No Airbox cover

[df2]

Edited...

 

Okay, so while changing my breather tube I discovered that the air box cover for the air filter is not on the bike. I hadn't paid much attention to the spare parts box that came with the bike and yup when I looked, there it was.

 

I know this is a somewhat common mod performed by some... so my question is, what should I be aware of in order to maintain my bike as is?

 

Beyond knowing that the airbox is no longer installed and the air filter is a K&N I really don't know much about this. The bike has it's original computer, at least I think as it's old and has no discernible writing or labeling (ie PCIII). and the Cans are Mistrals but I'm pretty sure it's the original crossover as the pipes read Guzzi.

 

Thanks

David

[The Monkey]

Its a matter of individual preference and how you ride. Those mods you mentioned are typically accompanied by an assist to the computer via PCM111 or like device. Derestricting the intake and exhaust is very common and results in more power in the higher ranges (rpm), on the down side the machine is running leaner and will have gaps (flat spots) resulting from incorrect fuel:air ratio in the lower and mid ranges. Uncorking the bike works well when your on the pipe (5500rpm and greater at full throttle). However because of the increase in air flow through the engine, the fuel amount has to be increased to match. I doubt the parameters in the stock computer are up to it. The assist device compensates over the entire range (giving you various maps to match the mods done to the machine) resulting in a happier, more efficient engine. The danger in what you have is running with insufficient fuel (too lean) this wreaks havoc in the combustion chamber. A plug reading over several different rpms is the quickest way for you to discerne the condition of the fuel:air ratio. A shop with a dyno (with an assist device installed) can tune the fuel:air most accurately, or you can choose (I know the PCM111 has it) the optional fuel map that matches your rig. How do you like to ride? I sport tour with this machine so the airbox lid went back on the bike (without the rubber snorkels). Air boxes work, they are engineered specifically for the machine they arrive in. If you've an epileptic right wrist, put on pods, aftermarket crossover and a programmable fuel manager- off to the dyno. If not so peaked then put the lid on (keep the cleanable air filter) and enjoy a good sounding smooth runner. The stock brain box will probably handle it but programmables are cheap and really add to one of these bikes. Have fun!

[df2]

Its a matter of individual preference and how you ride. Those mods you mentioned are typically accompanied by an assist to the computer via PCM111 or like device. Derestricting the intake and exhaust is very common and results in more power in the higher ranges (rpm), on the down side the machine is running leaner and will have gaps (flat spots) resulting from incorrect fuel:air ratio in the lower and mid ranges. Uncorking the bike works well when your on the pipe (5500rpm and greater at full throttle). However because of the increase in air flow through the engine, the fuel amount has to be increased to match. I doubt the parameters in the stock computer are up to it. The assist device compensates over the entire range (giving you various maps to match the mods done to the machine) resulting in a happier, more efficient engine. The danger in what you have is running with insufficient fuel (too lean) this wreaks havoc in the combustion chamber. A plug reading over several different rpms is the quickest way for you to discerne the condition of the fuel:air ratio. A shop with a dyno (with an assist device installed) can tune the fuel:air most accurately, or you can choose (I know the PCM111 has it) the optional fuel map that matches your rig. How do you like to ride? I sport tour with this machine so the airbox lid went back on the bike (without the rubber snorkels). Air boxes work, they are engineered specifically for the machine they arrive in. If you've an epileptic right wrist, put on pods, aftermarket crossover and a programmable fuel manager- off to the dyno. If not so peaked then put the lid on (keep the cleanable air filter) and enjoy a good sounding smooth runner. The stock brain box will probably handle it but programmables are cheap and really add to one of these bikes. Have fun!

 

 

Thanks for the reply, it actually answered, without my asking, some of the questions I had. I prefer to cruise and an occasional spirited back road romp, but am not into chasing dyno chart HP nirvana. At 41 and with two small kids I prefer the peace and isolation a fun ride provides more than what I wanted when I was 19.

 

I do have a hiccup or burp at 3000 rpm when in the middle gears that I'd like to get rid of. It's not that bad of a nuisance and I just ride around it, but it would be nice if it wasn't there.... I've ordered new relays (mostly for piece of mind) and will probably put the airbox cover back on and see if the combination of the two fixes that. If it doesn't I may go with something to manage the fuel to simply provide a smooth ride more than higher performance.

