lithium motorcycle battery

[Bbennett]

Bump 2012: So has anyone tried the Shorai on a V11 here? They are way lighter...

 

Link to Shorai battery description for V11

[GuzziMoto]

I have two Shorai's, one in my Griso and one in my SuperMoto. The SuperMoto works great with it. The weight is possibly noticeable, but the bike originally came with a very small battery so the difference is not that great. But the Shorai seems to have more power then the original battery on that bike. Originally I had replaced the stock battery with an Odyssey PC310. That battery was great but it was a little big for the SuperMoto. So I put that battery on my Daytona and got a Shorai to replace it.

The Griso is another story. The Griso developed the no-start issue after switching. The no-start issue is not uncommon in new Guzzi's, having to do with the ECU sensing too low a voltage and aborting the start. But I never had an issue with it until I switched to the Shorai. I have since added an additional relay that hopefully resolve the no-start issue so hopefully I will not have the issue any more. I have to say, though, the notion that saving a few pounds by running a light weight battery on a bike as heavy as a Guzzi..... well, if you are expecting to be able to notice the difference you are mistaken. And if you have swapped to a light weight battery on a Guzzi and you think you CAN feel the difference you are deluded.

But they are cool and hopefully they will hold up.

All in all I prefer the Odyssey PC310 in my Daytona, it is rated less power then the Shorai but it is hard to compare different battery types as they measure current differently) but it has more power and holds a charge for a long time. It is heavier, but not really any larger.

[Skeeve]

I have to say, though, the notion that saving a few pounds by running a light weight battery on a bike as heavy as a Guzzi..... well, if you are expecting to be able to notice the difference you are mistaken. And if you have swapped to a light weight battery on a Guzzi and you think you CAN feel the difference you are deluded.

 

Hey, 6# is 6# [or however much it is. 10#? 12?] And it's placed up high [at least on the V11 LM; I dunno from Grisos or other CARCs...]

 

Would the wt. diff. make a difference to feel if you'd moved your battery under the gearbox like on some Tontis? Not likely! But removing the wt. from on high on a bike that already carries its wt. high above the axle centers is going to affect s2s transitions: it's that whole "mass centralization" theme for their sport bikes that Honda copied off of Buell over the last 10 years or more...

 

Every little bit counts. Some more than others: I'd love to lose that same wt. from the swingarm & wheels [unsprung wt.] vs. the battery, but I'll take what I can get. The bonus is better charge retention for a garage queen [or someone who lives in a climate w/ long periods of non-riding weather, like say, Minnesota... [stop! Don't say it! "That's what ice-racing is for..." Doh! Yeah, yeah, but your Guzzi is still locked away for the winter! ]

[GuzziMoto]

Yeah, 10 pounds is 10 pounds. But on a 500 pound bike ten pounds is only 2 % of total weight. Any weight reduction, even unsprung weight or rotating weight, is really a question of percentage lost. On a Griso the battery is in almost the same place but a little higher up. Feeling the difference is like feeling the difference between a 2/3 full tank of gas and a 1/3 full tank of gas. If you think you can feel that riding on the street, fine. But I doubt it and I am perfectly willing to admit that I would not even try to tell the difference myself.

They are cool batteries and to have one for the sake of coolness is fine. I bought two out of curiosity, plus the SuperMoto needed a more powerful battery then the stocker yet the Odyssey was a little too large. On the other hand my Daytona could use a smaller battery then stock because I swapped the rear subframe to a V11 subframe and had no room for the Odyssey battery it had. It all kinda worked out, except the reduction in cranking power of the Shorai seemed to trigger the no-start issue that some experience with the late-model Guzzi's. They are also much more noticeably impacted by low temp making it hard to start then either my Odyssey or a normal gel acid battery.

I do agree with Buell and mass centralization, but again, improvements are relative and tend to be a question of percentage. A 10 pound change on a 300 pound bike you may be able to feel. On a 500 pound bike that same 10 pound change is not going to have the same impact. Even unsprung or rotating weight it still comes down to percentages. A 2% reduction in unsprung weight would also be hard to notice. A two percent reduction in rotating weight might have a more noticable impact but that is a function of rotating weight having a larger impact on performance/handling then either unsprung weight or normal weight.

[dale-j]

I have a Ballistic Evo 2 (LiFePo) 12 cell in my 2004 LeMans and have to say I am very pleased with it. It is small enough that I can now (in addition to the battery) fit a Stop n Go Tire repair kit and my PC3 in the battery area, and it has more juice than the original battery did. Weight savings (the thing weighs 2lbs 5oz) are a bonus but the size and durability are what sold me. It also has a really well designed (long, high quality) metric bolt system for attaching terminals.

 

I did pony up the $71.95 for the special charger that will rebalance the cells, it is FANTASTIC, has settings for all kinds of battery and I use it for all of mine now.

 

Ballistic Battery 12 Cell EVO 2 Lithium (2lb 5oz) - Type: L, - left, + right, $170.99

 

I ordered mine from Daniel at SoloMotoParts and they were great to deal with. Shipping to Canada (we usually get gouged badly) was only $28.65 and due to the battery being made in the USA there was no duty charged coming across the border (YMMV).

