Transmission failure on my Coppa Italia

[polebridge]

OK. Had my first major problem in my first four years as a Guzzi owner. My 2004 Coppa Italia stranded me on the road when the transmission failed. At first it would not shift at all and then it would downshift only. I went down into first gear at a stop sign and that was that. Could not get out of first. I had to park it, get a ride home and get my truck.

 

After searching the incredible collection of wisdom available on this forum (thanks everyone) I have figured it must be a broken pawl spring. Seems like a common problem it turns out. Here are my issues that I would like some advice on.

 

I removed the shock reservoir , starter motor, and shift linkage. Started to remove those allen bolts and boy are they on TIGHT! My big problem though is the allen bolt in the lower left side of the cover. Both the exhaust x-over (FBF) and a bar that bolts to the engine cases are in the way. I noted that someone else had this same issue and resolved it by cutting down an allen wrench so that it would fit. I have two problems with that. One, I have no idea what kind of tool to use to cut one of those (seems like it would be pretty difficult) and two, even if I did I don't think I could get enough leverage on the thing to loosen that bolt. Again these things are TIGHT!!!

 

I attempted to remove the X-over pipe but can't seem to get it loose from the front tubes. Any suggestions on that? I was thinking that maybe heating the female side of the pipe with a torch might get the metal to expand a bit so that I could pull it off. Don't know about that idea. Plus I don't really feel like buying a torch. Another question I have is should I try to remove the steel frame bar that bolts to the left side on the engine and is right in the way of getting at that allen bolt? That looks like a big PITA too.

 

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks

[richard100t]

Could you remove the exhaust at the heads and drop it down & out leaving the crossover on? Once its off the bike you could probably get the crossover off easier. The other thought is to spray some wd40 into the fitting of the head pipe & the crossover pipe. That might make it a little easier to come off.

The other issue is not something I know about as it I have the red frame type.

[gavo]

Sorry I had no problems inspecting my pawl spring , but to cut the allen key a small angle grinder with cutting disc takes seconds

[luhbo]

With this spring sprung you normaly don't downshift even. No spring - no shifting. Have you carefully checked the leverage? And have you disconnected the battery?

Such bolts loosen easier after you've given them a single, decided head treatment (bouncing) using a hammer and some sort of round bar.

 

And for the wisdom of the forum: swapping relais also might help...

 

Hubert

[Paul Minnaert]

with the spring broken I could downshoft, and ended up in first gear, no fun driving in hot weather, when the engine gets to hot because no cooling.

[raz]

I use heat (cheap "spray can" torch) for disassembling exhaust. Works like a charm. Without heat it's a PITA.

[Baldini]

Could be pawl spring broke, if you already checked external, lever, linkage etc, then that's next place to look. I had one break twice & both times I could just about get it to go between lower gears one or two times, & into neutral - can't remember now exactly.

I would stick with the cut down allen key. As said already a mini-grinder will do it easy. Just make sure key end's a good fit in the bolt head. Like (I think) Luhbo is saying - you'll probably need to shock bolt to loosen it, don't just use force, if it's very tight you could just force the key out & distort the faces on key & bolt - a sharp tap with a hammer on end of key to initiate turn is better.

 

KB

[Tom M]

I have an FBF crossover too and I've swapped out the pawl spring twice now without removing it. I did need to cut down an allen key to get at that one bolt. I cut it with a cut-off wheel mounted in a dremel tool. BFG and KB have both posted lots of good pics in the past that I found extremely helpful when I did mine. Good luck!

[polebridge]

Thanks everybody.

 

Progress so far? Let's see. I went out and bought a cheap torch to attempt to heat the X-Pipe and remove it. No luck there. I think if I ever want to replace that thing I will have to cut it off. I even tried the suggestion to remove the header pipes and drop the whole assembly but that doesn't work either.

 

So...I bought a pneumatic hand tool for pipe cutting and a small bench mounted vise (about time I owned a vise I guess). I clamped an allen wrench into the vise and viola! I was able to cut it down no headaches. Using this I was able to get all eleven of those allen bolts removed (although, even with this modified tool, that lower left one is a real PITA. Wish I could get that X-Pipe off!). By the way, that advice to give the bolts a light rap with a hammer is great. That really made them much easier to remove. Thanks.

 

So here is were I am with this. I got all eleven bolts out but the shift assembly doesn't seem to want to budge. Did I forget something or do I need another hammer trick?!

 

I feel I am getting close here! This Moto Guzzi ownership thing is quite an adventure! If it wasn't for this forum, especially giving the lack of dealerships, I don't know how I could possibly navigate it.

[Tom M]

So here is were I am with this. I got all eleven bolts out but the shift assembly doesn't seem to want to budge. Did I forget something or do I need another hammer trick?!

 

I had the same problem the first time I did mine. Here's what I did;

There's a place along the bottom of the transmission where the shifter plate doesn't quite match the profile of the transmission. It's like a tab that sticks out a bit. If you feel along the seam between the plate and the transmission you will find it. I put a ~1' long 1" wooden dowel against that tab from the other side of the bike, gave it a light tap with a plastic hammer, and the shifter plate popped right off.

[polebridge]

I had the same problem the first time I did mine. Here's what I did;

There's a place along the bottom of the transmission where the shifter plate doesn't quite match the profile of the transmission. It's like a tab that sticks out a bit. If you feel along the seam between the plate and the transmission you will find it. I put a ~1' long 1" wooden dowel against that tab from the other side of the bike, gave it a light tap with a plastic hammer, and the shifter plate popped right off.

 

Ah..another hammer trick! Did not know they made them in plastic. Is that a special Moto Guzzi tool?

 

Thanks for the tip. I'll give that one a try tonight I hope. Has anyone figured out yet how to carry a hammer in their Guzzi's tool kit?

[polebridge]

OK. I got the thing off and sure enough, I have a broken spring in there. I measured the post that the spring rides on and it looks like it is actually a bit smaller that 15mm (assuming my calc is right. 25.4mm = 1 inch right?).

 

Now I just have to make sure I order the right replacement and wait I guess. I think I will order two of them just in case.

 

Thanks everyone. I'll update this post when I am finished or if I have any other issues that I need help with (of course).

[polebridge]

OK. I took the advice I found in the FAQ section and called Bonnie of Cannon Race Craft ( http://www.cannonracecraft.com ) at (405) 524 7223 and ordered two (one spare) of their improved springs (very nice people by the way). They priority mailed them so I hope to see them soon. I'll post back on how the installation goes with these.

 

In the meantime, is it true that I do not need any type of gasket when bolting the shift assembly back to the trans? Should I at least use some kind of liquid gasket or something? Seems like it will leak for sure if I don't.

 

Thanks.

[ScottS]

OK. I took the advice I found in the FAQ section and called Bonnie of Cannon Race Craft ( http://www.cannonracecraft.com ) at (405) 524 7223 and ordered two (one spare) of their improved springs (very nice people by the way). They priority mailed them so I hope to see them soon. I'll post back on how the installation goes with these.

 

In the meantime, is it true that I do not need any type of gasket when bolting the shift assembly back to the trans? Should I at least use some kind of liquid gasket or something? Seems like it will leak for sure if I don't.

 

Thanks.

 

 

Boy us rookies could really use pictures !

[polebridge]

Boy us rookies could really use pictures !

 

I am a new to this also. I got some good pictures from the FAQ section on this topic. Check out these links:

 

http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=2778

http://homepage.mac.com/davidboyd1/GuzziRe...otoAlbum28.html

 

 

Hope this helps.