Engine Removal/Clutch Replacement How To

[mznyc]

Makin progress.

Forgot to mark on case where old flywheel TDC marks were.A little head scratching and lining up flywheel arrow to case "tit", Pete Ropers words,and a little fiddling by confirming TDC with flywheel marks and believe I got tit sorted.adjusted valves and in the process of thoroughly cleaning the engine.Before I put it back in I'm cleaning everything.Engine,tranny,frame,all wires electrical connections.Lube driveshaft,swing arm and rear wheel also before re-installing.

Clutch hub looks the same as old one and no wear, damage or leaks so I think I'll leave that in as I don't have tool to remove hub locknut.MI did send seals and gaskets for hub and rod.Can I access those if I remove the clutch slave from the rear of the tranny.Figuring I can't but doesn't hurt to ask.

Should I grease any splines before reassembling clutch.I know there's two schools of thought here but just wanted to get some opinions,....

Ordered CF alt cover as mine looks like shite,but gonna remove old paint and give it a brushed allumminum finnish,to the old one,maybe clear coat over that.Could change them on a whim,like which chapeaux I want to wear that day.

Probably found the reason why shifting was so hit or miss,more on that with pics soon,....

[gstallons]

I would use a "dry-film" graphite spray lube on any splines like the clutch hub. Prepare it by using brake-cleaner and a soft bristle wire brush !

[moscowphil]

I don't think Guzzi grease the splines as standard, but BMW do (they produce a special grease for the job) - so take your pick. Having seen how quickly the splines wear when ungreased, I blagged a bit of grease from my friendly BMW dealer when I replaced my clutch. Time will tell whether it improves the life of the splines. If you do use grease only use a very thin smear, or it will fly off and knacker your friction surfaces.

[mznyc]

I wonder why my shift changes were were shite?

No friction material left after 19K and Im not running like Biaggi or feathering the clutch out of corners.Sporting,spirited and sometimes silly but abusive.No fluid or oil in there also.Looks more like a brake disc.

[Baldini]

Hi Michael,

These diagrams may be useful:

[mznyc]

Hi Michael,

These diagrams may be useful:

Yup I got those,they just make it a little confusing by placing the pushrod assembly under the clutch plates and not in the trans housing where it actually lives.

Thanks

Michael

[pete roper]

I wonder why my shift changes were were shite?

No friction material left after 19K and Im not running like Biaggi or feathering the clutch out of corners.Sporting,spirited and sometimes silly but abusive.No fluid or oil in there also.Looks more like a brake disc.

 

The reason for that, and the fact it has a different input hub is because that is NOT the original clutch/flywheel.

 

My guess is that the original cracked its flywheel and a replacement was aquired. The original Scura clutch/flywheel assemblies were made by RAM but rather than leave their time honoured and reliable design alone some nong at Guzzi decided to change the specifications. Hence the cracking that doesn't, (To the best of my knowledge.) affect most 'Ordinary' RAM clutches.

 

Looking at these pics though there are a couple of other issues of note.

 

Firstly the friction plate material looks like it is of the sintered bronze variety. This stuff has been used by companies like RAM and Surflex for years for 'Racing' purposes. While it has a lovely feel and take up it simply evaporates in service and is entirely unsuited to road use. The fact you got anywhere near 19,000 Kms out of the plate says you are a weak kneed softcoque who rides like a big, wet, smelly Gurl!

 

Secondly, looking at both the construction and the damage to the splines of the friction plate I'd bet my one remaining nut on it being a Surflex clutch plate. The 'Widening' of the spline slots is commonplace on Surflex plates made for the old 2mm hub used on earlier five speeders. It would seem that on this plate the same issues of hardness and ill fitment are coming into play. Those splines are seriously elongated. The hub will also probably be damaged but by how much and whether it will still bserviceable I can't tell without seeing it.

 

As I said. That ISN'T the original clutch and if it has a hub with splines more than 20mm long it is NOT the original hub. I have examples of all three hubs lying around. Would you like me to take a couple of pics and post 'em up so you can do a comparison?

 

Pete

[Baldini]

Pete,

 

Can't remember re hubs, but that friction plate looks exactly same as the one came out of mine & I had it from new so know clutch is original.

 

Friction material on mine had less wear, changed at same 19k miles. Also Michael's friction material is worn much more on the one side than the other - mine is even wear to both sides.

Splines in mine are not worn like Michael's.

 

KB

[mznyc]

Hey Pete

Thanks for the input and proper slaggin".I need a good laugh! Wether at my expense no matter

I got 19k MILES,of which I put on about 8k of those I believe but the last several hundred/thousand was when the shifting went south.The original owner,dbdicker,lived here until I bought it and she came from MPH so I dont think he changed it but not sure.

I'll take some more pics and measurements and post them up.

What should I be using for loctite on flywheel,starter gear and engine mount bolts?Red,white,blue?

[pete roper]

I don't disbelieve you. Remember 2002/3 was a lousy time. They may of been buying any old junk from anyone who would still supply them. Perhaps its just my 'pooter screen but it looks like a bronze plate to me. That's fine, I'm happy to be wrong. What I'm not wrong about is the wear pattern in the splines and that is TYPICAL of Surflex plates, (Perhaps they had to nip up the road and buy back a few plates from Agostinis? Who knows?) as is the rivetted construction and solid centre of the plate is pure Surflex.

 

Sorry, I forgot to take the pics of the hubs today, I'll be at the workshop tomorrow morning trying to explain to a pair of kids why their RS125 Aprilia has oil dribbling out of the exhaust, ("We try not to rev it over 8,000." God help us!) I'll try to get the pics then if I'm not arrested for homicide.....

 

Whatever way you look at it the best way to go is just take the whole sorry single plate piece of shit and throw it in the bin. Buy a twin plate set-up off fleabay, it a new hub and friction plates and go ride. It works. Ask Chuck!!!!

 

Pete

[mznyc]

Nope Pete I believe your probably right.Just PO or MPH didnt mention change ,so if done, done at factory.Ah ya gotta love Guzzi's "inventiveness"

08 Griso 2plater waiting to go in.Acquired from Peter at Reboot.New SD-Tech friction plates I picked up on Ebay for cheap.

I also have a new RAM aftermarket Uno plate that I bought from Richard100t who gave me a great deal.I was gonna go that way but heard the success stories of going to a two plater.

Ill post pics of parts,original and aftermarket side by side,...

Now back to sucking in 2-stoke exhaust,drinking Dingo piss margaritas,or whatever you 'Brits' do down there ya ole goat,..

[mznyc]

Ok Got some pics.Original hub looks like it has enough damage to chuck.Friction plate splines are mashed.

Griso hub looks to be slightly deeper,@2mm.

New RAM friction plate on left,original on right.What these dont come with friction material on them?How do they grip?

New RAM on bottom,original on top.RAM replacement flywheel feels at least twice as heavy.

[mznyc]

While waiting for Clutch Hub Boss tool,Im doing some service items.Set Valves to world spec and changing spark plugs.Plugs are in the 'Good" color range brown/black and identical.

Shop manual says gap should be",7mm".Is that .007mm to us Yanks? That's what I had set them to last time I changed them and bike has run perfect..7mm seems like it would be waay too wide.

Thanks

[jrt]

0.7 mm sounds about right. A pretty standard spark plug gap is 0.025 inches. 0.007 mm is damn close- my vernier caliper won't even measure that.

[mznyc]

Thanks Jason.I need a bigger plug gap tool.

Got this CF alt cover from MG Cycle.It's a Stucci but dont like the stock logo.Maybe this one?

Sanding down the stock one to a brushed aluminum finish.