metallic rattle when opening the throttle

[arek]

Hi All, I have been enjoying my ne V11 a lot - 04 ballabio with 4k miles, just got it a couple of months ago. but today I noticed, or heard, some strange metallic rattle or knocking when riding from work. it is a loud metallic rattle/knocking, and I hear it when I open the throttle in 3rd or 4th gear, starting at 3k rmp. So, at 3k I open the throttle and I hear this very loud metallic rattle/knocking on the left side I think. It does no happen in lower gears, or idling. I rev up the engine and accelerate hard from stop and I don’t hear it. It only happens in higher gears at low rpms when I open the throttle. It really scared me. I really hope its nothing major. Any thoughts? Advice? Thanks,

[Baldini]

Sounds like pre-ignition (detonation/pinking). If it just started maybe it's tank of poor petrol (gas). Use better quality or higher octane if pos. Pos heat related - been hot recently? I'd guess you'd get more of this in sunny SCal.. than we over here. Could be fueling or ignition need adjustment. Try search - think others in your area have had same. Meanwhile: it hurts, don't do it! - it can cause damage - don't apply heavy throttle at low revs. Get engine spinning through gears = less load. If you hear pinking, change down (if you want to continue loading engine) or back off throttle.

 

KB

 

EDIT: See topic "detonation" in this forum.

[fotoguzzi]

are your header pipes rattling against something or is the cross over broken?

[twhitaker]

3k rmp is quite low for cranking on the throttle. 5k is much better.

[moscowphil]

Like fotoguzzi says, check that it isn't something simple like the exhaust rattling against something. The fact that it appears to be on one side only does suggest this, and on my bike at least some of the clearances between pipes and frame are very small.

[arek]

Thanks for the replies. I did find a topic like this on the forum, but no clear answer on to what it is. A few guys reported hearing this noise. Also, I do not open throttle in high gears in low rmp - I only did this upon noticing the rattle, and trying to explore it. Besides, I do not ride it hard, and I see no reason I should avoid opening the throttle – kind of takes the fun out of it. I listened to it today on my way to work - did it carefully - and it really sounds like valve noise. Also, it happens - to a lesser extent - when opening the throttle at any rmps and gear, with 1st and 2nd being almost non-exostant. I will look at adjusting the valves asap, as this has not been done on the bike since new. It has 4k miles, but also 5 years. Thanks, Arek

[Tom M]

Your description sure sounds like detonation to me. Time for a valve adjustment (world spec), throttle body sync and TPS check. Hopefully that will cure it.

 

Is your bike modified at all? Aftermarket intake and exhaust parts can make the engine run lean and ping.

 

Here's a thread on the subject that I instigated a while back. A search will turn up many more.

 

http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?...&hl=pinging

[arek]

Your description sure sounds like detonation to me. Time for a valve adjustment (world spec), throttle body sync and TPS check. Hopefully that will cure it.

 

Is your bike modified at all? Aftermarket intake and exhaust parts can make the engine run lean and ping.

 

Here's a thread on the subject that I instigated a while back. A search will turn up many more.

 

http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?...&hl=pinging

 

Yeah, after more reading I think this is it. I did remove the air box, and installed the pods. Before doing that I read that remapping is not required with just replacing the air box, but the air in SoCal is so warm and dry right now, so it makes sense. I put some octane booster to see if it decreases the pinging. We'll see. So, what is the solution? I want to leave the pods, as I really like the sound and looks - I guess performance has decreased, until I correct it. I am thinking of getting Tuneboy, but I hate that it will set me back another 300. Anyway, Thanks.

[richard100t]

Yeah, after more reading I think this is it. I did remove the air box, and installed the pods. Before doing that I read that remapping is not required with just replacing the air box, but the air in SoCal is so warm and dry right now, so it makes sense. I put some octane booster to see if it decreases the pinging. We'll see. So, what is the solution? I want to leave the pods, as I really like the sound and looks - I guess performance has decreased, until I correct it. I am thinking of getting Tuneboy, but I hate that it will set me back another 300. Anyway, Thanks.

When you remove the box & add pods you need to richen up the tps setting or it will ping. I have pods & it did the same thing until I had the tps adjusted. I'm 95% sure thats your problem.

[arek]

When you remove the box & add pods you need to richen up the tps setting or it will ping. I have pods & it did the same thing until I had the tps adjusted. I'm 95% sure thats your problem.

 

thanks. how do you richen the tps setting? i have more reading to do ...

[raz]

thanks. how do you richen the tps setting? i have more reading to do ...

Searching this forum for 'TPS' will keep you busy for days. Whatever you do, write down the numbers before messing with it so you can reset it as it were, just in case.

[arek]

OK, so after some further reading I think I understand what to do - by adjusting the TPS to a higher voltage (Or opening throttle in degrees) it will tell ECU to send more fuel to account for more air. Will this will enriched the mixture all through the rpm range. There was some discussion about linearity, but I don’t follow completely. But even so, if the bike runs well after this, I would be happy.

 

Anyway, the question is how much to open the throttle? Is this know, or a guessing game? I will take a reading from the position that I am now, and increase by? 2, 3 or 4 degrees? Does anyone have a recommendation? Thanks for the help, I guess I can get away from buying software for now - but when I do more mods I will.

[antonio carroccio]

Your description sure sounds like detonation to me. Time for a valve adjustment (world spec),

Yep! Time to do that!

[Tom M]

I will take a reading from the position that I am now, and increase by? 2, 3 or 4 degrees? Does anyone have a recommendation? Thanks for the help, I guess I can get away from buying software for now - but when I do more mods I will.

 

Keep in mind that I'm not an expert or even a mechanic, just an owner who has messed around with this a bit. That said, after you've adjusted the valves and balanced the TBs I'd recommend moving your TPS setting up 10mV because I've reduced pinging by moving mine that amount. If it still pings move it up another 5 or 10mV, but don't be surprised if acceleration starts to suffer because you're now too rich. See the TPS setup post that pinned in the how-to section on how to take the readings. Make sure you document what your idle and base (disconnected) TPS readings are before messing with any adjustments. The post says your base TPS setting should be 150mV but my bike wouldn't run at that setting, I needed a much higher setting for some reason. If you're below 150 I'd move it up to there as a start.

 

Lot's of folks here use a Power Commander to adjust fuel mapping after modifying their bikes. While it won't let you adjust the ignition curve, it will let you add or reduce fuel exactly where you need to. There are lots of maps for various bike setups floating around, and there are lots of PC tuning centers that will create a custom map for your bike. If you buy from Todd at Guzzitech I believe he'll provide a map for your configuration.

[arek]

the pinking is gone! valve adjustment and TB sync did it I did not move the TPS at all, as the spark plugs I took out are golden ... well, in color, so mixture and timing seems to be set up properly as is. Also, the Voltage reading at completely closed is 220-230mV, depending if I force the the throttle to close a little, so not 150 as prescribed. I put Iridium NGK plugs, and bike runs very well now. smoother idle, less noise, no pinking, great sound - these plugs did wonders on my car also. Anyway, thank You all for your help! I really appreciate the replies. now I am off for a ride!