Con rod bolts

[badmotogoozer]

I'm thinking about popping off the rods and having a gander at the shells. Can I reuse the rod bolts? I've heard differing opinions on reusing the bolts.

 

My thought is to clean the journals and replace the shells before I hit the dyno this summer. A friend just blew his on the dyno...

 

Why? - well, in my pre-slopper days I had seen the light come on at least once, I'd like to find any damage before the dyno does.

 

cheers,

 

Ryan

[pete roper]

I'm thinking about popping off the rods and having a gander at the shells. Can I reuse the rod bolts? I've heard differing opinions on reusing the bolts.

 

My thought is to clean the journals and replace the shells before I hit the dyno this summer. A friend just blew his on the dyno...

 

Why? - well, in my pre-slopper days I had seen the light come on at least once, I'd like to find any damage before the dyno does.

 

cheers,

 

Ryan

 

 

It's always a good idea to replace rod bolts. You can re-use them if you are certain that they haven't stretched to beyond their elastic limit the thing is unless you know how long they were when they went in you don't have any real way to judge.

 

Carillo say you can re-use their bolts if they have been torqued by stretch. Many, many people re-use rod bolts in road going Guzzis with few if any problems. In my proffesional capacity I always replace them. Not to do so, especially on an older bike, would be insanity and simply beg for some numpty to sue my arse off if he over-reved it and had a rod come apart.

 

The bolts are fairly pricey, no question of that. It really depends on how you've ridden it and whether you think there might be any cause to suspect them. Given the fact that you may have bearing damage which would have the potential to make the bolts work harder than they should perhaps the best option is to replace them this time but note the length of the new ones and keep the note somewhere so that next time you check the rods you have a refference. The fact that your engine hasn't made the 'Dogga Dogga' noise bodes well. You will probably find that there will be some marking of the shells so why not just fling in a new set anyway? They're cheap. If they, (The bearings.) are seriously damaged I'd be taking the rods out and getting them checked/re-sized anyway.

 

It's easy to be paranoid but having a rod come apart is almost always fatal for most of the engine. Compared with the cost of a couple of bolts and a set of shells the costs can be astronomical!

 

Pete

[badmotogoozer]

Thanks Pete,

 

I was figuring the same. Not worried about price on the bolts, drop in a mighty large bucket for what I've spent on this bike. More worried about availability. I hear they are getting rare... Was planning on replacing the shells no matter what.

 

In short, just shells = I can do it this weekend. Bolts too = depends on lead time for bolts.

 

Bike has 12K fairly easy km's on it.

 

cheers!

[Greg Field]

Well, I have bearings and bolts in stock, if you need some.

[Steve G.]

I'm thinking about popping off the rods and having a gander at the shells. Can I reuse the rod bolts? I've heard differing opinions on reusing the bolts.

 

My thought is to clean the journals and replace the shells before I hit the dyno this summer. A friend just blew his on the dyno...

 

Why? - well, in my pre-slopper days I had seen the light come on at least once, I'd like to find any damage before the dyno does.

 

cheers,

 

Ryan

 

Hi Ryan,

Who's bike popped?

When do you plan on a dyno run?

Steve

[badmotogoozer]

Hey Steve,

 

Nikola blew his race bike (Daytona 675) on the Dyno a couple weeks ago. I was going to hit the dyno this month but that got me thinking. The dyno will find the weak spot and I got to worrying about my big ends... It isn't making the dogga dogga noise but I don't think it sounds quite right. Running great though and the pipes are welded up and back on.

 

Greg's got all the parts (thanks Greg!) so I'll probably dyno it next month. I'll leave it together until Todd's show then take it down and order what I need from Greg. I had a look at everything when I put the slopper in so I don't think it will take long. I've been itching to use my new Kendon stand!

 

cheers,

 

Ryan

[Steve G.]

Hey Steve,

 

Nikola blew his race bike (Daytona 675) on the Dyno a couple weeks ago. I was going to hit the dyno this month but that got me thinking. The dyno will find the weak spot and I got to worrying about my big ends... It isn't making the dogga dogga noise but I don't think it sounds quite right. Running great though and the pipes are welded up and back on.

 

Greg's got all the parts (thanks Greg!) so I'll probably dyno it next month. I'll leave it together until Todd's show then take it down and order what I need from Greg. I had a look at everything when I put the slopper in so I don't think it will take long. I've been itching to use my new Kendon stand!

 

cheers,

 

Ryan

 

 

There have been more than rumours that the 675 has a reputation of breaking up inside.

I'd like to see your bike on the dyno, unless it's something you want quiet. There will be a dyno at the big swap meet next weekend!!

I got myself a Kendon lift 3 months ago. I've had 2 others, and, for me, this Kendon's a keeper! Even if I wasn't pressed for room, it still would be the one. I really do not like leaning over to work on my bikes. I want to be right up against where I work, and only the Kendon gives you this ablility.

