Guzzista_Joe Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 Whatever the reasons for the e-mail, this sort of seagull management (swoop in, shit on everything and swoop off again) is wrong. If there have been wrong-doers then deal with them, don't tar everyone with the same brush. I post here from time to time and refer to the knowledge contained therein often. I don't think I've ever been abusive to anyone. I post on other forums in a similar way and, when a similar situation has occurred on the forum I run, I dealt with the individuals. I like to think I treat people with respect and I expect the same in return. It left a sour taste in the mouth to be treated like a child in a classroom of naughty children. I know not everyone will agree with these words but it's how I personally feel about the situation. It's wrong to threaten people with the removal of the site. Jaap may own it but this forum is alive because of the investment in time, knowledge, expertise, and humour that it's members have made in it, and with great credit to, but not because of, it's owner. I know only too well how hard it is to set up a forum and what a priviledge it is to have access to such a vast (in comparison) resource of Guzzi enthusiasm. Deal with the offenders and move on, the rest of us haven't caused you grief Jaap.
Ballacraine Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 Well said, Joe. TBH I am still too pumped about this to be so coherent..... What is the state with your site BTW? Nige.
Guzzista_Joe Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 Allo Nige, long time no "see"...yeah, it's kicking...got some enthusiastic site members and a busy little forum...I started a new one since leaving the old one...you still on that from time to time? Good to hear from you again! Joe
Guest Loosy Goosy Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 I joined something like a year ago, and I think I have only posted a few times here with technical questions. I certainly don't remember anything political. and, frankly, I have been too busy with work to even think about coming back for a few months. So receiving this e-mail was a real head scratcher. I can certainly understand Jaap getting his hackles up over some less than civil keyboardists, but shooting the innocent? I am sad to see this.
Steve G. Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 Well, I guess that because I am politically engaged, and have been a major contributor to the parts of the forum that have resulted in this I must be part of the problem too. I just want to reiterate one of my previous posts, along the lines that bikers, like any other special interest group that meet through that interest, are not one dimensional characters with one track minds (or 2 track if you include Hooters!). We are all adults with various experiences, families and opinions on the world. People who get together for one reason, quite naturally will discuss other things, and it is necessary if real friendships are to form. Of course, we will also meet people we don't want to befriend, for many valid reasons. This is just life, and it is inevitable that there will be disagreements. This is where good manners, an easy going nature and a stiff upper lip are needed. Robust discussion is a good thing, and political engagement is in short supply in this world, and should be encouraged, not treated as some kind of mental illness. Yes, it is a great board, or it has been until now. I note a significant number agree with the new rules or are simply scared to suggest the board owner might not have perfect judgement. I will say it: I think Jaap is wrong. Taking this approach will simply drive out a lot of regular posters and visitors who over the years have not only made valuable technical and biking contributions useful to all, but have also shared a lot else of their lives on here to the enrichment of all our experience. What will result now is a watered down board where most of the interesting characters will no longer visit or post much. The right approach would not be to ban subjects, but bad manners and bad behaviour. We have seen bad behaviour in technical arguments recently and not just ye old GW threads. Another good question is why create the banter forum at all? Why not just prune all the forums to the bare acceptable number of subjects and provide posting guidance if there are subjects the board owner simply doesn't want to host for his own reasons? Hey Jaap, it's your board; if you don't want to host stuff you don't agree with or find offensive, just say so in your personal email to us all. Probation - Pah! I am very close to terminating my involvement here. Geez Nogbad, I had it all wrong. I actually thought you were one of the moderators. Ciao, Steve
floridaguzzi Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 I am one of many who hasn't posted much at all. I bought a Bonneville instead of a Guzzi when I discovered how hopeless the Miami Guzzi "dealer" is. Moto Guzzi needs a proper US dealer network, especially if the V7 Classic ever appears here. Thus imagine my surprise when I get a personal e-mail from this Jaap character who has never deigned to acknowledge my existence previously. I have started to dislike motorcycle forums as they all follow the same boring predictable patterns of enthusiasm, rage, moderator intervention, promises to behave etc... I got a good laugh out of the idiot Jaap's e-mail. If he had the brains God gave a goat he'd have directed his comments at the causes of his problems. I'm not one of them so if anybody else wants the coveted title of floridaguzzi go ahead. I'm going back to being conchscooter on my own blog where I enjoy myself at my own pace and can tell myself to @#!#$# off any day I feel like. Good Lord this is stupid.
