Shifting problems after rebuilding shift pre-selector

[sp838]

Hello all. I'm writing this post because I'm stumped with a frustrating shifting problem. I have a 2001 v11 Sport. The bike runs well but I was experiencing some poor shifting performance: difficulty shifting out of neutral into 1st gear (had to really stomp on the lever), missed shifts going up from 2nd into 3rd, false neutrals between 3rd and 4th. The neutral light also sometimes would stop coming on after riding and the bike was warmed up.

After reading the forums here and on guzzitech, I became acquainted with the fact that the shift pre-selector mechanism sometimes came with a flawed pawl arm which would wear out its spring, and that sometimes the spring would fail while riding and leave the bike unable to shift. Sounded scary. Other users seemed to be of the opinion that this was also the cause for missed shifts and false neutrals. So I ordered a new pawl arm and all new springs, some redline oil and moly additive from harper's, and replaced all the suspect parts. No damage to any of the old springs was evident. The gear oil had no shavings in it, and the inside of the gearbox looked in order as far as I can tell. I moved the forks around and they all slide well and I was able to find the correct neutral position. The old pawl arm in the selector had the wrong diameter boss (16mm) the new one is the correct 15mm diameter, so at least that was worthwhile to swap out.

After reassembling the selector, the mechanism seemed to be working fine. It clicks smoothly through all its positions. The neutral switch finds its hole in the back of the cog. When I reattach it to the gearbox, the shifting is not smooth. I can't get it to shift down into first at all. Well, I can, but only if I turn the wheel while I shift. Same goes for the upper gears: it stops between gears and won't budge unless I turn the rear wheel while actuating the shift lever. This is whether I hold in the clutch or not. So, if anything, it seems to be worse now: at least before I could get it down into first at a standstill. Now, it only shifts properly through all the gears when the back wheel is being spun while it's being shifted. (wheel lifted up off the ground with a paddock stand.)

The shift lever is clearing the porkchop on the downstroke and the swingarm on the upstroke, so it's not like it doesn't have proper clearance... I haven't messed with the acorn nut and nut sandwich which from what I've read is supposed to be some sort of adjuster... Not sure exactly what that does yet. I'm kind of at a loss , the only thing I can think of is to maybe take apart the pre-selector and put it back together again, but like I said above, when I actuate by hand separately it doesn't stop between positions, it seems to work pretty smoothly. If anyone has experienced this and figured out the solution, or has any suggestions, I would greatly appreciate it. I want to ride my baby again soon!

Thank you for your help,

-Simon

[Solar]

It seems to me a normal thing that when the bike is on the stand you need to turn a rear wheel to change gear,. I had that all my bikes,and while ride there was no problems with the changeing.

[sp838]

It seems to me a normal thing that when the bike is on the stand you need to turn a rear wheel to change gear,. I had that all my bikes,and while ride there was no problems with the changeing.

 

Maybe for the higher gears (not acceptable as far as I'm concerned), but shifting out of neutral into 1st gear shouldn't require the wheel to be spinning. I doubt you walk your bike forward at a red light or a gas station when you want to shift out of neutral into 1st.

[Tom M]

 

It seems to me a normal thing that when the bike is on the stand you need to turn a rear wheel to change gear,. I had that all my bikes,and while ride there was no problems with the changeing.

 

Maybe for the higher gears (not acceptable as far as I'm concerned), but shifting out of neutral into 1st gear shouldn't require the wheel to be spinning. I doubt you walk your bike forward at a red light or a gas station when you want to shift out of neutral into 1st.

 

 

I don't think you have a problem here.  My bike sometimes won't go into 1st if I'm in neutral with the clutch lever pulled in for some amount of time.  I let the clutch out to get the tranny gears spinning then pull it in and it snicks into 1st no problem.

 

I suggest that you try riding the bike to see if it shifts OK 

[sp838]

"My bike sometimes won't go into 1st if I'm in neutral with the clutch lever pulled in for some amount of time.  I let the clutch out to get the tranny gears spinning then pull it in and it snicks into 1st no problem"

 

Tom, like I said above, the transmission won't go into 1st, whether I pull the clutch or not. It only shifts if the wheel is spun. This is not the way the shifting behaved before I rebuilt the selector (or on any of my other bikes for that matter). Something is wrong.

[GuzziMoto]

In order for the transmission to shift one end typically has to be spinning. Either the motor running to spin the input shaft or the rear wheel spun to spin the output shaft.

Not saying you don't have a trans issue, but in order for the trans to shift smoothly the gears must have at least a little movement to them. Otherwise the dogs can't go into their slots and the gear teeth won't mesh.

[sp838]

*facepalms* Thanks for explaining that to me GuzziMoto. That makes sense. I jumped the gun and assumed something was wrong. I'll get it all sealed up again and test it out. And sorry Tom M and Solar for being snarky with you guys. I'll let you know how it goes.

[docc]

simon,

 

You're doing everything right. This is going to work out. Nothing "snarky" so far!

 

These gearboxes have a few 'quirks." You are certain the early 6-speed recall work has been performed?

[sp838]

docc, no, I'm certain of nothing with this bike... The previous owner didn't really know much about its history either. I can say though that when I opened the gearbox, there was evidence that some work had been done as the numbers of the gear positions were written on the sidewalls of the box in what appears to be Sharpie. What is the 6 speed recall about?

[sp838]

is it the recall described here:

 

http://www.webbikeworld.com/Moto-Guzzi-motorcycles/recalls/moto-guzzi-v11-sport-recall.htm

[Tom M]

Recall info: http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=14680

[sp838]

my VIN is ZGUKRAKR21M113455, so if I read this correctly it is outside the range of affected bikes... I sent an email to the PO to ask if he knew anything about performing this recall service. I am extremely leery of having to remove the gearbox (i.e. pretty much disassembling the entire bike) to rebuild it, but if there's a reason to think it should be done, I'd rather do that than have it blow up on me on the road. Worse comes to worse, it would be a good reason to repaint the frame parts and swingarm I suppose :-/

[docc]

The recall ended with year 2001 number 114435, so yours is still in the mix. I believe Moto Guzzi North America was required to keep records of repairs. Contact them and ask for verification . It would be good for you to know it has been completed.

 

That said, it may have nothing to do with your concern. Have you ridden it yet? Give your clutch system a fresh bleed and take her for a spin.

 

All may be well once she's running and underway. (There is more eternal optimism where that came from!   

[sp838]

Just called MGNA Customer Care, left my VIN with them and they will attempt to look it up. The original dealership closed. Haven't ridden it yet, I am hoping to have the opportunity tonight to put it all back together and test it out. I'm hoping they will call me back to tell me that the work was done. The gear numbers are written on the inside walls of the gearbox, which leads me to believe that at some point someone opened it up and did some work in there... What that was is a mystery at this point. Fingers crossed. I'll report my findings as they come in. But tonight I should at least get it reassembled.

[docc]

Not likely you'll have to pull that gearbox. Sounds like the hard stuff has probably been done.

 

If ever you do take it out, no need for complete disassembly. It comes away by "crabbing the spine frame" and removing the swingarm.