 

I still would prefer to manage as much as possible through the stock setup and see if those flat spots can be smoothed out.

[Skeeve]

At 41 and with two small kids I prefer the peace and isolation a fun ride provides more than what I wanted when I was 19.

 

Well, if peace is what you want, putting the cover back on will definitely quiet the intake roar down a bit...

[Guest ratchethack]

I still would prefer to manage as much as possible through the stock setup and see if those flat spots can be smoothed out.

The good news here, David, is that your "flat spots" & "hiccup or burp at 3000 rpm" can very likely be 100% eliminated (or very nearly so) with relatively little cost and some attention to detail, greatly improving your enjoyment of riding.

 

Coupla thoughts.

 

If you pursue this with sincere interest, you'll no doubt soon be into some. . . um, controversial territory. Common sense, a little logic, and some rational thinking will help you separate the strong opinions of those who have actually earned their opinions (and have also actually provided a credible basis for them here) from the empty blather of those who have merely filched their beliefs from baseless rumor and unqualified hearsay, and have provided nothing wotsoever here to back up their positions. . . and so it goes. . .

 

As the Monkey posted above, the bikes were shipped to the US with lean maps to get by the US emissions Eco-Nazi's. Taking off the air box top and snorkles will exacerbate the overall lean condition. Ditto replacement of the relatively restrictive OE Lafranconi mufflers with straight-through Mistrals, as in your case. This 1-2 combo in itself would be (and has been) a pretty well-established pattern for your "flat spots" & "hiccup or burp at 3000 rpm" symptoms.

 

To add to wot Skeeve posted above, many years ago I experimented and found the outrageous intake honk of an open-top airbox at open throttle intolerable. Others don't seem to have any such complaint. In my case, it was so bad that I put it back on immediately. My Sport (same model as yours) had a consistent horrific lean balk when the throttles were whacked open this way, and would have required a re-map to richen up the fuel delivery just to run it like that. It's been back on without the lean balk ever since. My FBF oval carbon mufflers (very similar to your Mistrals, I believe) have worked well, matched up to a PC III "library" map for this config., to eliminate what had previously been slight "flat spots" & "hiccup or burp at 3000 rpm", though there are many other parameters that can improve this as well, including going to World Spec valve settings (.004" and .006") vs. OE US Spec (.002" and .004"). My own choice is .006" and .008", particular in weather up to 90-100+F. If you're determined to stick with the unmodified ECU map, doing similarly would likely help -- at least to some degree, but only testing on the road would confirm.

 

Since this is likely the hottest month of the year where you live too, I'm obligated to at least mention such an acrimony-laden, bile-spittin' topic as hot weather lean-burn feedback loop symptoms at low, trailing, & off-throttle, resulting from the OE brass coolant temp sensor in the head, which myself and others have very satisfactorily eliminated (along with all traces of the symptoms, which substantially overlap yours) by replacing the aforementioned with an ultra low mass air temp sensor. See multiple closed threads heavily laced with great wallopping daily doses of baseless ridicule and empty-headed idiocy amongst actual well documented extensive testing and analysis, with results as reported from continuing validation on the road by myself and others.

 

I invite you to join many others with sincere interest who have PM'd me on the latter topic for further adult level discussion, who (understandably) have no stomach for the childish thread filibustering behavior that seems unavoidable on this topic on the Forum.

 

On yet another. . . um, controversial topic (see current brouhaha underway elsewhere), if you have any tendencies in the direction of the paranormal, and tend to have beliefs in the existence of extremely hyperbolic and conjectural alleged phenomena that can neither be explained, nor backed up with evidence, you might consider Voodoo for exorcising the Great Horned Extremely Twitchy Demon from your short frame -- just in case. It has been repeatedly and very strenuously alleged (without explanation for the difference) that some are haunted, while others are not. . .

