Redline Shockproof (or red-light-shock-horror!)

[dlaing]

snip

We have been through it all before.

If you want to say it is no longer a V11, fine than we have no argument.

You had the chance before to define what keeps it a V11, but you abstained or ignored the request.

Yes, the bike would be so different that the only things remaining from the V11 might the spine, VIN number, Engine case, Engine number, vehicle registration, fuel tank, body work, and gearbox.

You could probably keep some other parts like the over weight headlights and the cheap cast aluminum bits, but why bother when the goal is to build the ultimate V11.

160 alleged HP Big Bore engine (maybe less to make it more street worthy, but don't worry, we'll get the weight down well below Hayabusa weight, and the torque will be better than a Hayabusa's).

Carbon fiber wheels,

Ceramic bearings,

Titanium axles, nuts and bolts everywhere,

Composite brake rotors,

Billet brakes components,

Kevlar brake lines,

titanium exhaust complete,

Some Rosso Puro bits like like their triple clamps, and rear sets.

Some frame bracing,

Rebuild the tranny and bevel box with that slick coating stuff, drilling the gears for lightness,

Surely we need a better clutch, probably custom made of unobatanium with a built in cush to save the other components,

Ohlins superbike suspension like what Valentino Rossi uses,

Titanium sub-frame and swingarm,

Cliff Jeffries' MY15, if you can still get those other ECUs built into the tach/speedometer,

and a partridge in a pear tree.

All just to keep up on the street, which is limited by sanity anyway....

Hayabusa *** Moto Guzzi ultimate V11

1299cc *** 1420cc

water cooled *** water cooled

four cylinder *** two cylinder

16 valves *** 4 valves

151HP *** 120-160HP??? (advertised kit is 125CV, but Guarro's is allegedly 160HP)

93 lb-ft(127N-M) *** 13.5M-Kg - ???

478# dry *** 420# dry ???

 

Here is a cool bike from MillePercento (who may be Big Bore):

claimed 120-130HP

Is it still a Griso? only US$20,000-ish I'd still rather modify a V11.

http://www.thebikergene.com/naked-bikes/bi...atch-the-looks/

Beisel posted :

http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?...st&p=132376

another article:

http://www.fasterandfaster.net/2008/02/mil...-griso-bb1.html

[Admin Jaap]

In a strange (masochistic?) way, I am glad you two found each other again...

[dlaing]

snip

So play in the same league w/ the 'busa, it will be a water-cooled engine. (Right there, it ain't no V11!)

 

snip

So, a redesigned frame, w/ a focus on lightness & increased rigidity = no longer a v11,

To me it would still be a V11.

You could keep the spine of the frame.

The same VIN number, the same beautiful body work, and much of the same feel, only lighter and more powerful.

No, it would not be 1100ccs, but it is not 1100ccs now.

We would jump from 1064 to 1420. I have no problem leaving on the V11 logo rather than calling it a V14, but if you insist, then fine, we have no argument. I have said that before, and still Ratchet argues about Hayabusa eaters in the middle of Lube threads....WTF?

[dlaing]

In a strange (masochistic?) way, I am glad you two found each other again...

You aren't the only masochist...good night.

[Paul Minnaert]

Well no v11 sample, but there is a G&B furia with bigbore kit. Guaros bike isn't a v11, but his mgs01 has a v11 gearbox. Does that make it a v11? No.

The 160 hp guaro engine isn't for us. It's as reliable as one or two races.

 

Tuning a Guzzi to high numbers isn't financialy smart, but does that matter? Not to me.

[dabore84]

Wy dont we tune the v11 to be the yamaha vmax 2008 eater

The v11 just isn't build for that. And 90hp is enough for the bike.

I think all these discussions are started because moto guzzi isn't building a super sport line or at least showing us some concepts, what all of us would like to see.

 

But never mind me. I am also glad dlaing and ratchethack found each other again.

[Paul Minnaert]

The v11 just isn't build for that. And 90hp is enough for the bike.