Orson Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 Hey, this is Jaap's home. Who among us has never gotten fed up? I took the e-mail personally for about 2 seconds before realizing it wuzn't directed at me Keep up the good work, Jaap
v11cafe Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 A V11 is certainly not political, otherwise it would have been a very bad bike, politicians lack imagination. Religion ...maybe... we believe, ... but it is not the same , nobody says "V11 ...help me", when things go to hell. I joined this forum for the exchange of info ,ideas, ....fun concerning V11 and Moto Guzzi in general. My posts have nothing to do, with anything else, so I don"t feel I owe an apology to anyone. I see that some people who cannot understand the aim of this forum have already apologized, for posts that I am not even aware of, because I don't read ...EVERYTHING, but STILL that doesn"t justify the personal e-mail I got yesterday, ........UNLESS JAAP your message is not the obvious one... If you send a message selectively (not everybody got it),....one can suspect that something else happens.. SAY IT IN THE OPEN...We are all ears!!!!!!
roberto tenni Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 If the site gets pulled, can we keep the Hooters thread?
Zoom Zoom Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 Hey, this is Jaap's home. Who among us has never gotten fed up? I took the e-mail personally for about 2 seconds before realizing it wuzn't directed at me Keep up the good work, Jaap I have not posted much here of late, but I have to agree with the above statement. Obviously, I must have missed the offending post. That's fine. This is, after all, Jaap's sandbox. The way I see it is pretty simple. Treat people the way you want to be treated, weather it is in person or hiding behind a keyboard. In all things, there is usually a tactful way to express an opinion. I'm not going to lose any sleep over it. Zoom Zoom, John Henry
Admin Jaap Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 OK guys, here's my explanation. I'll keep it short and sweet. I'm fed up with all the bickering on this site. The tone of voice used in recent threads is one of the biggest worries... That aside, I get countless e-mails/PMs related to this bickering and I have to answer them all. So all this verbal shite also gives me a lot of extra work /grief. Yesterday, I reached my boiling point and that triggered me to send the blanket e-mail. And that's were I screwed up. I should have made more clear that it was not directed to the receiver personally, but that it was a warning to you all; I wasn't trying to single anyone out. I apologize for the misunderstanding. But the warning still stands and I'm not persuaded to take it back. Thx. Jaap (PS, If someone feels left out, because he/she didn't receive the e-mail ; it's probably due to the fact that you are still registered with an old e-mail address)
Jap In OZ Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 Like all the others before me: Thanks Jaap you are doing a great job!! (dank je wel!) Strangely enough I wasn't offended by the blanket email at all.. As Jaap states "he's got plenty of other FUN stuff to do" I am pretty sure that "fun stuff" does not include reading the whole forum to figure out who made a posting which doesn't comply with a forum rule and sending this person an email to kindly ask not to do this again (let alone continue do this for all the days to come!). So sending this blanket email makes perfect sense to address the problem once and for all! Just my view on things... this is a great source of information and personally I would hate to see it go! so let's make sure Jaap has fun running this site! and now back to V11... where to get leight weight wheels that are not made out of magnesium for instance!
nuevototem Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 Jaap, JA JA, u are right, I reach the "boiling point" in my job every 3 days But to be honest my biggest worry was not that u were angry with me when I red the e-mail. My biggest worry was that u decide to unplug the site. Best regards to you and everyone in this forum! Nuevototem.-
luthier Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 Hi Jaap, You don't know me 'cause I haven't posted here before, just lurked. Who should question your right to have control over your own site? You are the lord and master, the giver and the taker. You should be the one to tell these foul mouthed little gits to mind their P's and Q's and pull their f'in heads in. If you see a bloke like this anywhere on the site I suggest you have him arrested. Anyhow have a nice day and don't let the b$%#tards get you down. It's a wonderful thing to have this stuff. I hope you keep a backup. I saw a perfectly good Peugeot site get hacked and go down with almost complete loss of years of technical data input. Please don't let that happen to all that you've achieved here and elsewhere. You are a dynamo in this world of Guzz.
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