Brand-new Scura

[GuzziMoto]

Baldini is correct, you can't increase rake by either raising the rear or lowering the front without reducing trail. To gain back the trail you would have to fit triple clamps with less offset, or otherwise increase the distance between the steering stem and a line drawn between the centers of the two fork tubes. Less offset equals more trail.

Feel free to play with you geometry, raising the rear and/or dropping the front. But don't go too crazy with it, make small changes and feel the difference. And keep in mind that the increase in rake comes at a cost of reduced trail, which can rear its head at the worst time.

The wifes V11 runs the front and rear ride heights at or near stock. We found that without jacking with the geometry trying to speed up the steering we were able to get ride of the steering damper (with the required trail it is stable and does not seem to need one) which resulted in a larger increase in steering response then you can get jacking with the geometry. Without the steering damper it steers light and fast. Not everyone actually wants their Guzzi to steer like that, and I suspect the steering damper and the reduced steering rake in the later frames were both in response to the perceived wants of the typical Guzzi rider. That seems to make sense because the first V11's (with red frames) were often accused of being twitchy. We have no idea what they were talking about.

Keep in mind, hers is a red frame version which had about a degree steeper rake to begin with as I recall.

[docc]

I would still like to see the actual Technical Bulletin that acknowledges the change in triple clamps during early RedFrame production. Apparently, the very early RedFrames (1999-very early 2000 production) had the steepest of rake and worst complaints about stability.  My March 2000 production Sport has the (reportedly) revised/relaxed triple clamps. The 2002-2004 ("long") frame negates this issue entirely.

 

Early tire fitment, recommended tire pressures, and steering damper settings were all suspect, as well as the "softness" of the springs and rear weight bias.

 

Fine tuning those parameters for your weight and riding style will assuredly give you a fabulous ride!

[Zooter]

^ None of which applies to the Scura if I'm not mistaken.

[Scud]

^ None of which applies to the Scura if I'm not mistaken.

 

I think it applies to the Scura in roughly the same way that a person's parents' health histories apply to that person. If the early V11 Sports did have a problem that was corrected, one should be cautious about making adjustments that could re-create the problem.

[Scud]

Öh, nÖw I get it. Everything must harmÖnize. AnÖther nÖticeable imprÖvement.

 

For the record (and to complete the treatise for Leon) here is a summary of all the stock settings (thanks to Camn for the Scura manual):

 

Forks FG8470:

• Position: 2mm (1 ring showing above handle hub)
• Preload: 13mm (13 full turns from open)
• Compression: 13 clicks from closed (per Guzzi Manual) 12 from closed (Öhlins spec sheet)
• Rebound: 13 clicks from closed (per Guzzi Manual) 12 from closed (Öhlins spec sheet)
• Öil: Öhlins 1309
• Öil Level: 105mm

Shock MG1271:

• Preload: 15mm from unloaded spring
• Compression: 12 clicks from closed (Guzzi Manual and Öhlins spec sheet agree)
• Rebound: 14 clicks from closed (Guzzi Manual and Öhlins spec sheet agree)
• Öil: Öhlins 105/1

Damper:

10 clicks from closed

 

I still have 2 fork rings showing (vs 1 spec and vs 3 per Baldini). I also deviated from spec by turning the damper completely open (per GuzziMoto's idea) – loved the quicker steering. Then I turned it in 3 clicks for a little insurance against bumps and holes. From here, more adjustments are just personal preference, but I am so glad that I set it totally within spec before fiddling. Compared to where it was set when I got it (way off target), it feels like my test road (which, ironically, is called Harmony Grove) was resurfaced between tests. 

 

I’d write another ride report, but I don’t think it gets any better than this from mo-biker in The Scura Topic (emphasis mine):

 

Begodandbegorra this thing seems to lean forever, sort of, you fly through a series of bends or a roundabout faster than sensibility tells you you should and you barely have to lean it, even when conditions and visibility are excellent and you stuff it into your favourite bends it just tracks true and grips like a jealous gorilla. I got home and expected to find shredded tyres (yeah right) and there are still huge chicken strips, I have to visit the man shop and get me some lean nuts before this bit of late summer passes.

[docc]

^ None of which applies to the Scura if I'm not mistaken.

That is correct. Only the earliest Sports/ pre-Rosso Mandello.

 

And yes, one can jack up his suspension settings enough to eliminate all forgiving margins. This can be followed by the sound of bouncing off the air dam of a BMW sedan. Experience is often the simple accumulation of bad judgement.

[Zooter]

 

^ None of which applies to the Scura if I'm not mistaken.

That is correct. Only the earliest Sports/ pre-Rosso Mandello. And yes, one can jack up his suspension settings enough to eliminate all forgiving margins. This can be followed by the sound of bouncing off the air dam of a BMW sedan. Experience is often the simple accumulation of bad judgement.

Forwarned is fore armed as they say. You're almost making me happy they didn't lash out on ohlins for the tenni.

[Scud]

 

 

Forwarned is fore armed as they say. You're almost making me happy they didn't lash out on ohlins for the tenni.

