election

[Steve G.]

John, the nonsense and posturing was what I was warning against on the first page. No, I didn't shut the thread down then, and I don't plan or want to now. I would find that as distasteful as you would.

'So it has come to this'.

I'm thinking it's close. But you are right; there isn't any name calling or personal slander.

 

Just a reminder folks- please be respectful of others, whether you think they deserve it or not.

And let's just move away from the discussions of guns. There is a large difference in the perception of guns and gun ownership on either side of the ocean.

Take it to personal messages or email if you want.

 

 

thanks,

Jason

 

Politics always bring such fierce emotions, I just think there's no place for it on a motorbike forum.

Steve

[macguzzi]

the one thing that strikes me in all of this is why are guns so important to americans have you never heard of debate to quote the constitution is just a fudge you guys need to face up to things can't be sorted at the end of a gun barrel. When the constitution was writen guns were no doubt an important matter in a developing country that is some time ago move on america this is the 21st century. Diplomacy is what you need not guns, if Osama can do anything for the world it would be to listen to others and consider what they have said. After two world wars in europe killing millions of young men we have learnt to get along and bury our differences and stopped pointing guns at each other.

[jrt]

Politics always bring such fierce emotions, I just think there's no place for it on a motorbike forum.

Steve

 

 

True 'dat.

 

 

OK, folks. I asked once nicely.

 

Two.

[John in Leeds]

John, the nonsense and posturing was what I was warning against on the first page. No, I didn't shut the thread down then, and I don't plan or want to now. I would find that as distasteful as you would.

'So it has come to this'.

I'm thinking it's close. But you are right; there isn't any name calling or personal slander.

 

Just a reminder folks- please be respectful of others, whether you think they deserve it or not.

And let's just move away from the discussions of guns. There is a large difference in the perception of guns and gun ownership on either side of the ocean.

Take it to personal messages or email if you want.

 

 

thanks,

Jason

 

Thank you Jason for your tolerance.

 

I understand that many do not want political controversy on the forum.

 

I would say this however there is some sort of brotherhood here fostered by Jaap, yourself and other moderators. There has also been a restraint exercised here that is not shown elsewhere, once again fostered by yourselves. Issues can be discussed on other forums but the lack of tolerance makes most discussion meaningless. This is a non Guzzi part of the FORUM allowing people who are interested to view and not have to contribute but to get knowlegeable contributions from those they may have (an all be it tenuous) connection with.

 

Politics is life, it is the way we interact together - even the discipline of how we treat each other here is a political decision, I don't think it can or should be denied.

 

But I will certainly bow to your decisions and your power (to pull the plug).

[OldButNotDead]

Thank you Jason for your tolerance.

 

I understand that many do not want political controversy on the forum.

 

I would say this however there is some sort of brotherhood here fostered by Jaap, yourself and other moderators. There has also been a restraint exercised here that is not shown elsewhere, once again fostered by yourselves. Issues can be discussed on other forums but the lack of tolerance makes most discussion meaningless. This is a non Guzzi part of the FORUM allowing people who are interested to view and not have to contribute but to get knowlegeable contributions from those they may have (an all be it tenuous) connection with.

 

Politics is life, it is the way we interact together - even the discipline of how we treat each other here is a political decision, I don't think it can or should be denied.

 

But I will certainly bow to your decisions and your power (to pull the plug).

 

 

Probably more than anything else, what I like about this site/forum is it's international flavor. We're all drawn to the passionate irrationality of Italian motorcyles, yet must approach them with a calm analytical mind for the debugging they need. If the discussions also include these things, we shoud be fine. I think allowing this sort of chat provides windows into hearts and minds and provides the potential for people in one culture to live in another for a brief moment - if only virtually. Closing the thread seems like a good option if folks are choosing to ignore that potential.

 

Probably good place for a Mark Twain quote: "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness".

[macguzzi]

well said John after all we are adults and there is no need to take things to a personal level it is interesting to find out peoples opinions from around the globe we are all human beings and in that we share a lot in common. Politics does unfortunatly effect our daily lives particularly the global financial crisis. Even if it's motorcycling politics there is no escaping it.

[savagehenry]

The description of this page says, "spill your guts here". I feel that while we are here for the great site featuring our models first and foremost, we are not simply our motorcycles. Freedom is dangerous because it requires retraint and goodtaste to function smoothly. I don't even mind when this thread gets alittle bumpy for some, as this is only words, and if you are that offended you probably shouldn't tempt yourself to read further. A very big topic of the American Presidential campaign was how to, or even if we should speak to countries with whom we are "not seeing eye to eye with". Here, we deal with the same topic. You may not like the truth told from a different perspective, but it remains truth with the speaker none the less. Let the free market of ideas prevail above all. The globes worst collection of human attrocities were in lock step with the quashing of free tought and speech, even now in this communication age. I love the continental mix that this site delivers, and believe me, I have a couple members here who do not "see it my way". I always read them because I already feel I know my opinions well enough.

And I am happy to see the personal shots seem to have abated some after a few of the rowdier threads a bit back. Politics hell, remember the thread on if a wrist pin circlip could get btween the piston and cylinder wall!!! Now THAT was wild and wooly!!!

[Guzzirider]

I take the view that this is Jaap's house we are guests in- he has put in the time and effort to set up and maintain this forum so we should be polite and abide by his rules.

 

Plenty of other places to sound off about guns / politics etc.

 

Guy

[Paul Minnaert]

So election is over. And the topic isn't about it anymore, so I close it.