Single plate clutches

[dark_bike]

I've recently bought a Scura and of course I'm a bit worried because of the infamous exploding flywheels. I checked the forum and though there is a lot of information about replacement options, most of the entries are several years old. So, I wonder what is the present situation? have all the defective flywheels exploded by now, in other words has anyone recently had any problems of this kind.

 

My bike has a comprehensive history file and it doesn't say the clutch has been replaced by a dual plate set-up. it's highly likely then it still is on its first clutch (15 K miles). Short of pulling engine and box apart, is there any way to tell which type of clutch has been fitted?

 

Tom

[gstallons]

The way to check without tearing into it is: start the engine and pull in the clutch lever. If it is quiet, it is a single disc system. If it sounds like something is loose,rattling or falling around and scares the s**t out of you it is perfectly normal and you have a dual disc setup.

[mznyc]

Hi G,

I'm at 15K without a problem ,...yet. Would like to replace but with the current state of affairs of our economic situation ,I'm holding off doing it.Pisses me off that Guzzi never admitted or recalled this problem even though there have been several cases (I think @ 20) of potentially lethal explosions!

 

Someone posted a few months back about a supplier in Mandello that they had spoken to and were are assured they would continue to produce and support them.Don't know if that was Agostini or another shop.Couldn't find out who in a search,maybe they'll see this and chime in.

[eas1rider]

Hi guys,

I believe "mznyc" is probably refering to the saga I had with my Scura recently. Check out Hello everyone, and heip required please, broken Scura... I to was a little concerned after reading all the horror stories, but was reluctant to go ahead and drop out the motor to check. I probably would not have done so either had it not been for the damage to the gearbox case. Thankfully, (if you can call it that...), I did, and found the flywheel to be at the early stages of failure. Check out the topic above, I copied an email from Pete at Agostini's who was very helpful and I can fully recommend. My bike is all back together and performing well. The new clutch is light and, for now at least, quiet in operation. Although the rattle will come back over time as the splines on the clutch body and friction plate wear, completely normal and nothing to be concerned about. Hope this helps...

[mznyc]

Yup,it was you eas,

Thanks for the link

[emry]

I have about 13k miles on the orginal stock single plate. I did pull the trans, check for cracks and retorque the mounting bolts early in its life thou. how much longer will it last. Time will tell.

[Bruce Reader]

Mine went at 22000 km. Full Ram replacement has now lasted another 40000km so far.

 

Cheers

 

Bruce

[dark_bike]

thanks guys, now thats what I call useful information

 

My bike is still in the UK because the Ohlins fork seals needed to be replaced, so I'll have them check the clutch as suggested. if it still has the single plater it'll have to be replaced..better safe than sorry and all that.

[Baldini]

Replaced my Scura clutch w/ RAM unit at 19k miles. Original unit was working great & showed no signs of failure, or any drop in performance.

 

Friction plate was about 5.5mm thickness & appeared in good condition. I don’t know new or min permissible thickness on these, but looked good to me.

 

Flywheel showed no obvious cracks. But there was marking on it right around the crankshaft joint & at the outside edges of the mounting holes. These marks coincided with position of fractures in pictures I have seen. I have not had the piece properly crack tested yet.

 

One thing I did notice was the centre washer was not flat across it's surface. I would expect bolt torque would raise stress at flywheel around bolt heads & indeed these areas correspond w/ marks on mine & fractures on others. A more gradual spread of pressure would be better?

 

I changed the unit because of the number of failures I had heard about & because I was familiar with one of those bikes. That one - John O'Sullivan's (Hi John!) - had noticeably noisier clutch at idle than mine or BFG's - eg. at a traffic halt, it was clearly audible above the engine/trans noise of all three bikes. His flywheel failed in same pattern as others - around bolt holes at centre. It is still unclear what is causing failures but I do wonder if other failed bikes also were noisier & that the issue is one of assembly. However, it is also my understanding that some parts of the Scura clutch were manufactured by RAM & indeed are marked as such but others (inc flywheel) were sourced elsewhere. It is possible that single plates fitted to Rosso Mandello &/or Tenni (we have heard of no failures on these models) were entirely RAM parts ?

