raz Posted November 24, 2008 Author Posted November 24, 2008 Then put the Lambda target for all or at least most of the "transit" cells to Zero (open loop). This will make life much easier for the ecu and this way it does greatly improve the response behaviour of the whole thing (no diverted correction factors). By transit cells you mean the already corrected ones? This is a very good idea, I never tried that. Actually this brings up an idea for a new function in the Optimizer. What if we had an "Auto-tune once per cell" mode, that run closed loop but as soon as one cell is corrected, its corresponding Lambda target cell is automatically switched to open loop. That shouldn't be too much of a nightmare to implement. It would not produce a 100% perfect map the first try, but it would probably correct a much larger portion of the map for each run. Then verify and re-set all or some cells to closed loop and repeat. What do you think? The only caveat are cells that happen to already be very good to begin with will still be placed in closed loop, unless a little more code is added handling that too.
luhbo Posted November 24, 2008 Posted November 24, 2008 I call transit cells those that are quickly passed while the engine moves trough the map. The natural opposite are those where the engine sits while cruising. I wouldn't even waste my time with optimising those transit cells (for instance the lowest row. It's just nuts to optimise them to a certain O2 value (in my eyes, but to each after his gusto...) I don't know whether such an "Optimise A Cell Only Once" option would be worth the time to code it. In case you follow the recommended noodle pastry method it will be of no use, if you don't and instead jump around in the map while flattening it out it would be rather counterproductive. The better idea was what you mentioned before: lock the cells of which you know they're ok (setting the target to zero) in order to not carry along any correction factors. Hubert
raz Posted November 24, 2008 Author Posted November 24, 2008 I don't know whether such an "Optimise A Cell Only Once" option would be worth the time to code it. In case you follow the recommended noodle pastry method it will be of no use, if you don't and instead jump around in the map while flattening it out it would be rather counterproductive. The better idea was what you mentioned before: lock the cells of which you know they're ok (setting the target to zero) in order to not carry along any correction factors. My idea was that the former would automate the latter. No?
pasotibbs Posted November 24, 2008 Posted November 24, 2008 Its easy to forget that while cranking you are going up the 500 RPM column so its worth looking at the ECUcontroller to see where you are on the map and perhaps changing the values to suit ?I also backed off the Ign Advance off to 7 degrees for the 500 RPM column as mine was kicking back badly while cranking. I also found that mine starts better without any crank boost (all set to 0) and the fast idle only on 1/3rd to 1/2 way, so it may be that my map is still needs work in this area ? I thought I'd better confirm that the map was still as I remembered it so I went out to the garage last night and saved it to the laptop, it would appear that I must have restored the crank boost values at some point. Maybe after reducing the 500rpm column values I restored it to test but due to not getting the chance forgot about it? If I remember correctly the bike was almost impossible to start from cold or warm/hot and when it did start needed lots of fast idle but ran badly for several seconds (maybe 20 ?)then screamed its nuts off! Reducing the cold start enrichment didn't help cold starting much so I figured it was due to the crank boost (the engine screaming away after the enrichment had reduced) setting the values to 0 seemed to confirm this with easy starting hot and cold, so it looks like I altered the 500rpm values to get to the root cause and then after some success added some crank boost values again. Static Config TDC=0x1600, CylOffs=270, PulsesPer=48, MissingPulses=3,CoilCharge0=6000,CoilCharge1=2700 Pressure=249mV,121mB,4199mV,1060mB My16M Config RPM=8223, O2=0.00V,-2.25V,-2.15V,-2.05V,-1.96V,-1.86V,-1.76V,-1.66V, TPS=103 TDCWhileCranking=1 AnalogTracking=1 THR 832 704 640 576 512 448 384 320 256 192 128 96 64 32 0 RPM 500 1150 1322 1520 1750 2011 2314 2662 3059 3521 4045 4655 5353 6157 7082 8116 SpkAdv 14 7.03 15.00 17.81 20.39 22.27 23.44 24.61 26.25 28.13 29.06 29.77 32.81 34.92 35.16 35.16 35.16 SpkAdv 13 7.03 14.06 17.11 19.69 22.03 23.44 24.84 26.72 28.83 30.23 30.70 32.81 34.92 35.16 35.16 35.16 SpkAdv 12 7.03 13.36 16.17 18.75 21.09 22.97 24.61 26.95 29.30 30.70 30.70 33.05 34.92 35.16 35.16 35.16 SpkAdv 11 7.03 13.59 16.41 18.98 21.80 24.14 25.55 27.89 30.00 32.34 33.28 35.39 37.27 37.50 37.50 37.50 SpkAdv 10 7.03 13.59 16.41 19.22 22.03 23.44 25.55 27.89 30.47 33.98 35.86 37.73 39.61 39.84 39.84 39.84 SpkAdv 09 7.03 11.95 14.53 16.88 20.16 22.97 24.61 27.19 30.23 33.75 36.33 39.14 