[richard100t]

Yes the Guzzi weighs 500lbs. The newer model Yamaha R1 only weighs about 50lbs less. Once you switch to carbon pipes, lose the airbox and the pollution cans you're down to maybe 470 or so. Swap the battery, drop ten more pounds and guess what! Your 500lb Guzzi is now a more respectable 450lb bike and you havent even touched the wheels. Theres another 25lbs there you can lose.

Ten pounds by itself isnt much. But when you start subtracting ten here and ten there it all adds up.

You're going to have to buy a battery sooner or later anyway right?

[dale-j]

Any weight savings helps, but to be honest I just figured that with the smaller size, higher AH rating, faster recovery time and longer life (10 yrs) it was worth the premium on price regardless. I have Hepco and Becker bags that add back all the weight savings, but yeah no value in having extra weight in the battery so why cart it around?? If I could actually *feel* the difference riding it, I would be have to be a better rider than I can claim to be though....

[Bbennett]

Does anyone know the model # of the Shorai battery that would work in a V11?

 

Thanks,

Bob

[AndyH]

Does anyone know the model # of the Shorai battery that would work in a V11?

 

Thanks,

Bob

Hang on, I thought the link in your own post on this topic answers that question (i.e LFX18L1-BS12) or am I on the wrong end of a stick here?

 

AndyH

[Bbennett]

Doh! yes it is there - my bad

[smmudd83_1999]

 

Does anyone know the model # of the Shorai battery that would work in a V11?

 

Thanks,

Bob

Hang on, I thought the link in your own post on this topic answers that question (i.e LFX18L1-BS12) or am I on the wrong end of a stick here?

 

AndyH

 

I believe that if you live in colder climates, the 18-size battery isn't big enough. See here 

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=52459.0

and here

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=47457.msg763649#msg763649

Shorai lists the 18 on their website, but have recommended the LFX 24 or 27 to others. For some of us with Power Commanders under our seats the 24 and 27 are too large. Some have had good experiences with a 21. For me living in Wellington New Zealand, 3 degrees Celcius (37 degrees F) is kind of the lowest overnight low I tend to experience so the LFX 18 will be fine 99.9% of the time. For the other 0.1%.....I'll just heat the garage

[smmudd83_1999]

I dipped my toe in the Li Fe PO4 world. By actually ordering one.

I COULD have gone the Shorai route (which are highly thought of here) but my local shop uses Deltran for LiFePO4 batteries and have fitted them to many, many bikes. The battery I have gone for is rated at 21-24Ah and 360 CCA (!) so should be plenty to turn over a V11. Deltran actually recommended a 14Ah battery (1.76 lbs), but with the space I have I decided to fit a grunty 24Ah unit (2.6 lbs). Hopefully this shouldn't pose an issue. A replacement Yuasa weighs 8.8 lbs and only makes 15Ah and 230 CCA, for comparison.

 

The Deltran also has two pairs of terminals so you can insert it under the seat in either way and still be able to wire to the terminals, and has proper fitted terminals not those rubbish captive nut type jobbies. And it comes with a clever charge distributor to ensure even charging/discharging of each cell. And unlike a common laptop Li-ion battery the lithium iron phosphate batteries don't get anywhere near as hot.

Being in New Zealand, I would rather have gone with a supplier that is locally represented so if it goes bad I can take it back easily enough.

LiFePO4 batteries are very common here - Shorai are very strong in the marketplace.

There are two caveats:

1) If you live where it can get cold, the LiFePO4 batteries CCA are much more affected in colder climes. Here in Wellington NZ, a very cold overnight low might be 3degC (37F) and typically about 7degC (45F). I think there is an issue with needing to "warm the battery up" if you do colder season riding by leaving your lights on for a minute before trying to start. Or stick a hair dryer on it?

2) I haven't worked out charging it. Mind you, if the battery has an intelligent charge distributor onboard it might not be an issue.

I best read the instructions that come with it when it arrives on Monday/Tuesday!

[nose2wind]

The Good

I have 2 Shorai batteries in a newer vintage Stelvio and Buell.  Weight savings in nice, but not the only reason I switched.  The batteries can sit longer without needing a charge.  I don't like having to put my bikes on chargers.  They should last longer and don't have acid.  So far I like them. 

 

 The Bad

In very cold weather they loose cranking power.  I have not been stranded, but have noticed the weaker starting on cold mornings close to freezing.  Below that could have been a problem.  Fitment for a 2000 V11s.  I have called on the Shorai and another brand and was told they do not have a battery for this model. Something about the older model charging system is not compatible.  Not sure what that would be, but It put me off for now.  If you find out different let me know.

[smmudd83_1999]

Deltran is fitted. It is like-for-like in size - no space saved. Light though! Instructions say to charge to 100% before use...but LiFePO4 s work best at 60-80% charge anyway...so...sod it. Crank. Vroom. Rode 10 minutes to work. 9 hours happened. Crank. Vroom. 10 minutes back home. It works. Based on one day experience it works very well. Maybe I'll do a 6 month follow up as that doesn't say alot.

Dunno if I've damaged the battery not going for a 100% charge first. And I still haven't worked out how to charge it - I currently have a Oxford Maximiser for lead/AGM/gel batteries, which I've been told is a no-no as it does funky things to maintain a battery that LiFePOs don't like. But so long as I keep riding daily, we'll never find out, will we?