 

If replacing unit with another single plate I would pay close attention to correct assembly, bolt torque, & the correct fitment of centre washer (it is sided).

 

RAM kits are supposed to come assembled, balanced, & inc set of socket hd fasteners to facilitate fitting w/o disassembling. Check this tho, cos my kit did not have (& I did not know it was supposed to have) fasteners, so I ended up disassembling in order to fit. It is then a bit of a pain to centre. I also had issues fitting mine - the clutch pushrod would not reach the centre of the clutch to release it. I had to replace centre button in RAM with part from Scura unit (which is different depth). These are simple units & would be difficult to assemble incorrectly, but if you fit unit yourself & in so doing disassemble, do not expect (perhaps understandably) that any problems you may encounter can be to do with incorrect parts rather than your incorrect assembly!

 

In use, I would not expect single plate to stand for level of abuse twin plate might take - don't sit at traffic lights in gear, clutch in etc.

 

RAM unit has 3,300 miles on it now, still working! (I have a RAM in Tonti that has many more miles).

 

KB

[guzzi323]

I tore my bike down this past weekend to replace clutch. I seem to get a very consistent 25k miles or so out of the Scura clutch before it wears enough to start slipping. Between the fear of exploding flywheels (My bolts were a little loose the first time I went in there) and the short life, I've decided to put in a twin plate assembly this time around.

For what it's worth, my flywheel at 54K miles doesn't show signs of catastrophic failure.

Baldini, both of my clutches started slipping when the thickness got down to about 4.5 mm.

 

johnk

[dark_bike]

a few phone calls later I learned the following:

a new double plate set-up from Agostini costs a whopping € 1054 ex P&P, a single plate RAM clutch is €540...

 

sooo as spending €1000+ is not on right now I've decided to try my luck and ride it with the present clutch and see what happens.

Meanwhile I'll keep an eye open for a used double-plate unit. Or maybe fit the aftermarket RAM thing.

 

bike is being delivered tomorrow , btw

 

as it says on the London buses: There probably is no god so stop worrying and enjoy life

[moscowphil]

I replaced the original clutch on my Scura with a RAM unit couple of years ago, as I was paranoid about the prospect of an exploding flywheel. As far as I could tell from many hours researching on this forum and elsewhere, and talking to Agostini's, the "proper" RAM clutch has a good reputation for reliability, so I went for this. It's too early to tell whether this is true, but I'm optimistic. The RAM clutch does feel nicer than the 2 plater, as well as being a lot cheaper - very light action and disengages cleanly. If you do get one, I'd definitely recommend Agostini's - they are very helpful, their prices are good (or were, before the pound tanked), and it's kind of nice to know you got it from Mandello...

[dark_bike]

I replaced the original clutch on my Scura with a RAM unit couple of years ago, as I was paranoid about the prospect of an exploding flywheel. As far as I could tell from many hours researching on this forum and elsewhere, and talking to Agostini's, the "proper" RAM clutch has a good reputation for reliability, so I went for this. It's too early to tell whether this is true, but I'm optimistic. The RAM clutch does feel nicer than the 2 plater, as well as being a lot cheaper - very light action and disengages cleanly. If you do get one, I'd definitely recommend Agostini's - they are very helpful, their prices are good (or were, before the pound tanked), and it's kind of nice to know you got it from Mandello...

 

The person I spoke to at Agostinis said the 2 plater is the better option if you do a lot of driving in heavy traffic, and the 1 plater is fine if you do more touring. I do a bit of both really. Will also depend a bit on what comes sooner: a usable s/hand clutch or clutch failure

I test rode a V11 Sports (ie with a 2 plater) and that was already a great improvement as far as lightness of action is concerned over my present 900 SL Ducati (which I'm selling btw) it wasnt nearly as noisy as the Duke either (but then that is as loud as they get - which is very loud)

 

3 more hours till delivery..excited, moi?

[Greg Field]

RAM clutches seem hit or miss. SOme last 15,000 miles, but many seem to be worn out in 4,000-8,000 miles. All you can get now are the bronze plates, and these seem to wear out the quickest.