 

Well a bit more adds to the fun, and try the stelvio and see what happens above 5k, that would be nice in a v11 too.

[dlaing]

Getting back to the Calcium 4 percent is about 1.15 ounces of calcium. How many sticks of chalk (Calcium Sulfate) should we add to 'normal' gear oil to make it behave like Shockproof? Just kidding!!!! while it may work, I would not go messing with the chemistry of the lube that way, but apparently Redline essentially did just that by adding the equivalent of a few pieces of chalk. It might not be Calcium Sulfate, it may be pure Calcium or Calcium Carbonate or who knows what.

Maybe we can get back to arguing whether or not Redline put "moly" in the shockproof.

Ratchet says there is no such evidence, despite the listings of molybdenum in the mix and the listing of sulfur in material safety sheet.

[BRENTTODD]

MORE POWER MORE FUN

Hey ratch they told me when jet ski's wernt doing much over sixty mph that I couldnt make one go over seventy. WRONG I GOT 74 When there is a will there is a way that bi-ch ran like it was on fuc-ing fire for 8 eight hours and that was it but if was a ton of fun. If I hit the loto and build a busa eater Ill let you Know. I come down to cali for some smokey burn outs .

 

Busa eater

Brent

[dlaing]

Does it wear out in 3 weeks of racing by being pulverized? I don't know. But I think water contamination reduces its life, so I plan on disregarding the guy that fed Ratchet that info, and I'll be changing mine soon. I'll let y'all know if the shifting improves.

I changed the ShockProof gear and rear gear oil last night, and went for a 250 mile ride today.

ONCE AGAIN, THE BIKE SHIFTS GREAT!!!! A dramatic difference in shifting!!!

Clearly the 7000 mile, 14 month old, Redline ShockProof Heavy, was too worn out.

Of course I am only one jury member, and we need more people to convict!

I still think the RedLine Shock Proof is likely the best thing out there, but the durability is questionable, and the stuff is not cheap.

Next time I may try Bob the Oil Guy's advice and go with the Schaeffer's and some Moly

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/gearoiltest.htm

[Guest ratchethack]

I changed the ShockProof gear and rear gear oil last night, and went for a 250 mile ride today.

ONCE AGAIN, THE BIKE SHIFTS GREAT!!!! A dramatic difference in shifting!!!

Clearly the 7000 mile, 14 month old, Redline ShockProof Heavy, was too worn out.

Of course I am only one jury member, and we need more people to convict!

I still think the RedLine Shock Proof is likely the best thing out there, but the durability is questionable, and the stuff is not cheap.

Next time I may try Bob the Oil Guy's advice and go with the Schaeffer's and some Moly

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/gearoiltest.htm

Mmmmmmmmm. Yes. Yes, indeed.

 

Leave us -- quickly now -- stake yet another vicious, demonic delusion through the heart before it rises up and begins rampaging across the landscape by the dark of the moon, claiming any more hapless victims and spreading the poisonous terror of the undead via it's dreadful bite, eh, Gents?

 

Coupla thoughts here.

 

1. Any gear lube properly matched to its application in a normally functioning transmission or bevel drive that significantly loses its properties in 7K miles of normal road use enough to be considered "worn out" (by any conceivable interpretation of this term) is NOT a quality product these days, let alone "the best thing out there".

 

2. Any reasonably sane consumer in their right mind would never consider using such a product twice, myself included.

 

3. Contrary to the apparent take of others on this in previous posts, a representative of Redline's Tech department could hardly be confused with someone trying to make more sales of their products by stating there is "no change interval" on Redline Shockproof Heavy in the V11 Guzzi trans and bevel drive applications -- unless of course said employee might be somehow incented to encourage consumers of their products specifically NOT to buy more of their products.