Steve

[Gio]

The fact that your engine hasn't made the 'Dogga Dogga' noise bodes well.

 

Hi Pete,

 

Care to elaborate on the "dogga dogga" noise ... like BM I saw the oil light flicker (pre installation of your plate - not since) but put ~60k (kms) prior to the plate - mostly moderate ... I have some engine noise but put this down to normal wear ...

 

Cheers,

 

Gio

 

PS - I asked my dog to listen but he did not recognise anything unusual.

[Steve G.]

There's so many noises from these old lumps. What's the difference between a dogga-dogga, a clunkity clunk, or a chatta, chatta?

Steve

[badmotogoozer]

I've decided that before I do anything rash I'm going to have a couple Guzzi pros listen to it and see what they think. Like Steve says, there's a lot going on in there noise wise.

[pete roper]

Hi Pete,

 

Care to elaborate on the "dogga dogga" noise ... Gio

 

PS - I asked my dog to listen but he did not recognise anything unusual.

 

The 'Dogga-Dogga' noise is simply a term I use for describing something terminal . Connecting rods playing hopscotch on the crank make a *very* memorable noise, once you've heard it you won't forget it in a hurry!

 

Most Guzzi big blocks are pretty noisy, they are a design from a different age and even when put together very carefully and accurately will tend to be much noisier than most other *modern* machines, (There are plenty of exceptions. My 'Vert has always been whisper quiet and I have no idea why as there is nothing special about it!). There is a big difference though between everyday rattles and knocks and the sound of major componentry giving up the ghost! Believe me, if it's serious, you'll know. So will your dog if he's nearby!

 

Pete

[Greg Field]

Ryan:

 

If your bike were making the noise, you would definitely know it.

[Skeeve]

Most Guzzi big blocks are pretty noisy, they are a design from a different age and even when put together very carefully and accurately will tend to be much noisier than most other *modern* machines, (There are plenty of exceptions. My 'Vert has always been whisper quiet and I have no idea why as there is nothing special about it!).

 

What do you mean 'Verts aren't special? Ooooh, you're going to be in SO much hot water w/ the 'vert contingent over @ Wildguzzi forums: you'd better hope none o' them lurk on here!

 

Seriously, your Convert is so quiet because of the fluid drive taking all the rattling back & forth of the flywheel, gears, u-joint, caused by the mighty ditch pump's uneven firing pulses out of the equation. [but you knew all that, you just didn't bother to stop & think about it... ]

 

Heard a Ducati 696 go by just the other day while I was walking & thought to myself: "So that's what my SV would sound like w/o the water cooling jacket around the motor." Quite a racket, in comparison, but still darn quiet compared to the old a/c bikes of my youth. We've come a loooong way in re: noise management!

[pete roper]

Seriously, your Convert is so quiet because of the fluid drive taking all the rattling back & forth of the flywheel, gears, u-joint, caused by the mighty ditch pump's uneven firing pulses out of the equation. [but you knew all that, you just didn't bother to stop & think about it... ]

 

Nah, it's not the tranny and 'verter. It's the actual motor that's quiet! It has no top end rattle, no lifter knock, no piston slap. When I first got it I thought that the tappets had to be set way too tight but they were actually spot on where the factory said they should be at 8 and 8. I closed 'em up to 5 and 7 as I always do with roundfins and it made no difference . When I got it it had a totally shagged cam chain and the original, 'never been adjusted' cam chain tensioner and that made a bit of a noise but as soon as I stuck in a real tensioner and it had bedded in the motor was, and remains, uncannily quiet. As I said, I have no idea why! All my other roundies have always made the 'Two cheesegraters fornicating in an iron tank' noise and early in the piece I really did try to find a 'Cure' for it but most of them seemed to be temporary. Most effective is reaming the block and using O/S lifters but even that seems to be basically temporary. New spindles and bushes in the rockers never seems to work. Minimising crank end float does have an effect but I'm always lairy of closing that up to much and it's not the 'Magic Bullet' I've looked for for 20 years .

 

At the end of the day it doesn't seem to do any damage or compromise engine life if they clatter but it's interesting to note how everything in the new 8V motor is shimmed for end float and tolleranced to within a thou of its life! no wonder they're so quiet!!!

 

Pete

[Guest ratchethack]

. . .it's interesting to note how everything in the new 8V motor is shimmed for end float and tolleranced to within a thou of its life! no wonder they're so quiet!!!

Well, at least V11's haven't been stifled into submission by the abominations of Political Correctness!!

 

Zero Noise Emissions Tolerance

 

'Twon't be long before the newbs on their 8V Guzzi's will be accusing us V11 riders of running around with top ends, bottom ends, clutches, and transmissions offensive to their um, sensibilities.