 

OTOH, many owners of your your short frame Sport, with its 25 degree rake, have found that, properly set up according to industry standard suspension guidelines (provided via links many times here by Yours Truly), and who are apparently every bit as silly and demented in their beliefs as myself consider your bike to be the most enjoyable, stable, and safe that we've ever owned. Of the 12 moto's I've owned, it's been easily the most consistently rock-steady of any under the most demanding kinds of terrain imaginable at all lean angles, road surfaces, and speeds -- and that goes for many dozens of others I've ridden, but not owned, also.

 

I can almost hear the Berkshires calling from here. Maybe you'll be up there with your Sport for a color tour or 2 this Fall?

 

Hope this helps, my friend.

[guzzi jon]

You can read all this stuff, or do what most folks do. add pipes, x-over and dynolinked PCIII, your bike runs perfect, donts need no odd ball temp sensor or anything else. my 02 Lemans went from 77 bhp to 85 rear wheel bhp and got better mileage.... you can chase your tail, or you can quickly sort it, your call...... Oh yeah, I drilled 2 inch holes in the side and top of my air box, worked great

 

The good news here, David, is that your "flat spots" & "hiccup or burp at 3000 rpm" can very likely be 100% eliminated (or very nearly so) with relatively little cost and some attention to detail, greatly improving your enjoyment of riding.

 

Coupla thoughts.

 

If you pursue this with sincere interest, you'll no doubt soon be into some. . . um, controversial territory. Common sense, a little logic, and some rational thinking will help you separate the strong opinions of those who have actually earned their opinions (and have also actually provided a credible basis for them here) from the empty blather of those who have merely filched their beliefs from baseless rumor and unqualified hearsay, and have provided nothing wotsoever here to back up their positions. . . and so it goes. . .

 

As the Monkey posted above, the bikes were shipped to the US with lean maps to get by the US emissions Eco-Nazi's. Taking off the air box top and snorkles will exacerbate the overall lean condition. Ditto replacement of the relatively restrictive OE Lafranconi mufflers with straight-through Mistrals, as in your case. This 1-2 combo in itself would be (and has been) a pretty well-established pattern for your "flat spots" & "hiccup or burp at 3000 rpm" symptoms.

 

To add to wot Skeeve posted above, many years ago I experimented and found the outrageous intake honk of an open-top airbox at open throttle intolerable. Others don't seem to have any such complaint. In my case, it was so bad that I put it back on immediately. My Sport (same model as yours) had a horrific lean balk when the throttles were whacked open this way, and would have required a re-map to richen up the fuel delivery just to run it like that, and it's been back on ever since. My FBF oval carbon mufflers (similar to your Mistrals, I believe) have worked well, matched up to a PC III "library" map for this config., to eliminate what had previously been slight "flat spots" & "hiccup or burp at 3000 rpm", though there are many other parameters that can improve this as well, including going to World Spec valve settings (.004" and .006") vs. OE US Spec (.002" and .004"). My own choice is .006" and .008", particular in weather up to 90-100+F. If you're determined to stick with the unmodified ECU map, doing similarly would likely help -- at least to some degree, but only testing on the road would confirm.

 

Since this is likely the hottest month of the year where you live too, I'm obligated to at least mention such an acrimony-laden, bile-spittin' topic as hot weather lean-burn feedback loop symptoms at low, trailing, & off-throttle, resulting from the OE brass coolant temp sensor in the head, which myself and others have very satisfactorily eliminated (along with all traces of the symptoms, which substantially overlap yours) by replacing the aforementioned with an ultra low mass air temp sensor. See multiple closed threads heavily laced with great wallopping daily doses of baseless ridicule and empty-headed idiocy amongst actual well documented extensive testing and analysis, with results as reported from continuing validation on the road by myself and others.

 

I invite you to join many others with sincere interest who have PM'd me on the latter topic for further adult level discussion, who (understandably) have no stomach for the childish thread-closing behavior that seems unavoidable on the Forum. <_>

 

On yet another. . . um, controversial topic (see current brouhaha underway elsewhere), if you have any tendencies in the direction of the paranormal, and tend to have beliefs in the existence of extremely hyperbolic and conjectural alleged phenomena that can neither be explained, nor backed up with evidence, you might consider Voodoo for exorcising the Great Horned Extremely Twitchy Demon from your short frame -- just in case. It has been repeatedly and very strenuously alleged that some are haunted, while others are not. . .

