Flooding

[GuzziMoto]

You may have a bad Power Commander, but that aside, if your bike runs better without a Power Commander then it does with one (assuming the PC is not defective) then it means the map in the PC is not correct. Even a box stock Guzzi can run better with a Power Commander then it does without. The stock map in the ECU is not even close to perfect and leaves plenty of room for improvement from a PC.

You may have a bad PC and if I were you I would investigate that further, possibly by trying the same PC on another Guzzi and seeing if the same symptoms occur.

[luhbo]

Discussions about the benefits of PCs for Guzzi engines are always led in an extremly controverse way. Guess why.

Over here PCs are not used very often. They have so many downsides.

Besides that, tuning an engine for a reasonable looking ARF curve may work up to a certain point, nevertheless that's not realy serious business.

 

Hubert

[gstallons]

The factory settings are not the same as the elevation,air,etc. in Italy as the U.S.

[Tom M]

You may have a bad PC and if I were you I would investigate that further, possibly by trying the same PC on another Guzzi and seeing if the same symptoms occur.

 

I would load a "zero map" to the PC, hook it up, and see if the bike runs any different than when the PC was removed. That should tell you if the map was the problem or the PC was the problem.

[luhbo]

The factory settings are not the same as the elevation,air,etc. in Italy as the U.S.

 

 

Exactly, that's one of the downsides of this principle. The PC cannot address faulty or improper correction tables. It's been designed to tweak roadworthy screamers to racetrack use, not more.

 

Hubert

[GuzziMoto]

It's been designed to tweak roadworthy screamers to racetrack use, not more.

 

Hubert

Nooo..., It was designed to correct for bad fueling demanded by EPA standards. European bikes may not have had as bad a problem with this in the past but I suspect that nowadays European bikes would benefit as much as US bikes as far as correcting poor fueling to meet emission standards. Whether Power Commanders work over there or not has little to do I suspect with whether they are common or not. More to do with market attitudes.

The original Power Commander was not a great product. It relied on input trickery I believe to get a modified output. The subsequent versions are better then most like products and in my opinion about the only way to get better results is with a product that replaces the ECU altogether.

[Dan M]

The original Power Commander was not a great product. It relied on input trickery I believe to get a modified output. The subsequent versions are better then most like products and in my opinion about the only way to get better results is with a product that replaces the ECU altogether.

 

Elaborate please.

[GuzziMoto]

Elaborate on which part? The part about replacing the ECU?, for a V11 that would be Cliff's MYECU.

The part about the first gen PC's not being that great? I was told they fudged sensor inputs to achieve the desired fuel output. Whether this is true or not I cannot prove. But they did not work that well. You had much less tuning ability then you do now. The saving grace for them was nobody else really made much. And by the time other companies came out with crappy sensor fudging boxes they had already figured out how to do it better. Now they make some very refined and integrated devices.

[Dan M]

Elaborate on which part? The part about replacing the ECU?, for a V11 that would be Cliff's MYECU.

The part about the first gen PC's not being that great? I was told they fudged sensor inputs to achieve the desired fuel output. Whether this is true or not I cannot prove. But they did not work that well. You had much less tuning ability then you do now. The saving grace for them was nobody else really made much. And by the time other companies came out with crappy sensor fudging boxes they had already figured out how to do it better. Now they make some very refined and integrated devices.

 

 

 

Changing the ECU is not always the best choice. I'm not knocking the product but the added flexibility will hamper most owners / tuners without the proper skills and equipment.

The PC's capability to alter injector pulse-width (that's outputs, not inputs, by the way) at a given throttle angle and RPM solves a known problem. As you inferred, many issues are due to lean conditions caused by federally mandated emission standards. If your goal is proper fueling and a PC allows you to make a correction then what is the trouble? Hubert says so many down sides. What are they? Isn't A/F ratio the issue here?

I guess what I am not understanding or agreeing with is if you have a way to optimize your fuel mixture, how is it inferior to any other means? The goal is optimum mix isn't it?

[GuzziMoto]

Changing the ECU is not always the best choice. I'm not knocking the product but the added flexibility will hamper most owners / tuners without the proper skills and equipment.

The PC's capability to alter injector pulse-width (that's outputs, not inputs, by the way) at a given throttle angle and RPM solves a known problem. As you inferred, many issues are due to lean conditions caused by federally mandated emission standards. If your goal is proper fueling and a PC allows you to make a correction then what is the trouble? Hubert says so many down sides. What are they? Isn't A/F ratio the issue here?

I guess what I am not understanding or agreeing with is if you have a way to optimize your fuel mixture, how is it inferior to any other means? The goal is optimum mix isn't it?

 

I agree. Changing the ECU is not for everybody. I did not do it. I was only trying to say that changing the ECU gives you greater capability to perfect the way the motor runs, not a promise of success. As I understand it, Cliffs ECU lets you adjust timing as well as fueling. that is nice.

And yes, any way to adjust fueling is better then no way to adjust fueling. As people have proved, you can even adjust fueling by fudging the engine temp sensor. One thing that seperates the better ways from the not so better ways is resolution, how precise and adjustable is it? Can it adjust one area without effecting another. The Power Commander does that pretty well. The original Power Commander was okay, but it did not have the resolution the newer ones have. The 2nd gen PC and later versions are nice and I can not wait to be able to put one on my Griso.