40.31 41.02 41.02 41.02 SpkAdv 08 7.03 10.55 12.66 14.77 17.81 20.63 23.20 26.72 30.47 34.69 38.91 40.78 41.72 42.66 42.66 42.66 SpkAdv 07 7.03 10.31 12.42 14.30 17.58 20.63 22.27 26.25 30.70 36.33 40.78 42.42 43.59 44.06 44.06 44.06 SpkAdv 06 7.03 10.08 11.95 13.83 18.28 22.03 24.14 27.42 31.17 36.33 40.78 42.42 43.59 44.06 44.06 44.06 SpkAdv 05 7.03 10.08 11.72 13.59 18.28 22.97 25.55 29.06 31.41 36.33 40.78 42.42 43.59 44.06 44.06 44.06 SpkAdv 04 7.03 10.08 11.72 13.83 19.45 24.38 27.19 29.53 31.41 36.33 40.78 42.42 43.59 44.06 44.06 44.06 SpkAdv 03 7.03 10.08 11.72 13.83 19.69 24.84 28.36 29.53 31.41 36.33 40.78 42.42 43.59 44.06 44.06 44.06 SpkAdv 02 7.03 10.08 11.72 13.83 19.69 25.31 29.30 29.77 31.41 36.33 40.78 42.42 43.59 44.06 44.06 44.06 SpkAdv 01 7.03 9.38 10.31 11.72 19.45 25.31 29.30 29.77 31.41 36.33 40.78 42.42 43.59 44.06 44.06 44.06 SpkAdv 00 7.03 8.20 8.20 9.38 18.98 25.31 29.30 29.77 31.41 36.33 40.78 42.42 43.59 44.06 44.06 44.06 RPM 500 1150 1322 1520 1750 2011 2314 2662 3059 3521 4045 4655 5353 6157 7082 8116 InjAdv 14 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 13 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 480 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 12 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 11 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 10 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 09 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 08 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 07 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 06 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 05 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 04 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 03 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 02 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 01 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 00 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 RPM 500 1150 1322 1520 1750 2011 2314 2662 3059 3521 4045 4655 5353 6157 7082 8116 InjDur 14 4912 13088 13008 12928 12704 12464 12272 11168 11024 11056 9504 10928 11040 11856 11552 11520 InjDur 13 4912 12832 13040 13216 13056 12896 12624 11440 11216 9648 8896 9936 10016 10368 10000 9872 InjDur 12 4912 12592 12816 12992 12912 12832 12416 11264 11008 9696 9424 9328 9472 9632 8608 9088 InjDur 11 4912 11136 11328 11472 11360 11264 10976 10608 9728 9536 9040 8672 8672 8672 8672 8672 InjDur 10 9632 9632 9792 9920 9776 9664 9472 9536 8432 7360 8400 8400 8400 8400 8400 8192 InjDur 09 9504 9504 9568 9632 9520 9408 9184 9264 8304 6224 7920 7920 7920 5728 8304 8032 InjDur 08 9296 9296 9168 9072 8944 8816 8320 7584 5968 7552 6848 7840 7840 7840 7840 7824 InjDur 07 8736 8736 8736 8736 8736 8672 6416 6640 5184 6912 6608 7568 7568 7568 7568 7568 InjDur 06 8320 8320 8320 8320 8320 7680 5360 5184 4784 4512 5520 6320 6320 6320 6320 6320 InjDur 05 7520 7520 7520 7488 7328 3984 5264 4480 4256 5440 4864 5520 5520 5328 5136 5136 InjDur 04 6528 6528 6576 6560 5456 4288 4304 4144 3952 4720 4416 4432 3856 3664 4304 4096 InjDur 03 5920 5920 5696 5520 5440 3856 4144 3840 4320 4192 4496 3920 3504 3360 3632 3536 InjDur 02 5456 5456 5296 5136 4688 3696 3712 2704 3728 3424 3280 3424 3168 3040 2992 2992 InjDur 01 4640 4640 4368 3536 2896 2896 2384 2688 3232 3200 3328 3120 2960 2928 2672 2560 InjDur 00 3744 3600 3280 3056 2736 2736 2736 2736 2736 2736 2704 2704 2624 2704 2256 2048 RPM 500 1150 1322 1520 1750 2011 2314 2662 3059 3521 4045 4655 5353 6157 7082 8116 CylOfs 14 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 13 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 12 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 11 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 10 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 09 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 08 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 07 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 06 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 05 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 04 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 03 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 02 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 01 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 00 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 RPM 500 1150 1322 1520 1750 2011 2314 2662 3059 3521 4045 4655 5353 6157 7082 8116 Flags 14 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) Flags 13 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) Flags 12 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) Flags 11 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) Flags 10 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) Flags 09 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) Flags 08 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O3) (O3) (O2) (O2) (O2) (O2) (O2) (O2) (O2) Flags 07 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O3) (O3) (O2) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) Flags 