removing swing arm

[motowarren]

I want to remove my swing arm and clean it and repaint it. Anything special I should know about removing it and driveshaft. I searched this forum but couldn't any articles on that. Any particular paint to use that's glossy black that will hold up well?

[savagehenry]

I took a depth measurement from the face of the nut to the face of the swing arm pin on both sides, and when I re-assembled it, used those numbers to put them back in, worked just fine. Also, the "pork chops" are aluminum and the threads are fine, so I put a very light coat of anti-seize on them and was careful not to cross thread them when I put it back together. Some have found that out the hard way. Definately grease the driveshaft while it's out. There is a list here, pinned in "tech" or "FAQ" (?) that has a long set of things to do while your rear is apart so you can do this once instead of twice when you forget to check bearings, insure that the rear caliper is freely moving and cleaned, lube the cush drive, etc.

Paint? Can't endorse anything specific. I just used whatever was laying around in "black and shiny", still looks fine after thousands of miles ago, good luck on yers, S.H.

[mznyc]

This is the list of "Things To Do While The Rear Wheel Is Off" Henry was referring to,

http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=15816

And a pic of the pork chop spacer measurements,

[AndyH]

I took a depth measurement from the face of the nut to the face of the swing arm pin on both sides, and when I re-assembled it, used those numbers to put them back in, worked just fine. Also, the "pork chops" are aluminum and the threads are fine, so I put a very light coat of anti-seize on them and was careful not to cross thread them when I put it back together. Some have found that out the hard way. Definately grease the driveshaft while it's out. There is a list here, pinned in "tech" or "FAQ" (?) that has a long set of things to do while your rear is apart so you can do this once instead of twice when you forget to check bearings, insure that the rear caliper is freely moving and cleaned, lube the cush drive, etc.

Paint? Can't endorse anything specific. I just used whatever was laying around in "black and shiny", still looks fine after thousands of miles ago, good luck on yers, S.H.

Just sharing some of my pain here...

 

I'd check the swing arm bearings - they seem to start notching after an unfeasibly small number of miles.

IMHO: I suspect a design compromise that forces the use of double row angular contact ball bearings rather than taper roller which you can't manage the thrust on in the V11 - any enlightenment from engineers out there?

It's the double row bearing thing that causes the grief - they're really wide and almost impossible to remove without application of heat, and even then they're a bugger... this means you'll wreck whatever coating you have.

 

In the meantime, you may find the screw bushes for the hugger just rotate in their sockets (I had two out of four like that). It's quite a trick to get the screws out without harming the hugger. I had to grind off the screw heads which melted the plastic a bit but just took my time, let it cool off each time and got there in the end. You can get replacement bushes but if the hole in the arm is too large (which caused the problem in the first place), you'll have difficulties in future so I used a spot of brazing to fix them in place. That'll damage the paint too!

 

So get the bearings out, sort the hugger screw bushes, then sort the coating.

 

The paint often looks OK on the outside of the swing arm but in the wet, salty UK at least, the coating around the shaft tunnel on both my swing arms was peeling off and seems the be the most vulnerable place for rust: you won't see this until you get the arm off.

 

For what it's worth, I had the swing arm blasted and stoved. Mask/plug all screw holes, axle holes, drain holes and bearing holders before blasting.

 

Because I had replaced the swing arm and bearings and also took the pork chops off to paint them, I felt it best to re-set the swing arm pins myself from scratch rather than using depth measurements (as above) from before - not rocket science but not done in a hurry either.

 

Andy H

[Baldini]

...I'd check the swing arm bearings...etc

Me too. Tontis used taper roller bearings here.

 

KB

[motowarren]

I took a depth measurement from the face of the nut to the face of the swing arm pin on both sides, and when I re-assembled it, used those numbers to put them back in, worked just fine. Also, the "pork chops" are aluminum and the threads are fine, so I put a very light coat of anti-seize on them and was careful not to cross thread them when I put it back together. Some have found that out the hard way. Definately grease the driveshaft while it's out. There is a list here, pinned in "tech" or "FAQ" (?) that has a long set of things to do while your rear is apart so you can do this once instead of twice when you forget to check bearings, insure that the rear caliper is freely moving and cleaned, lube the cush drive, etc.

Paint? Can't endorse anything specific. I just used whatever was laying around in "black and shiny", still looks fine after thousands of miles ago, good luck on yers, S.H.

Just sharing some of my pain here...

 

I'd check the swing arm bearings - they seem to start notching after an unfeasibly small number of miles.

IMHO: I suspect a design compromise that forces the use of double row angular contact ball bearings rather than taper roller which you can't manage the thrust on in the V11 - any enlightenment from engineers out there?

It's the double row bearing thing that causes the grief - they're really wide and almost impossible to remove without application of heat, and even then they're a bugger... this means you'll wreck whatever coating you have.

 

 

So get the bearings out, sort the hugger screw bushes, then sort the coating.

 

 

Because I had replaced the swing arm and bearings and also took the pork chops off to paint them, I felt it best to re-set the swing arm pins myself from scratch rather than using depth measurements (as above) from before - not rocket science but not done in a hurry either.

 

Andy H

 

I guess I need a little more info. I have the hugger off and I know how to remove the rear wheel. After that what's the procedure for removing the driveshaft? Andy, If I were to start from scratch on the depth measurements, what am I shooting for? I ask because not knowing the history of the bike I don't know if someone put it together right when/if it was apart before.

