, mine is a 2004 (maybe it's also my wishful thinking and the 350@5k is a typo )

[Ryland3210]

Greg's 12.5 volts is a bit scary, since that's below a fully charged battery's open circuit voltage. It indicates the battery is being somewhat discharged.

 

My suggestion is to invest in a temperature controller and wear insulation outisde the vest. That way, you can turn down the thermostat and reduce the current consumption. You'll be more comfortable as well.

[tmcafe]

Greg's 12.5 volts is a bit scary, since that's below a fully charged battery's open circuit voltage. It indicates the battery is being somewhat discharged.

 

My suggestion is to invest in a temperature controller and wear insulation outisde the vest. That way, you can turn down the thermostat and reduce the current consumption. You'll be more comfortable as well.

So when you said you ran both gloves and vest cruising at 3k rpm, were both, or either, on-and-off, or on a heat controller? That could be a solution, but during my long rides in below-freezing temps (as in 5-10 hours stopping only for gas) I kept the vest on much of the time, and that with a sweater on top of it, and the jacket with liner. I also have only an on-off switch on the vest. Thanks.

[Ryland3210]

So when you said you ran both gloves and vest cruising at 3k rpm, were both, or either, on-and-off, or on a heat controller? That could be a solution, but during my long rides in below-freezing temps (as in 5-10 hours stopping only for gas) I kept the vest on much of the time, and that with a sweater on top of it, and the jacket with liner. I also have only an on-off switch on the vest. Thanks.

 

Both vest and gloves were on the same circuit, controlled with the controller. The controller was an electronic on/off type. There are also rheostat types, but they are less efficient, and waste energy.

 

I had only a shirt under the vest, then sweater and a winter coat on top of that, so I think I had more insulation than what you describe.

[docc]

See the thread on Charging System and heated clothing

 

I wish I could run my Gerbings without abandon, but no . . .