06 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O3) (O3) (O2) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) Flags 05 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O3) (O3) (O2) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) Flags 04 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O3) (O2) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) Flags 03 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O3) (O2) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) Flags 02 (O0) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O3) (O2) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) Flags 01 (O0) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O3) (O2) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) (O1) Flags 00 (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) #Temp C -30 -20 -10 0 10 20 25 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100 110 125 TempR 51466 28618 16571 9712 5956 3742 2991 2408 1597 1077 746 524 375 274 203 152 102 Prime 30 25 20 15 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 Crank 80 70 60 50 40 30 20 10 10 10 10 10 10 10 10 0 I've found a local Brake Dyno so may be able to get a near perfect map using this route as running closed loop is going to take me years at my current mileage !! (I checked my MOT certificates and only did 500 miles for 2007/2008 ) I'll post the results if I go this route.
luhbo Posted November 24, 2008 Posted November 24, 2008 My idea was that the former would automate the latter. No? Right, but what mechanism should tell the programm that the cell is indeed correctly set? Remember, each cell is more or less influenced by the surrounding cells. An isolated cell is difficult to adjust. Hubert
luhbo Posted November 24, 2008 Posted November 24, 2008 ...I've found a local Brake Dyno so may be able to get a near perfect map using this route as running closed loop is going to take me years at my current mileage.... If I had this opportunity I'd do the same. A brake dyno is the best way, of course, the more as a lambda probe will never tell what spark advance is best for your wishes. Nevertheless, I never could imagine how different maps shall give different power output or really different behaviour. There are probably not that much optimal solutions for a given setup, if not only one. I think such talk is mostly only a marketing trick and tests in the press usually report the same. Hubert
raz Posted November 24, 2008 Author Posted November 24, 2008 Right, but what mechanism should tell the programm that the cell is indeed correctly set? Remember, each cell is more or less influenced by the surrounding cells. An isolated cell is difficult to adjust. But that mechanism is already in place, namely the Autotune. As I said the map probably won't be 100% perfect after the first iteration, but I imagine it will be pretty good. I even imagine you only need to run in this mode until most of the map has settled once, and then re-set targets and run normal Autotune. The continuos correction is almost always affected by several cells, yes, but the Autotune software only changes your map when you are almost spot-on one cell and it has a steady correction that results in the target Lambda. Speaking of Autotune, after driving 11,000 kms in this mode, I would REALLY appreciate being able to have a normal tacho while in Autotune. Sure, the analog TPS gauge is a good tool when you want it but often I want a normal tacho without losing Autotune.
raz Posted November 24, 2008 Author Posted November 24, 2008 I've found a local Brake Dyno so may be able to get a near perfect map using this route as running closed loop is going to take me years at my current mileage !!(I checked my MOT certificates and only did 500 miles for 2007/2008 ) I'll post the results if I go this route. A brake dyno, with an operator that take interest in this ECU, would be really fun. And interesting. Nigel Stephens reported some difficulties dynoing his Sporti (was it two years ago?) somewhere in a thread here. IIRC he had problems getting any useful info from the dyno below like 4000 rpm. I'll try and find that thread. Edit: http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?...st&p=117664 Seems that was an intertia dyno. I'd avoid that.
luhbo Posted November 24, 2008 Posted November 24, 2008 .... I would REALLY appreciate being able to have a normal tacho while in Autotune. Sure, the analog TPS gauge is a good tool when you want it .... Does Autotune really override switch 3? I'm asking, because since some time I don't have any tach mounted. So I'm not aware of this. Hubert
raz Posted November 24, 2008 Author Posted November 24, 2008 Yes, it does. At least in my version. Undocumented of course Thing is, it's really good when you want to hit a specific cell. But most often I just ride in Autotune, taking no care in breakpoints. That works very well too but then I hate not having a proper tacho. So I'd rather have a separate soft setting in the Optimizer.
