Charging Issues With Electrosport ESR510

[moto fugazzi]

I have The Electrosport ESR510 in my 2001 V11S. The other day my Gen. warning light came on at full brightness even though my voltmeter was reading 13.7V. Since that episode, I've noticed that my Vmeter never got above 13.7, and drops to 11.9V at idle. The Vmeter used to read 14V at 3k rpm+ and 12.4V at idle.

I did the diode test on the R/R, and it passed, 80VAC measured at the alternator, and basically I did all of Kiwi Roy's tests and Electrosports tests as well, and everything passed. All grounds are good (2 grounds on the R/R), and very little resistance on the red wire from the R/R to the battery. Westco battery is 6 mo. old, and seems fine-it does take and hold a charge from my trickle charger.

I'm not sure what else to test at this point. Could the R/R just start putting out less voltage on it's own?  

Ken

[docc]

What does your 30 amp regulator fuse and its contacts look like?

 

They've been known to heat up, melt, and even burn off a contact without actually "blowing" the fuse itself.

[moto fugazzi]

I don't have the 30A fuse installed. IIRC, I was told it wasn't needed with the 510 and it's not on their wiring diagram. Should I add a fuse?

 

Maybe I'll pull apart the connectors for a better look. They're zip tied to the frame under the tank, and the connection looked good thru the clear insulator boots. While I'm at it, I'll rewire it so the connectors are more easily accessible and I'll use a heavier gauge wire (I think I used 12 ga. on the extension wires from the battery to the r/r).

Ken

 

 

electrosport-esr510-fitting-instructions copy.pdf

[luhbo]

I wouldn't worry too much about the 13.7. If you could verify them then it's fine. Below 12V of course is a bit odd because the battery alone should have something well above 12 V. What does Electrosport say?
Don't you have a Ducati regulator laying around somewhere? In real life they're better than they might look in forums, at least not really worse than most if not all of what you can buy elsewhere.

 

Hubert

[moto fugazzi]

I wouldn't worry too much about the 13.7. If you could verify them then it's fine. Below 12V of course is a bit odd because the battery alone should have something well above 12 V. What does Electrosport say?

Don't you have a Ducati regulator laying around somewhere? In real life they're better than they might look in forums, at least not really worse than most if not all of what you can buy elsewhere.

 

Hubert

Here's my answers from Electrosport:

 

 

"The way the light works on this bike is by having the regulator switch its ground connection on/off.  So, on one end of the light should be a switched 12v power supply wire feeding power to the light anytime the key is in the on position.  This light should then have an exclusive ground wire that is not shared with any other devices which runs directly into the reg/rect.  If the light will not turn off, there is a good chance it is grounding somewhere else on the bike outside the regulator.

 

I've yet to have one of these regulators have a fault light mechanism.  Its possible that it could just be a bad switch inside the reg/rect, but not likely.  If the stator is doing well, and the reg/rect's diode are doing well, there could possibly be an issue with your wiring harness or battery not accepting a charging.  Or maybe you have a lot of electrical accessories demanding too much power?"

 

Anybody know if the warning light has it's own ground? 

 

I think I have my old regulator, but I need to test it again. I think I get an OL for one of the diode tests if I move the wire around a bit. If it tests good, then I'll install it and see what happens.

 

I'm not too worried about the 13.7V yet. Not until winter comes and I use my heated grips and aux. lights at night. That will drop the voltage quite a bit.

Ken

[luhbo]

That sounds reasonable. Have you checked the cable whether it's grounded? What if you disconnect the cable at the regulator. It should stay on if it's grounded elsewhere.

[moto fugazzi]

That sounds reasonable. Have you checked the cable whether it's grounded? What if you disconnect the cable at the regulator. It should stay on if it's grounded elsewhere.

That cable should be the ground wire from what I understand. The R/R goes to ground when under 13.4V and completes the circuit. Disconnecting the wire keeps the light off. Maybe I'm wrong? I'm just starting to get a grasp on how this all works...

 

Here's a short video I made with the voltmeter. It actually seems much better than the other night, but notice how the light gets brighter when I "blip" the throttle-maybe thats just the R/R kicking in from keeping the voltage from getting too high. 

[luhbo]

This is the important part:

The way the light works on this bike is by having the regulator switch its [the light's own] ground connection on/off. So, on one end of the light should be a switched 12v power supply wire feeding power to the light anytime the key is in the on position. This light should then have an exclusive ground wire that is not shared with any other devices which runs directly into the reg/rect. If the light will not turn off, there is a good chance it is grounding somewhere else on the bike outside the regulator.