 

 

Not having ridden a Marzocchi-equipped V11, I can't compare. But I can say that my considerable effort here has only resulted in my restoration of the Öhlins suspension to stock settings (instructions for which were not easy to come by). So all this work was basically just to press "reset" from what appears to have been a totally botched setting by the prior owner. Having done so, it is BY FAR the best handling bike I have ever owned.

 

It just tracks true and grips like a jealous gorilla.

(I just love that little sentence...)

 

I am cÖmpletely cÖnverted and spÖiled for life... hence the irrationally exuberant placement of umlauts in my earlier post.

 

Now I can fine-tune to taste...      

 

 

Soon, the darkening will resume...   

[judgefargo]

Hi mate, just wanted to congratulate you also on your beautiful Scura, I'm sure it's a pleasure to ride! Take care and speak to you round the forum.

[GuzziMoto]

 

 

^ None of which applies to the Scura if I'm not mistaken.

That is correct. Only the earliest Sports/ pre-Rosso Mandello. And yes, one can jack up his suspension settings enough to eliminate all forgiving margins. This can be followed by the sound of bouncing off the air dam of a BMW sedan. Experience is often the simple accumulation of bad judgement.

Forwarned is fore armed as they say. You're almost making me happy they didn't lash out on ohlins for the tenni.

 

There is nothing better about the Marzocchi / Sachs suspension over the Ohlins other than price. The Ohlins suspension is substantially better and had my wife had the choice she/I would have happily paid the relatively small premium for an Ohlins equipped bike.

That said, there is no substitute for properly set up suspension. It does not matter how high quality the suspension components are, if they are not set up correctly they will not work well. Cheap suspension that is well set up can work better than expensive suspension that is not well set up.

The lesson here is put in the effort/money to get your suspension set up WHATEVER it is.

Basics like setting sag are often overlooked.

[Scud]

The lesson here is put in the effort/money to get your suspension set up WHATEVER it is.

Basics like setting sag are often overlooked.

 

 

Yes. That IS the lesson. 

[Camn]

put in the effort/money to get your suspension set up WHATEVER it is

This is part of the pleasure when riding. Start from the factory settings and adjust according your feel (weight) within safe limits.

 

Different models have different factory settings (different shocks?) allthough the front suspension is made by Öhlins.  Rosso Corsa (Nero Corsa) 30 mm, Cafe Sport (Coppa Italia) 26 mm.  I do not have exact notes but if I remember right, if measured like on this drawing (Workshop Manual 04/03), the Scura instruction meant also 26 mm (the "clip on" part of the handle bar needs 20 mm).

[Scud]

A dark glass of stout, a little dark chocolate, a couple hours of wrenching... and I'm just about ready for a visit to the power-coaters.

 

 

A few observations:

1) The sidestand has a lot of parts... I mean a LOT, and no two parts require the same size wrench. It's a rather intricate piece of work.

2) Many bolts had started corroding - not just from the parts I removed today, but many of the other silver bolts I replaced or painted earlier). So all this obsessive darkening is helping me catch and clean things before they seize up (also using anti-seize on reassembly throughout).

3) Many moving parts either appeared to have had no grease on assembly, or what was there had dried to a nasty white paste. This is great time to get all the moving parts lubed.

4) Powder coating the fork bottoms is not recommended. Dan Kyle (of Kyle Racing) says they don't even do it any more because it is too much of a PITA and they don't like removing all the seals and valves if they are working. If those guys can't be bothered to do it, that's good enough for me.

 

However, I am stuck on the footpeg bracket. The hex-head bolt was not moving and I could not get a wrench on the big nut behind the porkchop. They're having a good soak in penetrating lube right now.

 

 

My question(s):

How do the footpeg brackets come off? Do I have to remove the porkchops to do it? 

 

 

Edit: answered my own question by more searching. What a great forum. I'm leaving the porkchops on (along with the brackets, which I don't think can be removed otherwise) and will not powedercoat the footpegs (at least for now). I was uncertain about black footpegs anyway... I do like the silver on the red.  But the passenger pegs definitely have to be black   

Edited January 15, 2015 by Scud

[Jet]

You may be interested in one of these for the Oil Cooler. I had mine coated with Linux. It looks great. Now if I could only find black matching Hex Screws.......but I think you might have a lead on that! 50Eu from the good folks at RossoPuro.

 

Rich

[Scud]

Thanks. Good tip. I'll be watching the oil cooler to see if it's getting beat up.

 

It looks like that guard uses the existing mounting screws. While I did replace a lot of bolts with black Zinc ones from my local hardware store, I painted the oil cooler bolts on my bike, because they're a specialty size and shape (and the black satin paint was a good match for the oil cooler bracket). You could just pop the four bolts in a piece of cardboard and spray the bolt heads with a can of rubber truck bed liner - or ask your Line-X shop to spray the bolt heads next time they do somebody else's truck.

 

My wife picked up my parts from the powder-coater yesterday (I'm away on business). She sent me a text: "I love the red you chose." She's so funny...