Synthetic Oil

[Lucky Phil]

32 minutes ago, LowRyter said:

My goodness Phil, you're so cool.  Anyone mechanically inclined amazes me.  On top of that, you're fun and have a great sense of humor.  Your tolerance to the mechanically challenged, well, I'm still here.

Pretty cool Offy.  

Ha I'll show my teenage kids this:) I seriously lack any real artistic creativity in any form though, it's an engineers mind minus the creativity.

Oh I have others. The Dale Earnhardt NASCAR Chev and the Ford Mustang engine are both 1/4 scale full metal diecast and too heavy for most shelves and the Ferrari V12 is 1/6 scale. My wife forgives me my lunacy.  

 

[po18guy]

The Offys were extremely stout, as four cylinder engines have always been limited as to displacement and RPM due to secondary balance issues. 3.0L was the limit for Porsche and it was redlined the same as a Harley Sportster: 5800.

[LowRyter]

Not really.   Offys were over 4 liters, 256 ci unblown (400+ HP). 

They also ran up to 700hp w/turbo @ 8500 rpms and 160 ci.

[Tomchri]

Very enjoyable beautiful stuf to own Phil. Had to share my own 2 great homemade fully working engines made by +1 friend with 1 eye and , let's say limited sight. 1 Hammer brake engine 270-300rpm, 134kg.
Other one 401ccm 2stroke with exhaust valve As long as we are feeling good.
Cheers Tom

Sent fra min SM-A525F via Tapatalk

[Lucky Phil]

1 hour ago, Tomchri said:

Very enjoyable beautiful stuf to own Phil. Had to share my own 2 great homemade fully working engines made by +1 friend with 1 eye and , let's say limited sight. 1 Hammer brake engine 270-300rpm, 134kg.
Other one 401ccm 2stroke with exhaust valve As long as we are feeling good.
Cheers Tom

Sent fra min SM-A525F via Tapatalk
 

Nice work. Engineering plus creativity, if you can combine those then "genius" isn't far away.

Ciao  

[Lucky Phil]

2 hours ago, po18guy said:

The Offys were extremely stout, as four cylinder engines have always been limited as to displacement and RPM due to secondary balance issues. 3.0L was the limit for Porsche and it was redlined the same as a Harley Sportster: 5800.

It depends to what extent you can keep the rotating mass down to minimise the secondary vibrations. Of course twin balance shafts these days negate the secondaries as well. Both my cars have twin bear driven balance shafts turning a twice engine rpm.

Ciao

[po18guy]

Oh, I suppose that anything can and has been accounted for. I guess my point was that the Offy's were huge 4-bangers revving to rather high RPMs and piston speeds in the age when lubricants were so-so, even in racing.

I think I'll contact Bardahl and see if I can get the specs on their oils.

[Lucky Phil]

31 minutes ago, po18guy said:

Oh, I suppose that anything can and has been accounted for. I guess my point was that the Offy's were huge 4-bangers revving to rather high RPMs and piston speeds in the age when lubricants were so-so, even in racing.

I think I'll contact Bardahl and see if I can get the specs on their oils.

Don't forget that one of the best lubricating oils ever, even compared to modern oils was/is vegetable bases lubricants such as Castrol R. Very difficult to manage even for racing as it was corrosive and needed to be drained after every meeting plus other issues like gum formation but as an actual lubricant it was very good.

Ciao

[LowRyter]

12 hours ago, Lucky Phil said:

It depends to what extent you can keep the rotating mass down to minimise the secondary vibrations. Of course twin balance shafts these days negate the secondaries as well. Both my cars have twin bear driven balance shafts turning a twice engine rpm.

Ciao

When Colin Chapman went to Indy with the Small Block Ford V8 (and later "cammer") he made a remark about the "ancient" Offy being a "vibrator".  I'd imagine it was a tough go running 500 miles all out.  The Ford (later FOYT engine) won it's last race in '77 and Offy won last in '76.  After that the Turbo Cosworth was king for the next 10 years.

[MartyNZ]

14 hours ago, Lucky Phil said:

Don't forget that one of the best lubricating oils ever, even compared to modern oils was/is vegetable bases lubricants such as Castrol R. Very difficult to manage even for racing as it was corrosive and needed to be drained after every meeting plus other issues like gum formation but as an actual lubricant it was very good.

Ciao

A flatmate years ago always wanted to mow the lawn when we had two stroke mower fuel mixed with Castrol R. It had an awesome smell.