luhbo Posted November 24, 2008 Posted November 24, 2008 That's annoying then, in fact. On the other hand I've experienced no advantage of running the ECU in continuous autotune mode. I'm comuting with the V11, 70km one way, and in the morning I often start at around 10°C, while in the evening it has 20, 25, even 30°C. Same with the barometric pressure. To find correction curves for such relatively extrem differences is a bigger task, and as long as I haven't found suitable ones it makes no sense to alter the map every second fart or so. The more as I found the autotuning to slow down the ecu (despite that most of this action is done by the Optimiser). BTW, I think it's quite commonly agreed that the OEM ecus mostly suffer from unsuitable correction tables/maps, just to point out that this is not a trivial point. I'd spend my time with this point, not so much with the map itself. Hubert PS: the number of write cycles for such a CPU is limited by the way.
kadavere Posted November 24, 2008 Posted November 24, 2008 That's annoying then, in fact. On the other hand I've experienced no advantage of running the ECU in continuous autotune mode. I'm comuting with the V11, 70km one way, and in the morning I often start at around 10°C, while in the evening it has 20, 25, even 30°C. Same with the barometric pressure. To find correction curves for such relatively extrem differences is a bigger task, and as long as I haven't found suitable ones it makes no sense to alter the map every second fart or so. The more as I found the autotuning to slow down the ecu (despite that most of this action is done by the Optimiser). BTW, I think it's quite commonly agreed that the OEM ecus mostly suffer from unsuitable correction tables/maps, just to point out that this is not a trivial point. I'd spend my time with this point, not so much with the map itself. Hubert PS: the number of write cycles for such a CPU is limited by the way. I come home now from a "wet" journey....yes i confirm the OEM is very sensible to a weather differences!!! My map now is little better in open loop,i wait more nice weather conditions (rimini 2degrees,rain,wind) for tuning in closed loop,before find the offset ghost!! Yes,is not simple to find a correction curves,yesterday sun and little bit warm...fast cranking,this envening...spark drowned (not by water) tomorrow is another day.......i want to see what happens..... <_> Ivan P.S somebody have experience with Breva 750 map? I bought from Cliff an MyEcu 15M for friend of mine,Guzzi repairer....I hope to have more luck than MyP8
raz Posted November 24, 2008 Author Posted November 24, 2008 Nigel Stephens reported some difficulties dynoing his Sporti (was it two years ago?) somewhere in a thread here. I just had a word with Nigel, he now has a Breva 1100 with O2 sensor and a homebrewn processor to feedback to ECU He kindly let me post his map here in case anyone is interested. This is for a 1100 Sport (std airbox with K&N, std crossover, AMR carbon exhaust cans) and he spent a lot of time tweaking for milage. As mentioned in the previously posted thread he also did some tuning on an intertia dyno. This map works very good, out of the box, in my bike. Static Config TDC=0x1600, CylOffs=270, PulsesPer=48, MissingPulses=3,CoilCharge0=5000,CoilCharge1=2700 Pressure=249mV,121mB,4751mV,1060mB My16M Config RPM=8143, O2=0.00V,3.01V,3.01V,3.00V,3.10V,3.25V,3.30V,3.46V, TPS=55 TDCWhileCranking=0 AnalogTracking=1 THR 960 896 832 704 640 576 512 448 384 320 256 192 128 64 0 RPM 500 1100 1500 1801 2000 2302 2601 2900 3360 3654 4045 4655 5353 6157 7082 8143 SpkAdv 14 8.67 5.16 10.08 15.70 18.28 21.80 22.03 26.25 27.66 27.66 28.13 33.05 35.16 35.16 35.16 35.16 SpkAdv 13 8.67 5.16 10.08 15.70 18.28 21.80 22.50 26.25 27.89 27.89 28.59 33.05 35.16 35.16 35.16 35.16 SpkAdv 12 8.67 5.16 10.31 15.94 18.28 21.80 22.50 26.48 29.06 29.06 29.77 32.81 34.92 35.16 35.16 35.16 SpkAdv 11 8.67 5.16 10.31 15.94 18.28 21.33 22.73 26.48 30.23 30.47 30.70 32.81 34.92 35.16 35.16 35.16 SpkAdv 10 8.67 5.16 10.55 16.17 18.28 21.33 22.73 26.72 30.47 30.94 30.70 33.05 34.92 35.16 35.16 35.16 SpkAdv 09 8.67 5.16 10.55 16.17 18.52 21.56 22.73 26.72 31.88 33.05 33.28 35.39 37.27 37.50 37.50 37.50 SpkAdv 08 8.67 5.16 10.78 16.41 18.52 21.56 22.97 26.72 33.05 33.75 35.86 37.73 39.61 39.84 39.84 39.84 SpkAdv 07 8.67 5.16 10.78 16.41 18.52 21.80 24.14 26.95 32.58 34.69 36.33 39.14 40.31 41.02 41.02 41.02 SpkAdv 06 8.67 5.16 10.78 16.64 18.75 21.80 24.14 27.19 33.28 35.39 38.91 40.78 41.72 42.66 42.66 42.66 SpkAdv 05 8.67 5.16 11.02 16.64 19.69 23.27 27.55 29.66 35.45 39.27 42.31 