Leak - Oil? Tranmission?

[df2]

You're describing too much of a leak for it to be brake or clutch hydraulic fluid.

My guess is also that it is oil, but I confess that I make this internet prognostication based solely on your two statements that it started after the dealer changed the oil and it only leaks when you ride it. My guess is that it is probably just blow-by and not a big deal- other than the mess. Still, you should check it out.

If this is the case, then one of the oil return lines is the most likely (but not the only) culprit. Can you take the tank off? It lifts right off if you are lucky. There are two fuel vapor recovery hoses under the tank which are a pain- block up the back of the tank with a 2X4 and then you can reach under and get them. Disconnect the petcock electrical connector too.

Inspect the big oil return line that runs down from the frame. Also check the breather tube that is on top of the frame. There are a couple other, smaller breather tubes that end up down at the starter. Trace them back and make sure they are in good shape. If the bike was parked outside and got sun damage, it wouldn't surprise me if the rubber vent tubes are not in good shape either. They weren't very high quality to begin with.

 

Oh- even simpler- check the oil level. Is it over-filled? That will surely give you the symptoms you describe.

Is it way low? Then you probably have an engine oil leak.

 

Would it have that much of a leak from overfill? And would it get progressively worse starting about a week or two after service, where before it was but a drip or two?

 

Anyway...

Yeah, again it sucks that I'm at work, with nothing to do but sit at a computer, and dwell over this. So I apologize for the following....

Yes it also sucks that the one and only time I ever bring one of my bikes to a shop and allow them to do the oil change, I have issues. I have no idea what they put in for oil (dyno, synthetic, etc. which irks me, yes I could call...). Then there is the fact there's no site glass, or center stand, so even if there were a site glass, it wouldn't be straight when viewing, nor is it really possible to pull the dipstic while holding the bike level without the fear of dropping it, nor has there been any faith (according to this site) about how accurate the dipstick is....

It should be like the gearbox, pull the site plug and fill it till it drips.

 

 

Again, sorry.

[Dan M]

Good catch by jrt. I didn't even consider the dealer may have overfilled it and it is dumping into the breather. Makes perfect sense. Good place to look. And yes it will get worse once the air box has a bit in it.

 

Yes there is a lot of controversy about the high tech operation of reading the oil level, but if you sit on the bike to hold it fairly level and wipe the stick and screw it in then pull it and check it you will see if you are in the ball park. If it is over the full line by much you will burp some out when riding.

[df2]

Good catch by jrt. I didn't even consider the dealer may have overfilled it and it is dumping into the breather. Makes perfect sense. Good place to look. And yes it will get worse once the air box has a bit in it.

 

Yes there is a lot of controversy about the high tech operation of reading the oil level, but if you sit on the bike to hold it fairly level and wipe the stick and screw it in then pull it and check it you will see if you are in the ball park. If it is over the full line by much you will burp some out when riding.

 

 

Yup, I agree, good catch. It is not easy diagnosing something in this manner (forum) and I appreciate all suggestions, as each one gives me more insight into the bike and the ability to self diagnose similar issues in the future. As always...start simple and work forward.

 

 

I'm going to try and give this thread a break for now, and for my own sanity, until I find the source of the leak. I'll post what I find and then will probably have a flurry of questions.

 

 

Cheers!

[df2]

Did the leak test with a good cleaning and a bottle of my wife's baby powder.....

 

DING DING DING DING...And the winner is.....

 

Breather hose at the aft where it clamps to the engine block. Everywhere else was bone dry.

 

I did this check this morning before leaving for work so all I have is the diagnosis for now.

There is a hose clamp on the thing and maybe it's just loose. I'll get further into it Saturday morning when I have the time, since the oil may be just traveling down it and

the failure may be somewhere else on the hose.

 

Thanks Everyone!

 

I'll search the forum and see if there is more info on what needs to come off to replace the hose. Looks like a bear to replace.

Looks like the best choice for replacement is either the ford or napa part... whichever I don't have to make elbows for will win out.

Otherwise it will be oem.

( I think I saw one has nearly the same bends)

 

David

[Guest ratchethack]

Breather hose at the aft where it clamps to the engine block. Everywhere else was bone dry.

Congrat's, David. It's a bit of a relief to find it's not a cracked gearbox case, eh?

 

For future ref, at least now you know wot crankcase oil does (and doesn't) smell like.

There is a hose clamp on the thing and maybe it's just loose. . . . Looks like a bear to replace.

Coupla thoughts

 

Not to dash your hopes against the cruel rocks of experience , but it's highly unlikely that tightening the hose clamp at the aft end will help here. The hose isn't under much of any pressure, and if it's like mine was, the hose will be baked-on with remarkable tenacity to both the frame condensor spigot under the steering head, and to the block, and will need to be cut off at both ends.

 

This will become very important once you get in there: If you're not familiar with doing this, use a very sharp knife, and best carefully cut through the hose against the hose spigots parallel to the axis of the hose for the length of the spigot, all the way to the end of the hose, or as far as you can reach. You don't want to go into the aluminum spigot at the block with the knife, lest you ruin a chance for a good seal with the new hose.

 

An OE replacement hose would of course be less than immortal, but at least you know how long it's likely to last.

 

If you choose a pre-molded Ford or Goodyear heater hose as your replacement, either will also likewise be less than immortal, coolant hose actually not being recommended for use with oil a-tall -- though who knows how long they might last? Maybe somebody who's gone the full distance with it will chime in on this.

 

I know you're not interested in plumbing-in elbows to bulk hose, but at least this would allow use of proper high grade, heat tolerant, petrochem hose that's also far lower cost, and that more importantly stands a reasonable chance of much longer service life. Mine's been on there now for longer than the OE hose lasted (5 1/2 yrs. and counting) without a hint of a weep or seep, and still looks and feels like new.