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/archive/article/july-2000/55/castrol-r

The storybook hero WW1 flying ace "Biggles" had to wipe castor oil off his goggles when flying his Sopwith Camel. 

[docc]

1 hour ago, MartyNZ said:

A flatmate years ago always wanted to mow the lawn when we had two stroke mower fuel mixed with Castrol R. It was a distinctive smell.

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/archive/article/july-2000/55/castrol-r

My Sport made it's first 40,000 miles/ 64,000 km on Castrol GTX 20W-50 (which is, of course, not "Castrol R). This was, for me, a holdover of a trusted motor oil from my American muscle car years.

I migrated away from it when a trusted engine mechanic share that he did not care for it as it turned all of the internal components to a bronze-colored brown hue.

Ha! I though all engines were that color on the inside!!

 

[MartyNZ]

2 hours ago, docc said:

My Sport made it's first 40,000 miles/ 64,000 km on Castrol GTX 20W-50 (which is, of course, not "Castrol R). This was, for me, a holdover of a trusted motor oil from my American muscle car years.

I migrated away from it when a trusted engine mechanic share that he did not care for it as it turned all of the internal components to a bronze-colored brown hue.

Ha! I though all engines were that color on the inside!!

 

I stopped buying Castrol when they started advertising Syntec as "full synthetic" despite the fact that it was made from a Group III mineral base oil.

Because of Castrol, nowadays the advertising term "synthetic" applies to any mineral oil with extra processing and a higher price tag. All the manufacturers now sell a "synthetic" Group III mineral base oil.

True synthetic oils are Group IV base oils made of polyalphaolefins (PAO) or Group V base oils made from esters (or other synthetic chemicals). I use an Australian oil in my air-cooled bike that is a mix of Group IV & V. I try to avoid products from manufacturers who imply lies in their advertising. 

[docc]

11 minutes ago, MartyNZ said:

I stopped buying Castrol when they started advertising Syntec as "full synthetic" despite the fact that it was made from a Group III mineral base oil.

Because of Castrol, nowadays the advertising term "synthetic" applies to any mineral oil with extra processing and a higher price tag, and all the manufacturers sell a "synthetic" Group III mineral base oil.

True synthetic oils are Group IV base oils made of polyalphaolefins (PAO) or Group V base oils made from esters (or other synthetic chemicals). I use an Australian oil in my air-cooled bike that is a mix of Group IV & V. I try not to use products from manufacturers who imply lies in  their advertising. 

Well said, Sir. Total agreement.  IIRC, that was the result of a lawsuit between Mobil Oils and Castrol. In short, Castrol won and the misleading claim of synthetic has been foisted upon us ever since (I paraphrase, of course).

I finally abandoned Lucas motor oil as I could not find out their base oil group and assumed it must not be Group IV or V. Otherwise, they would clearly disclose the superior Base Oil

[Lucky Phil]

40 minutes ago, MartyNZ said:

I stopped buying Castrol when they started advertising Syntec as "full synthetic" despite the fact that it was made from a Group III mineral base oil.

Because of Castrol, nowadays the advertising term "synthetic" applies to any mineral oil with extra processing and a higher price tag. All the manufacturers now sell a "synthetic" Group III mineral base oil.

True synthetic oils are Group IV base oils made of polyalphaolefins (PAO) or Group V base oils made from esters (or other synthetic chemicals). I use an Australian oil in my air-cooled bike that is a mix of Group IV & V. I try to avoid products from manufacturers who imply lies in their advertising. 

You can blame the US justice/legal system for that. Castrol and Mobil fought out that battle in the US courts about 35 years ago and Castrol won the argument. Apparently that's how the complex details of oil engineering and chemistry  are evaluated and decide upon.......by an old guy in a black gown whose only experience of oil is the stuff he uses on his salad.

Ciao

[docc]

8 minutes ago, Lucky Phil said:

You can blame the US justice/legal system for that. Castrol and Mobil fought out that battle in the US courts about 35 years ago and Castrol won the argument. Apparently that's how the complex details of oil engineering and chemistry  are evaluated and decide upon.......by an old guy in a black gown whose only experience of oil is the stuff he uses on his salad.

Ciao

That is painfully true, it seems.

My old Castrol GTX apparently never hurt my Sport, but I can't have trust in their products anymore.

Frankly, it's hard to know who to trust. This is why there are nine billion oil threads on internet forums and blogs.

I feel confident in my RedLine (Group V/ShockProof) choices for the V11. My choices for my passenger vehicles and other motorcycles are "circumspect", at best . . . .