RAM Clutch 2016 Edition

[Scud]

Today, I received a RAM single-plate clutch from MG Cycle. Which contains the following:

• Fully assembled, ready to install, clutch and flywheel
• Transmission input spline
• 6 pieces of unicorn poop, which double as flywheel mounting bolts

 

MG got three units.  Footgoose got one too - and as we understand it, this is the end of production for these rare and controversial units for the 6-speed transmissions. Apparently, the limiting factor is the transmission input hub, which was made by Moto Guzzi - and they are not making any more of them.

 

Furthermore, we understand that the RAM 5 speed clutch and the RAM 6 speed clutch are otherwise identical. If (and this is a fairly critical "if") that's true... and if it's true that RAM made the original single-plate clutches for Moto Guzzi... then (attempting an assumptive syllogism with a double back-if here) owners of Tennis, Rosso Mandellos, and the best motorcycles of all time (Scuras) who still have the problematic flywheel that goes with the OEM single-plate clutch can simply order a RAM 5 speed clutch assembly and use their existing transmission input hub. Further investigation awaits...

 

I'll do a test fit on my spare engine and transmission before I break my Scura in half.

[footgoose]

We'll have to wait one of us break's it in half to get all the answers. I suspect we'll have the actuating rod length to be determined.

 

MG Cycles has removed the RAM single for 6spds, from their page. They still offer a 6spd clutch gear (hub) but it' most likely the one that can't be had. There is no Guzzi p/n.  01211640 is what came in our kit.

 

 

I wonder who got #3?

[docc]

"If-and if-then-if"

 

I remember failing at these algorithms miserably in an algebra class.

[Scud]

And they still offer the replacement clutch plate. The description and the illustration at MG Cycle's site talk about the longer pushrod issue. It seems to apply only when installing a new clutch plate in an older flywheel/spring-plate. I ass-u-me that we are going to be OK.

 

I thought symbolic logic was fun. 

[docc]

I thought symbolic logic was fun. 

A dark , dark , dark   business, this . . .

[Craig]

Well, I got number three.  Maybe I should stick it with my beanie baby and cabbage patch kids collections and wait for it to appreciate!

[Scud]

Craig - I was hoping it was you. I recall you said you wanted to get one some time ago and got on the MG Cycle wait list. 

 

Looking into it a bit more, I don't think I will attempt the test-fit on the spare engine/trans. That would mean removing the clutch hub (transmission input gear) from the transmission - and that requires a special tool (which Craig will need to do). I'm assuming the Scura/Tenni clutch hub is the same as the one supplied with the RAM kit, so I think I'll wait to find out. If so, then replacing the original flywheel clutch with RAM low inertia is a 6-bolt affair (after getting the engine out, of course).

[Craig]

I seriously doubt I will get to this until the weather cools a bit and i can work for a full day in the garage.  Any idea what this special tool looks like?  I suspect I will have to make it.

 

Are these the tools?

 

 

and

 

[footgoose]

I've never been inside one Graig but the splined tool holds the shaft and the fancy wrench removes the nut? seems reasonable if the shaft comes out far enough past the nut. Where's Paradiso when we need him? He's done it.

 

Congrats on the Ram. When I met my first wife she was an Aries, and single. I hope my new clutch treats me better.

 

Scud, we're going to have to pull that sucker off too. When are you going to start? I can't come over to help, but I'll send beer money and good wishes

[Scud]

Illustrations of the special tools are in the shop manual. Section B, page 15.

 

I've saved a bunch of clutch-replacement threads. This one has a lot of useful pictures and detailed discussion. It's about a single to dual conversion.

 

http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=7181

 

Check out post 49 in that thread - compare the image of the clutch hub removed from the Scura with the clutch hub that came with the RAM kit. I think they are the same - and if so, no need to remove it. Won't start at least for a few weeks. LeMans is not back together yet. It's "illegal" to take both V11s out of service at the same time.

[Lucky Phil]

The Ram clutch kits are the same for the non flywheel sensor 5 and 6 speed bikes with the exception of the actual gearbox drive spline assy and the clutch push rod. You can even use the flywheel sensor Ram flywheel and clutch in the non flywheel sensor bikes if you like. The later Ram units with the 1mm thicker clutch plate may well need a longer push rod, possible the one from the 5 speeder. Either way its not a big deal.

 

Ciao

[Paradiso]

I think you're right about the common parts between the 5 speed RAM and the 6 speed RAM Scud.

However, the clutch button on the 5 speed is of a smaller diameter. The one from the original single plater on my Tenni was stamped RAM and may be interchangeable: you'd have to take the 'ready assembled' RAM unit apart.

As far as pushrod length goes, my original from the single plater worked with the twin plater.

I put some photos of the different clutch hubs on a thread. I think the original single plate hub was the same size externally as the one I looked at from a RAM 5 speed, but the 5 speed RAM hub has a different splined centre. The clutch hub socket is available in a few places. I got mine from Gutsibits.

Simon

 

Sent from my GT-I8190N using Tapatalk

[footgoose]

ok scud thanks, I see it now in one of the photos. I figured it was the right one, I just had the shaft ass backwards in my head from looking at the diagram, stupidly thinking it held the clutch captive. And I totally agree on the law of one down at a time.

 

Thanks for checking in Paradiso. After reading some of your posts I measured the hole in the center of the RAM clutch assembly, where I assume the actuating rod goes, against the "button". (hoping we're not getting terms crossed) It measures 8.30mm.  From reading your notes,   http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=19405&page=3#entry210406  I take it this is the correct diameter for Tenni Scura Mand actuating rod? I also take it you can just pull the rod out, since you measured it? Sorry, this will become clear when opened up. I just want to get ahead of it. thanks

[Scud]

We need to print some "clutch-change survivor" T-shirts. So many threads with anxious people like us who manage to make it through - then say "Well, that wasn't as hard as I feared."

 

Rod can be pulled out - but doesn't need to be. I didn't remove it when changing my LeMans clutch. It stays with the transmission when you remove the engine. The twin-plate replacement in my LeMans was surprisingly easy... once I got into it. And putting a RAM single-plate in place of an OEM single plate looks easier still.

[footgoose]

agreed.

 

 

 

I wanted to pull it out to measure it just to be aware, in case of any possible future problems. That length is the only lingering concern I have at the moment.