 

OTOH, properly set up according to industry standard suspension guidelines (provided via links many times here by Yours Truly), many others, apparently every bit as silly and demented in their beliefs as myself consider your bike to be the most enjoyable, stable, and safe that we've ever owned. Of the 12 moto's I've owned, it's been easily the most consistently rock-steady of any under the most demanding kinds of terrain imaginable at all lean angles and speeds -- and that goes for many dozens of others I've ridden, but not owned, also.

 

I can almost hear the Berkshires calling from here. Maybe you'll be up there with your Sport for a color tour or 2 this Fall?

 

Hope this helps, my friend.

[Bbennett]

Df2:

 

If you are hooking your airbox back up, be sure to re-attach to the tiny little temp sensor that it held on by two bolts to the airbox itself. It is possible that the previous owner removed said sensor and it is already "hooked up" and the sensor is simply sitting on the end of the sensor line happily. I am just telling you there was a sensor to attach to on the airbox as delivered.

 

Bob

[Guest ratchethack]

Df2:

 

If you are hooking your airbox back up, be sure to re-attach to the tiny little temp sensor that it held on by two bolts to the airbox itself. It is possible that the previous owner removed said sensor and it is already "hooked up" and the sensor is simply sitting on the end of the sensor line happily. I am just telling you there was a sensor to attach to on the airbox as delivered.

 

Bob

The way I read it, Bob, David's bike has the airbox cover with the schnorks off and a filter bracket on in its place, leaving the actual air box intact. The air temp sensor is in the forward right corner under the filter, and should be intact.

[The Monkey]

Thanks for the reply, it actually answered, without my asking, some of the questions I had. I prefer to cruise and an occasional spirited back road romp, but am not into chasing dyno chart HP nirvana. At 41 and with two small kids I prefer the peace and isolation a fun ride provides more than what I wanted when I was 19.

 

I do have a hiccup or burp at 3000 rpm when in the middle gears that I'd like to get rid of. It's not that bad of a nuisance and I just ride around it, but it would be nice if it wasn't there.... I've ordered new relays (mostly for piece of mind) and will probably put the airbox cover back on and see if the combination of the two fixes that. If it doesn't I may go with something to manage the fuel to simply provide a smooth ride more than higher performance.

 

I still would prefer to manage as much as possible through the stock setup and see if those flat spots can be smoothed out.

 

Ensure a tight (airtight) fit when putting the lid back on ( the forward bolt receptacle is usually stripped, but is available. Try the stock set up snorkels and all then compare without snorkels. The Guzzi "sneeze" has been around since the soupcan. We all "ride around it" that which lies at mid RPM slightly on throttle. The luxury of plug and play (aftermarket fuel management) is that which irks you can be eliminated, the stock computer won't give you that freedom. Tuning a V-Twin fuel injection for rideability has been one of the toughest tasks for the factories, let alone those in the fields. Any one can create a dragbike. Its another matter altogether to make an enjoyable rider for the street. Read the numerous threads, benefit from others learning curves. Heh heh grab a commander and enjoy the involvement in creating your own nirvana on what is indeed one the most rewarding and demanding motorcycles made

[df2]

Thanks all. I will take it one step at a time. I have usually liked keeping my bikes as the maker intended with only minor tweaks. A PCIII may be

down the road but for now the issue is not that bad and has seemed to get better, I swear the bike is learning my riding style.

 

BTW I have been following the soap opera, and have found it very entertaining, keeps my day interesting during down times at work.

I will reserve judgement as the three main culprits have given sound advice on a myriad of topics. I look at it this way, no issue has ever

been resolved without a multitude of theories, sometimes one compensates for another in the fix, so not always can causation be 100% defined or justified.

As far as the latest, I don't really get up to those speeds to worry about any demons.

 

PS. I'll be getting into suspension setup later....I'll just be sure to duck.

 

David

[Guest ratchethack]

. . .I swear the bike is learning my riding style. . . .

Heh, heh. . . The Guzzi seductress has you wrapped around her little finger now, David.

 

She's got you believing that she's learning your style, when in fact, it is YOU who have been learning HERS. . .

[docc]

I keep finding that the most consistent way to avoid the 3000 RPM burps is to ride at 4200 . . .