 

4. Dave in the Tech Department at Redline Corporate offices in Benicia, CA (the same guy who confirmed point #2 to me personally above twice over an interval of several years) is still there. I spoke with him again last week on an automotive limited slip differential gear lube application. I have little doubt that he would seriously question the "wearing out" of RLSH in 7K miles in a Guzzi trans or bevel drive, since he recommends "no change interval" in that application. Dave may be reached during business hours (PDT) toll free, (800) 624-7958.

 

5. Now am I one of those people who's inclined to swallow everything a manufacturer's representative says verbatim? Not hardly. As a matter of personal policy ONLY, fully mindful of the above recommendation of the manufacturer (see posts years ago on same), I have always advocated for my own purposes ONLY, annual or semi-annual change-out of Guzzi trans and bevel drive gear lube according to the Keith Richards Annual Blood Transfusion Policy: "No tellin' wot's in 'ere, Guv'nah -- but 's bloody certain it ain't doin' me no good!"

 

No tellin' wot this half of the famous Glimmer Twins had in mind with the knife, but it appears the photographer considered it a good idea to take a few steps back. . .

 

6. Many people actually believe that their vehicles run better after service of any kind, whether they actually do or not. It's a remarkably widespread phenomenon. Some believe their cars actually run better after they're washed, after the brakes are bled, after the coolant is flushed, or after the interiors are vacuumed. Such is the power of suggestion, and people's insatiable need to continually self-justify the benefits and wisdom of their own efforts. . . many seem to have a compulsion to um, overdo this well beyond reason. . .

 

7. Then well beyond even this level of behavior, it seems there are some people who're so easily led, so easily susceptible to irrational inclinations, so inherently confused, and so unbound by logic and reason, that they're utterly defenseless against all manner of endless (and entirely groundless) speculation and conjecture -- especially that of their own imaginations! With some, it seems to continuously well up and spring forth from within, as from a fountain gone berzerk, shooting off in all directions, quite spontaneously.

 

And waddayagonna do?. . .[sigh]. . .

. . .we need more people to convict!

Yes. It would seem so. Yes, indeed. . .

[dlaing]

quote name='ratchethack' date='Jul 7 2008, 06:46 AM' post='147139']

Mmmmmmmmm. Yes. Yes, indeed. Coupla thoughts here.

 

1. Any gear lube properly matched to its application in a normally functioning transmission or bevel drive that significantly loses its properties in 7K miles of normal road use enough to be considered "worn out" (by any conceivable interpretation of this term) is NOT a quality product these days, let alone "the best thing out there".

 

2. Any reasonably sane consumer in their right mind would never consider using such a product twice, myself included.

 

3. Contrary to the apparent take of others on this in previous posts, a representative of Redline's Tech department could hardly be confused with someone trying to make more sales of their products by stating there is "no change interval" on Redline Shockproof Heavy in the V11 Guzzi trans and bevel drive applications -- unless of course said employee might be somehow incented to encourage consumers of their products specifically NOT to buy more of their products.

 

4. Dave in the Tech Department at Redline Corporate offices in Benicia, CA (the same guy who confirmed point #2 to me personally above twice over an interval of several years) is still there. I spoke with him again last week on an automotive limited slip differential gear lube application. I have little doubt that he would seriously question the "wearing out" of RLSH in 7K miles in a Guzzi trans or bevel drive, since he recommends "no change interval" in that application. Dave may be reached during business hours (PDT) toll free, (800) 624-7958.

 

5. Now am I one of those people who's inclinded to swallow everything a manufacturer's representative says verbatim? Not hardly. As a matter of personal policy ONLY, fully mindful of the above recommendation of the manufacturer (see posts years ago on same), I have always advocated for my own purposes ONLY, annual or semi-annual change-out of Guzzi trans and bevel drive gear lube according to the Keith Richards Annual Blood Transfusion Policy: "No tellin' wot's in 'ere, Guv'nah -- but 's bloody certain it ain't doin' me no good!"

 

 

6. Many people actually believe that their vehicles run better after service of any kind, whether they actually do or not. It's a remarkably widespread phenomenon. Some believe their cars actually run better after they're washed, after the brakes are bled, after the coolant is flushed, or after the interiors are vacuumed. Such is the power of suggestion.