[mznyc]

I guess I need a little more info. I have the hugger off and I know how to remove the rear wheel. After that what's the procedure for removing the driveshaft? Andy, If I were to start from scratch on the depth measurements, what am I shooting for? I ask because not knowing the history of the bike I don't know if someone put it together right when/if it was apart before.

Good point.Id like to know how you set it up from Zero.

 

Warren,once the rear wheel is off,I just did this a couple weeks ago but dont have the manual in front of me so going from memory,

Support Bevel box if you havent already

Remove brake caliper and mount

Remove reaction bar

Remove disconnect pinch bolts that hold rear part of the shaft to the bevel box

Remove bevel box

Remove rear section of drive shaft,STOP,!! TAKE NOTE OF FACTORY PAINTED MARKS WHERE THE FRONT AND REAR SECTIONS OF THE DRIVE SHAFT MEET! You will need to re-align when re-assembling.If their worn or gone make your own BEFORE dis-assembling .

Remove lower shock bolt

Remove swingarm

Remove cover over front U-joint

Remove pinch bolt holding the front section of drive shaft to transmission the output shaft

Clean,clean,clean,grease,re-assemble in reverse.The swingarm spacers and drive shaft alignment are IMPORTANT!!!!

I probably forgot something so hopefully someone will chime in to correct me

Take pictures of every part and mark or label all parts if you dont have shop manual it will much easier if you get stuck.

There was a link for the factory shop manual in the reference section,dont know if it's still working.I bought a copy on Ebay.The manual is typically Guzzi incomplete and translations can be frustrating,but a must for all who want to do their own maintenance.

Michael

[Kiwi_Roy]

Just a minor point, as you are putting the drive shaft back together be careful to line the pinch bolt hole with the indent in the shaft.

If you don't the bolt will get chewed badly. I had to replace my bolts because the PO didn't take care.

 

As far as lining up the swingarm pivots about all you can do is make it with the same number of threads exposed on each side.

[mznyc]

Thanks Roy,I just put my driveshaft back in today so that came in handy.

[AndyH]

.I bought a copy on Ebay.The manual is typically Guzzi incomplete and translations can be frustrating,but a must for all who want to do their own maintenance.

Michael

you can download manual here.

http://www.guzzista.com/ClassicGuzziManuals/V11Sportworkshop.pdf

Free...

AndyH

[AndyH]

 

As far as lining up the swingarm pivots about all you can do is make it with the same number of threads exposed on each side.

i used the flourescent tube trick to evenly line up front and back tyres (as mentioned in another post on this forum). I tried laser levelers but lo-tech was easier.

When you have it right, just before you tighten up the lock nuts, pinch the bearings in the screws until resistance is felt then back off a quarter turn or less on either side to avoid undue thrust on the bearings and resulting acclerated wear - they have a hard enough life as it is.

Andy

[bikelee]

Is there way to lube the front ujoint without taking the drive shaft out. I did take the rear wheel off along with the rear part of the drive shaft. The front won't come out unless you take the swing arm off. I can almost get to the front grease nipple but my grease gun can't get a hold of that front nipple. If i could get a grease gun tip that swivels I think i could get that nipple greased. It is just at the wrong angle. Any suggestions ? I REALLY do not want to take the swing arm off if i do not have to. I am not lazy but i do not have the Guzzi work stand. I guess I am just getting frustrated. I think I'll grab a beer just chill out for now. The thing that gets me pissed is I think the previous owner did do the front ujoint as the rear WAS lubed. What do you guys think ?  I do not want to take the bike apart if I do not have to. I guess I'm just having a bad day. Thanks for listening.

[mznyc]

Here is a thread about greasing the front joint,if you haven't seen it yet.It wasn't as  big a deal removing the swingarm as I thought it could be after doing it once.If you cant get that front end greased via the nipple you'll have to.If the front joint isn't greased maybe the swingarm bearings aren't either, ,just a thought,...

http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=13418

 

Yup beer helps,

[docc]

I've tried this every way known. The only confidence I've had is using a needle. And with that, cutting off the point.

[AndyH]

Not having the Guzzi work stand shouldn't be an obstacle - I managed without for quite some time - it's just easier to do the job with one. I used a couple of axle stands and a trolley jack. Better and safer if you have help but I managed on my own several times with some blocks of wood under the side stand.

 

I found the problem with fitting a greaser onto the zerk in that position was that, once I'd got it on, I just couldn't get it off again and there was no space to get a leverl in and had to take off the arm anyway. So having been there, I personally consider whipping off the wheel and swing arm a minor hassle: I've timed it - 2 hour round trip. Besides, once you have the 'arm off, you can give the bearings a spin to redistribute the grease and try and stop them wearing the same ~5 deg part of their track.

 

An observation on the 'take a depth measurement' process before pulling out the pivot pins. Good idea, but that's assuming that the alignment was correct in the first place: It wasn't and I got it much better when I set the alignment up again using the 'two flourescent tubes' method mentioned in another post on this site.

 

I did find that the screw inserts for the hugger were loose and just spun around when I tried to undo the screws. It was a major PIA to get the hugger off as I couldn't get purchase on the inserts under the hugger and the screw was rusted into the insert pretty firm. I kind of mangled the hugger in the process when the friction melted a bigger hole but got there in the end. Once done I got new inserts from Wendel and have epoxied them in place to stop them spinning in future.

 

AndyH