44.19 45.59 45.06 45.06 45.06 SpkAdv 04 8.67 5.16 11.25 18.75 22.27 25.91 28.95 31.06 36.45 39.50 42.31 44.19 45.59 45.06 45.06 45.06 SpkAdv 03 8.67 5.16 13.13 19.22 24.61 27.31 30.83 32.23 36.45 39.50 42.55 44.42 45.59 45.06 45.06 45.06 SpkAdv 02 8.67 5.63 13.13 20.39 24.14 28.95 31.30 32.47 36.45 39.73 42.55 44.42 45.59 45.06 45.06 45.06 SpkAdv 01 8.67 6.09 13.13 20.86 25.08 29.30 31.77 33.17 36.45 39.73 42.78 44.66 45.59 45.06 45.06 45.06 SpkAdv 00 8.67 8.67 13.59 14.30 25.31 29.30 31.77 33.17 36.45 39.97 42.78 44.66 45.59 45.06 45.06 45.06 RPM 500 1100 1500 1801 2000 2302 2601 2900 3360 3654 4045 4655 5353 6157 7082 8143 InjAdv 14 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 13 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 12 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 11 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 10 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 09 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 08 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 07 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 06 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 05 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 04 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 03 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 02 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 01 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 InjAdv 00 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 525 RPM 500 1100 1500 1801 2000 2302 2601 2900 3360 3654 4045 4655 5353 6157 7082 8143 InjDur 14 5232 12992 12912 12608 12448 12256 12416 13600 13696 13404 13108 12288 12740 13964 13964 12992 InjDur 13 5232 12944 12864 12560 12384 12224 12080 12432 12400 12528 11984 11712 12144 13736 13152 12736 InjDur 12 5232 12848 12736 12448 12272 12128 11440 12400 10928 11952 11472 11200 11552 13556 11936 12192 InjDur 11 5232 12512 12400 12208 10880 10768 11008 11360 11168 11040 10336 10368 10640 11568 8896 9952 InjDur 10 5232 12272 12176 12096 11616 10176 10896 10672 10288 9936 9584 8272 9136 9472 7952 8256 InjDur 09 5232 10848 10768 10064 10768 10304 9488 9712 9632 9216 8832 6896 8048 7344 6880 6848 InjDur 08 5232 9376 9312 9152 9088 8576 8016 8416 8224 7840 7040 6720 6240 6196 6008 5424 InjDur 07 5232 9248 9040 7408 8320 8048 7888 8144 7840 7088 6656 6112 5936 6000 5372 5264 InjDur 06 5232 9072 8608 7280 7328 6816 6800 6896 6608 6880 6080 5440 5456 5472 5020 5120 InjDur 05 5232 8320 6868 6464 6448 6016 6224 6432 6400 6176 5888 4896 4848 5136 4556 4048 InjDur 04 5232 6736 5972 5984 5728 5472 5472 5552 5440 5504 5200 4368 4144 4560 4092 3808 InjDur 03 5232 5500 5148 5280 5144 5008 4656 4960 4864 4768 4624 3984 3776 3840 3520 3488 InjDur 02 5280 5160 4552 4320 4240 4288 4240 4128 4192 4112 3888 3168 3072 3232 3088 3472 InjDur 01 5376 4536 4264 4032 3920 3648 3360 3248 2880 2928 2832 2288 2080 2112 2128 2064 InjDur 00 4352 3632 2768 2572 2548 2540 2592 2496 2424 2572 2944 2960 2736 2896 2240 1888 RPM 500 1100 1500 1801 2000 2302 2601 2900 3360 3654 4045 4655 5353 6157 7082 8143 CylOfs 14 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 13 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 12 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 11 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 10 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 09 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 08 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 07 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 06 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 05 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 04 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 03 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 02 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 01 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 CylOfs 00 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 +0 RPM 500 1100 1500 1801 2000 2302 2601 2900 3360 3654 4045 4655 5353 6157 7082 8143 Flags 14 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) Flags 13 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) Flags 12 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) Flags 11 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O6) Flags 10 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) Flags 09 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O6) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) Flags 08 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) Flags 07 (O0) (O7) (O7) (O6) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) Flags 