The control light is fed from a switched 12V source and on the other side finds its ground going through the regulator, i.e. a switch inside the regulator.

Do not disconnect the regulator itself while the engine is running (I think I read something like that, disconnecting the ground wire, in your last post).

At idle the alternator output usually is not very much above 12V. That's why  the lights get brighter with rising RPMs.

Hubert

[Kiwi_Roy]

I have noticed the charge lamp works differently on these, it needs more revs to go out.

Is it possible the white wire has become grounded between the lamp and the regulator? Try disconnecting it at the regulator and the lamp should go out.

 

I tried to get Electrosport to share the schematic of the regulator but they are very cagey (I can't fault them for that) they told me it's somewhere between

a series and shunt regulator. The Ducati works by breaking the circuit, most bikes short out the alternator.

I'm not sure that the diode check works with their regulator, I don't have a good feel for the insides.

 

Is it possible your Voltmeter is reading something other than the battery Voltage e.g. downstream of the ignition switch or a relay, I would check it at the

battery terminals with a multimeter.

 

http://www.electrosport.com/ducati-single-phase-regulatorrectifier.html

Some of their documentation leaves a little to be desired, it shows a fuse but doesn't come with one and the wires are too short to reach the battery

 

Have you asked Electosport if they will test it for you, I imagine they would be anxious to help out.

http://www.electrosport.com/contact/

[moto fugazzi]

Hubert, I was thinking that the control wire (white wire) was a ground wire that completed the warning light circuit, but I'm probably understanding that wrong.

 

Roy, the lamp does go out when the white wire s disconnected. I do have my voltmeter connected to the fuel pump relay, so it is a bit downstream. A voltmeter on the battery reads .2-.3V higher. It was too dark to get my multimeter display in the video.

Electrosport does have a good fault finding chart and test for their R/R. http://www.electrosport.com/technical-resources/diagnosis-center

I'm sure they'll test it for me if I send it in, but my voltages were much higher last night, so maybe the low voltage the other day was just some weird anomaly. If the issue happens again, I'll put in my old Ducati R/R and send the 510 back to them for testing. I'm off for a short test ride now before work and the possible T-storms roll in.

Ken

[AndyH]

I have noticed the charge lamp works differently on these, it needs more revs to go out.

The Electrex R/R is the same, the light comes on at idle, just not so many revs by the looks of it.

Given up fretting about it now.

Still blip the throttle at lights 'cos it annoys, tho'.

A

[68C]

Buy a later model V11, no light = no worry.

[luhbo]

Hubert, I was thinking that the control wire (white wire) was a ground wire that completed the warning light circuit, but I'm probably understanding that wrong. ...

The warning light has no ground as such. That's what he said - and it's clearly shown also on the mounting instructions. Connect the light on one side to 12V and on the other side to the correct regulator input.

 

Hubert

[Kiwi_Roy]

Yes, the white wire does ground the lamp through an electronic switch, you disconnected the white wire and the light went out so it's the regulator that's holding it to ground to warn you it's not charging properly.

Check all the connections between the alternator and battery, look for signs of excessive heat

Remove the cover off the alternator and check where the wires solder to the coils, they get brittle and break eventually.

Since it came on all of a sudden it could well be a bad ground or loose connection to the battery, remove the terminals, scrape

the posts and add some Vaseline.

Do you have a different battery you could try or another bike to try this one in?

 

Perhaps the ESR510 has gone tits up. Depending on how long you've had it Electrosport might give you a break on a new one.

 

 

Update

You could try measuring the Voltage at the end of the regulators red and green wires, I'm just wondering if you have some resistance between there and the battery.

It might prove interesting to put the battery on a charger to see if the Voltage goes higher, just in case there's something wrong there.

 

I was so paranoid about getting a direct connection to the battery I mounted the regulator under the tank and extended the yellow wires.  

You can afford to loose several Volts on the upstream side but any on the downstream side will result in a lower battery.

The regulator senses the Voltage internally between the red and green wires, I suspect that's why they dropped the fuse, to get a better connection.

[moto fugazzi]

Today I put in a known good stock regulator. Charging is good (voltage is higher than what the ESR510 put out). Maybe these pics will explain my issue. The gold contacts were good, but the clear insulation boots around the bullet connectors are turning black from either heat or too much current.

Ken