Guzzichondria

[docc]

To give the proper credit where the credit is properly due, it is the article Moto Guzzi V11 Sport in Motorcyclist, October 2000, where the author, John Burns, concludes by saying,

 

"Progress is sometimes a while in coming at Moto Guzzi, and sometimes Guzzi progress has a slightly regressive quality to it - but overall this is a fine piece of work in need of a little owner involvement or maybe just tolerance."

 

If Burns had known, at the time, he would have said, "Expect to join V11LeMans.com; post prolifically, it's part of the owner involvement."

 

 

A "fine piece of work" indeed!

[cola]

OK Just to add some balance here ...

 

I was chatting with an old friend over lunch who used to ride a Honda VF500F2 - and I mentioned seeing one for sale 'immaculate' for about £800.

 

'I wouldn't have another one of those pieces of sh*t if I was paid!' he said. I thought he liked it ...

 

'I loved it when it worked - but it ran its big end bearings at 3 months old. Honda couldn't get the parts so it sat in the workshop over winter. When I got it back I rode it round the block and it bust its little end bearings, so it was back in the shop for another couple of months, and when it came out from that I noticed the frame tubes were bulging. They'd filled up with water which had then frozen - wrote the frame off. I sold it after that.'

 

treading in Honda's footsteps? LOL

[ScottS]

To give the proper credit where the credit is properly due, it is the article Moto Guzzi V11 Sport in Motorcyclist, October 2000, where the author, John Burns, concludes by saying,

 

"Progress is sometimes a while in coming at Moto Guzzi, and sometimes Guzzi progress has a slightly regressive quality to it - but overall this is a fine piece of work in need of a little owner involvement or maybe just tolerance."

 

If Burns had known, at the time, he would have said, "Expect to join V11LeMans.com; post prolifically, it's part of the owner involvement."

 

 

A "fine piece of work" indeed!

 

 

Great catch- I love that quote !

[dark_bike]

With old Bitish cars and bikes the quip usually is: if you don't have any oil leaking, then you should get seriously worried. In a way it's the same with Guzzis, only with noises. They come and go, some stay. I guess you have to learn which ones are expensive noises and which arent. If they get worse quickly it's usually a bad sign.

 

I had a faulty oil sender as well, it didnt light up with the ignition on. I replaced it (bit fiddly) and not long afterwards that side of the engine was wet with oil. OMG. Leaking cylinder gasket? cracked crankcase? blocked breather? head bolts needing tightening? no, the new oil sender got ever so slightly damaged during fitting causing it to leak ( why didnt they put the @&%$§!! thing in a more accesible place? and why didnt they put the oil filler on the other side of the engine?) . Morale: the cause is usually quite simple, and 99 out of 100 times in a crappy part bought in by Guzzi.

 

Its the owners of overly reliable BMWs etc who should get seriously worried about noises...

 

Guzzi et al are machines, Suzukis et al are appliances.

[Baldini]

Guzzi et al are machines, Suzukis et al are appliances.

 

Or are they perhaps, just better designed machines?

[GuzziMoto]

Or are they perhaps, just better designed machines?

That is not a Suzuki, it's a Honda. And it is not a typical massed produced Honda designed by committees of bean counters but one designed by race engineers. One of the truly cool Honda's you could buy. Honda doesn't build bikes like that any more. Although the ST1300 is kinda cool. If only it had a soul.

[docc]

On 7/21/2010 at 5:13 PM, GuzziMoto said:

That is not a Suzuki, it's a Honda. And it is not a typical massed produced Honda designed by committees of bean counters but one designed by race engineers. One of the truly cool Honda's you could buy. Honda doesn't build bikes like that any more. Although the ST1300 is kinda cool. If only it had a soul.