06 (O0) (O7) (O6) (O6) (O6) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) Flags 05 (O0) (O7) (O6) (O6) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O4) Flags 04 (O0) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) Flags 03 (O0) (O5) (O4) (O4) (O4) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) Flags 02 (O0) (O4) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) Flags 01 (O0) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) (O3) Flags 00 (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) (O0) #Temp C -30 -20 -10 0 10 20 25 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100 110 125 TempR 51466 28618 16571 9712 5956 3742 2991 2408 1597 1077 746 524 375 274 203 152 102 Prime 30 30 25 22 17 11 9 8 7 6 5 4 Crank 80 70 60 60 60 50 45 35 25 15 10 10 10 10 10 0 His LC-1 was set up for 2 volts at Lambda 1.0 and 4 volts at Lambda 0.8 - here is the O2 target map expressed in Lambda: $ ./ShowO2map.pl Pristine/AL_20070404b.ecu # idle TPS is 55 (268 mV) and we're assuming a base of 30 (150 mV) and WOT @ 993 (4848 mV) # Original is using 2 volts at Lambda 1.0 and 4 volts at Lambda 0.8 # note: throttle breakpoint 0 is too high (max. usable is 938 with this idle TPS) THR 960 896 832 704 640 576 512 448 384 320 256 192 128 64 0 #degrees 84.0 76.7 65.6 43.3 30.7 27.7 24.8 21.8 18.9 15.9 12.9 10.0 7.0 4.1 1.1 # A/F ratio 13.18 13.18 13.18 13.03 12.88 12.74 12.44 # Lambda 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.89 0.88 0.87 0.85 # LC-1 default -1.96 -1.96 -1.96 -1.91 -1.86 -1.81 -1.71 (volts) # This map 3.01 3.01 3.00 3.10 3.25 3.30 3.46 (volts) #Target map shown as Lambda: RPM 500 1100 1500 1801 2000 2302 2601 2900 3360 3654 4045 4655 5353 6157 7082 8143 Flags 14 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 Flags 13 0.85 0.85 0.87 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 Flags 12 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 Flags 11 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.87 Flags 10 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.87 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 Flags 09 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.87 0.87 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 Flags 08 0.85 0.85 0.85 0.87 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 Flags 07 0.85 0.85 0.87 0.87 0.88 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 Flags 06 0.85 0.87 0.87 0.87 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 Flags 05 0.85 0.87 0.87 0.88 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.89 Flags 04 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.88 0.89 0.89 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 Flags 03 0.88 0.89 0.89 0.89 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 Flags 02 0.89 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 Flags 01 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 0.90 Flags 00 http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=9311 http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=10687 He also added this: I don't know if it came out in the threads on My16m but I had a huge problemwith the ecu resetting. I just could not find the solution until I (very late) found a crack in an HT cap. This I think was causing interference that would reset the program of my16m.
raz Posted November 27, 2008 Author Posted November 27, 2008 There is a rough relation between CO and Lambda. I've seen various tables like this one but it's probably not that exact a science. Anyway, we can use it for things like "set the idle to 3-3.5% CO". According to the mentioned table, this would translate to Lambda 0.90-0.91 or AFR 13.2-13.3, or an LC-1 (default) voltage of 1.96-2.00 volts (which happen to be the first-try voltage in post #2, go figure). So, given we don't have any measuring problems, we could tune our idle cell for that sensor reading. The problem is we do have some problems measuring at that high throttling of the intake. The back pressure in the exhaust will make the slightest little leak scew your reading, showing too lean. So I haven't succeeded in this method yet. Now, my problems may be bigger than average considering I have a good crack in my Mistral crossover. Included in my plans for the winter is welding that and, while at it, assemble the exhaust system with some kind of exhaust gasket goo. Then I'll try again.
greenmonster Posted November 28, 2008 Posted November 28, 2008 Interesting table, thx f sharing, even if it is not perfect!
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