 

7. Some people are so easily led, so subject to irrational inclinations, so inherently confused, and so unbound by logic and reason that they're utterly defenseless against all manner of suggestion and wishful thinking. It takes so little effort to spark off powerful delusions in some people that many seem to generate their own whoppers on a regular basis, quite spontaneously.

 

And waddayagonna do?. . .[sigh]. . .

 

Yes. It would seem so. Yes, indeed. . .

/quote]

1) You would think so, but I have not found anything better. The lube has many functions. It could very well be protecting against gear to gear damage at 7000+ miles, but the build up in water contamination could be causing increases in drag on mechanisms that might not wear out, but could cause shifts to be blown.

This may be more of a design problem with the Guzzi gear box than an indication of the Shock Proof having a shorter life than competing products....despite what the Mazda forum guy said about it being good for only 3 weeks.

 

2) Yah, that is why I will give something else a try next time. But I still think the Shockproof is going to be tough to beat.

 

3) But somehow he convinced you to buy more of it. Mind Voodoo???? Master in BS????

 

4) Maybe I'll give him a call???

 

5)So, you believe the guy, but you still change it out every six to twelve months???

You must have more reason to do it than an analogy to a drugged out rock star.

Do you use leeches, too?

Where is the logic Ratchet?

Why do you change the gear oil?

 

6) I agree, but that is not the case here. This was a dramatic change. More dramatic of a change then when I switched from some synthetic with Moly to ShockProof Light, and more than the subsequent change to Heavy.

I was blowing maybe five to ten shifts on a 100 mile ride. Yesterday I went 250 miles and blew one upshift at about 7000 RPM and WOT. Other than that it shifted flawlessly.

 

7)are you describing yourself again?

[savagehenry]

I figure, my bike cost thousands of dollars, Redline Heavy cost me $13.00, or about $5 more than some other options. If you could afford the bike in the first place, are you really sweatin' an extra $25.00 a year to change your driveline fluids, and buy decent oil? I know I'm not...I LOVE my bike, (although, Love can be irrational at times, too!) Carry on, or as Keith once famously sang, " I'm gonna walk before they make me run..." S.H.

[John in Leeds]

6. Many people actually believe that their vehicles run better after service of any kind, whether they actually do or not. It's a remarkably widespread phenomenon. Some believe their cars actually run better after they're washed, after the brakes are bled, after the coolant is flushed, or after the interiors are vacuumed. Such is the power of suggestion, and people's insatiable need to continually self-justify the benefits and wisdom of their own efforts. . . many seem to have a compulsion to um, overdo this well beyond reason. . .

 

I just feel better, giving me a better feeling about my bike too.

 

But there is a downside, fit new pipes they get dented. Deep luster polish demands an immediate scratch.

 

Damn I can't even wear a new pair of strides without getting oil on 'em

[Dan M]

6. Many people actually believe that their vehicles run better after service of any kind, whether they actually do or not. It's a remarkably widespread phenomenon. Some believe their cars actually run better after they're washed, after the brakes are bled, after the coolant is flushed, or after the interiors are vacuumed. Such is the power of suggestion, and people's insatiable need to continually self-justify the benefits and wisdom of their own efforts. . . many seem to have a compulsion to um, overdo this well beyond reason. . .

 

7. Then well beyond even this level of behavior, it seems there are some people who're so easily led, so easily susceptible to irrational inclinations, so inherently confused, and so unbound by logic and reason, that they're utterly defenseless against all manner of endless (and entirely groundless) speculation and conjecture of their own design. It seems to continuously well up and spring forth from within, as from a fountain gone berzerk, shooting off in all directions, quite spontaneously.

 

So very true. People have always lined up for snake oil. Some people will argue in the face of proof. I remember a particular "knowledgeable enthusiast" touting the merits of Slick 50 and Splitfire spark plugs even after the feds went after those companies for false claims. A sucker born every minute as they say.