 

Hondas can be 'given' character, but it ain't easy. First, buy a Honda nobody wants. Modify the intake, exhaust and electrical harness. Rejet the carburettor. About ten times. Wreck it and rebuild it. Keep it 18 years and ride it 46,000 miles. Maybe a blue dot tail light and some bar end mirrors. Outride some poor unsuspecting chap on a Ninja. Keep it til one of your kids thinks it's the coolest bike in the world.

 

Instant character!

 

[luhbo]

Today these bikes indeed are "end-cool". Here is the one I recently revived after some 20 years for my elder son. 20kw - yet it moves. Amazing!

 

 

The only problem is: you really need space if you're a messy like that. Besides that, I'm sure a Clubman like yours would still fit in some corner. The times when this was a bike nobody wanted definitely are history.

 

Hubert

[GuzziMoto]

In my opinion there have been plenty of cool bikes with character, if not soul, built by the Japanese companies in the past. Not even that distant past either.

It is in recent times that they have contracted and condensed their line ups down to certain formats.

Not much thinking outside the box, and when they do it seems to result in answers to questions nobody asked.

[dark_bike]

Or are they perhaps, just better designed machines?

 

Interestingly, in German there is an expression which says that the better is the enemy of the good. It may be better designed but if it thereby gains the character of an appliance, is it therefore a better (more fun) bike?

[docc]

Interestingly, in German there is an expression which says that the better is the enemy of the good. It may be better designed but if it thereby gains the character of an appliance, is it therefore a better (more fun) bike?

 

Interesting that "the good" or "quality" was all the theme of Pirsig's book, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance. By all accounts, he rode a Honda (early 305), but was right engaged with its running and upkeep. I recall his account of his BMW friend who was offended by the offer to shim a loose part with the aluminum from the beer can. Maybe if it had been Bavarian beer!

 

How "character" might be different from the "soul" of a machine, I do not know. This whole concept of imparting animism to machines is quite, er, speculative, as you may know.

 

Yet, as T.E. Lawrence once said (and, oh but do I paraphrase deeply), "We know if the Guzzi loves us, or no. And if she does, there is no greater feeling to the wind." (I'll dig up the man's real words before his ghost comes back to haunt my lovely Sport!)

 

And, Hubert, an SR500? That's the bike that got me into riding! Beautiful with the red stripes!

[gstallons]

Rock & Roll is said to be divided into two categories; those who have listened to The Velvet Underground and those who haven't.

With that being said, the same goes to Zen & the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance. if you ride without reading it you are not whole. That book provided a catharsis a man does not feel very often in his life.

p.s. It has some mistakes, but...........

[Baldini]

Rock & Roll is said to be divided into two categories; those who have listened to The Velvet Underground and those who haven't....

I'm guessing it was a Velvet Underground fan said that?

 

... the same goes to Zen & the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance. if you ride without reading it you are not whole. That book provided a catharsis a man does not feel very often in his life...

I got bored half way thru & put it down. Did the second half of the book contained some extraordinary revelation?

I thought I felt & understood what Pirsig was getting at, but found his writing laboured & repetetive. Other books address similar issues in (for me) a more concise & involving manner. Trustee From The Toolroom by Nevil Shute is a favourite of mine.

 

If it is not already in you can you gain it from literature? Does any art just bring into focus something we all already (maybe unwittingly) posess?

 

All I'm saying is there's more than one way to skin a cat.

 

KB

[Baldini]

...How "character" might be different from the "soul" of a machine, I do not know. This whole concept of imparting animism to machines is quite, er, speculative, as you may know...

 

A machine contains the effort of the people who designed & built it. Their character is present in it's. Different societies have different pr-occupations. If we find Japanese machines "without soul", perhaps it's cos we are not Japanese.

 

KB

[Baldini]

Interestingly, in German there is an expression which says that the better is the enemy of the good. It may be better designed but if it thereby gains the character of an appliance, is it therefore a better (more fun) bike?

We have the same expression & maybe you're right - for some. But for others, maybe the best functioning machine is better. Guess it depends on what you want a bike to give you.

KB