 

FWIW, in case you missed this recently, there's an alternative that would (at least potentially) allow use of non-molded, higher grade petrochem and temp tolerant bulk hose that I can't recommend because I haven't done it, but it looks promising, as mentioned here: http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?...mp;#entry161565

 

You weighs your options, makes your choices, and lives with the consequences, my friend, and to each his own.

 

The replacement job is a bit of a challenge, since it's buried pretty deep at both ends. Tank off mandatory. Small hands would be a big advantage, or having a very dextrous, very strong, and very patient "little person" for an assistant.

 

But it ain't all that gruesome, after all, and for the DIY'er, the satisfaction of a job well done here can't be beat.

 

Have fun.

[gstallons]

Did the leak test with a good cleaning and a bottle of my wife's baby powder.....

 

DING DING DING DING...And the winner is.....

 

Breather hose at the aft where it clamps to the engine block. Everywhere else was bone dry.

 

I did this check this morning before leaving for work so all I have is the diagnosis for now.

There is a hose clamp on the thing and maybe it's just loose. I'll get further into it Saturday morning when I have the time, since the oil may be just traveling down it and

the failure may be somewhere else on the hose.

 

Thanks Everyone!

 

I'll search the forum and see if there is more info on what needs to come off to replace the hose. Looks like a bear to replace.

Looks like the best choice for replacement is either the ford or napa part... whichever I don't have to make elbows for will win out.

Otherwise it will be oem.

( I think I saw one has nearly the same bends)

 

David

Please consider going OEM. The heater hoses that people install are not compatible with petroleum products.They handle coolant only.When these are used with petroleum products they swell on the inside where the oil fumes contact the rubber.

[jrt]

The hose ratchet posted does look interesting, but I would also recommend going OEM if you are going to do the job yourself. The simple reason is that you won't have to futz around with a hose that will almost, but not quite, fit. Besides, they're a bargain (by MG standards) at $26.

Here's a picture of what I think you are talking about:

http://www.mgcycle.com/product_info.php?pr...58520cb2cdcc016

You could call MPH cycles as well- they are helping to pay for this site with advertising.

[df2]

FWIW, in case you missed this recently, there's an alternative that would (at least potentially) allow use of non-molded, higher grade petrochem and temp tolerant bulk hose that I can't recommend because I haven't done it, but it looks promising, as mentioned here: http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?...mp;#entry161565

 

 

Ratchethack, where did you get your bulk hose and what dimensions did you end up getting? (Napa part is .62" inside dia) Can I get bulk oil hose at a local pepboys? It looks like a good option with the Goodyear ezcoil. I see bulk hose all over the internet but none of it lists diameter.

 

OEM part is $58 and a couple of weeks to get.

[df2]

JRT, now that's more reasonable. I am really starting to hate Seacoast Sport Cycles, the local Aprilia, Ducati and oh yeah.....we also do Moto Guzzi....but barely.... shop.

[Guest ratchethack]

Ratchethack, where did you get your bulk hose and what dimensions did you end up getting? (Napa part is .62" inside dia) Can I get bulk oil hose at a local pepboys? It looks like a good option with the Goodyear ezcoil. I see bulk hose all over the internet but none of it lists diameter.

 

OEM part is $58 and a couple of weeks to get.

I went to a local industrial hose supplier (Hose Pro's, I b'lieve?) that offered a bewildering number of choices, can't recall the dimension, but I had my OE hose with me and matched it up by inside diameter. The fit was spot-on. IIRC, I got the highest grade petrochem and heat tolerant hose they had before jumping up to hydraulic hose, which was prohibitively stiff, and was somewhere around triple the wall thickness. Bulk hose is so cheap by the linear foot that the diff. in cost for 2 feet between grades was insignificant.

 

NOTE: 2 feet was more than enough for my purposes, but keep in mind I used 2 "ell's", which took up some of the length.

 

Hope this helps.

[df2]

I have seen the simple wisdom in JRT's suggestion that I go OEM for now. $26 is cheap training. I think it wiser to have exactly what fits for doing this the first time. After I'm a seasoned pro I'll try the upgrade and take advantage of the wisdom and research Ratchet has done. And taking into consideration Gstallon's point on coolant hose...

 

Made the order from MG. Nice guy Gordon. I figured WI would get it here faster than TX or Seattle and he is putting it in the mail tonight. I hope it makes it by Saturday so I can do the work, otherwise it's next weekend.

 

I'm sure I'll have many more excuses to use MPH and Moto Int'l in the future. Wish I had one of them near me.

 

$58 bucks for an oem part that others can sell for $26...for shame!

[Dan M]

Made the order from MG. Nice guy Gordon. I figured WI would get it here faster than TX or Seattle and he is putting it in the mail tonight. I hope it makes it by Saturday so I can do the work, otherwise it's next weekend.

 

I'm sure I'll have many more excuses to use MPH and Moto Int'l in the future. Wish I had one of them near me.

 

Yes, Gordon is a good guy and ships quickly. Parts service from both MPH and Moto is also reliable.

[df2]

Breather is on. Gla

[df2]

Breather is on. Old one had a hole through it towards the back end.

Glad I didn't try to fit the ford part as even the oem was not the easiest hose to push on either end.

 

Lessons learned...

 

1. Despite taking care to put the hose clamps in the right direction, they'll spin... (I created a hooked tool from a close hanger so I could position the clamp and hold it while tightening it)... what I found easest...

a. position of clamp for front frame attachment... 2 o'clock

b. position of clamp for rear engine attachment... 9 o'clock

 

2. It was easier when first attaching the hose to the frame and then to the engine.

 

3. You really have to muscle the hose in there with no hesitation.