RAM Clutch 2016 Edition

[footgoose]

the price when I ordered was I think, 580. The new price was 600 something, but when they got the presumably 'last' 3 in, they took it off the available list. All 3 are sold I believe. Couldn't hurt to check with them and see what's up. I got the impression they were tired of dealing with the uncertainty of availability. MGCycles may not be the only vendor to have received them recently. Doesn't seem right, just making up 3 units.

[Scud]

agreed.

 

"Rod can be pulled out - but doesn't need to be" that's what She said... (sorry, could not resist)

 

I wanted to pull it out to measure it (ok, THAT's what she said.) just to be aware, in case of any possible future problems. That length is the only lingering concern I have at the moment.

 

That length is the only lingering concern I have at the moment.     (no... THAT'S what she said).    

[Scud]

Dare i ask what MG charges for one of these rare clutch and flywheel kits?  Or is the point moot - have all 3 been spoken for?

 

I really think you can buy a 5-speed RAM clutch and use it with your current Scura clutch hub (trans input). Check out Lucky Phil's post - he seems quite certain that they are compatible. MG Cycle said the limiting factor was the quantity of clutch hubs available from Moto Guzzi.

[Scud]

I believe the new RAM flywheel is the same design as the original. However, from what I can gather, RAM didn't manufacture the OEMs that Guzzi used in 2002 - or there was a bad batch - or they were improperly torqued - or there was a Scura black-voodoo curse... MG Cycle says the RAM flywheel has proven reliable in many other applications. In fact, I was just comparing the two set-ups. The RAM flywheel is not subject to any friction (it has no teeth) but the standard, twin-plate flywheel has teeth for the outer diameters of the pressure plate and the intermediate plate. Theoretically, the RAM flywheel should last forever because there is nothing to wear...

 

Here are a couple other points of comparison:

• Weight:
  • Used dual-plate flywheel and clutch: 12 lbs, 1 oz. That does not include weight of springs (I threw them out). These parts from a 2002 LeMans.
  • New RAM flywheel and clutch: 10 lbs, 10 oz.
  • Not really a lot of difference there, maybe 2 pounds difference if I had the springs - but I think the RAM's weight is more centralized, which could make a difference in performance - like the way an ice skater goes faster in a spin when they tuck their arms in, and slower when they extend their arms.
• Clutch lever effort:
  • The Single plate in my Scura requires much less effort than my LeMans.
  • I recall writing in earlier discussions that the clutch effort was the same between my two bikes. However, since I just put new springs in with the LeMans clutch, there has been a big increase in resistance. It seems that previously, I was comparing the LeMans' worn clutch with weak springs to the low-miles, near new, clutch in the Scura.
  • Time will tell if the RAM replacement feels the same on the Scura - maybe its 14 year old springs are weak too.

[footgoose]

The new RAM flywheel is steel, instead of aluminum.

[Scud]

 

The new RAM flywheel is steel, instead of aluminum.

Yeah, i'd say that's A significant difference!

 

 

...probably the most important difference between old and new RAM. That flywheel should never wear out.

[gstallons]

The portion you are looking at is the flywheel ring gear . It is not aluminum . The flywheel itself is what you need to be checking.

[footgoose]

[footgoose]

stole this from another site... left - starter ring. center - clutch plate. right - part of aluminum flywheel.

[Camn]

Here's a photo by "motoguzznix", Scura original single disc clutch: http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/i/f5s1-8.jpg

The 2-disc clutch flywheel looks very different as it is a single, closed steel part.

 

The Scura single disc clutch without the aluminium flywheel on the table (same source): http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/i/f5s1-b.jpg

 

It seems that the "RAM" Company has freshened up (?): http://www.rammotor.it/

 

They even make decent drawings, a local LeMans -champ found this for Tonti -clutch: http://www.stein-dinse.biz/images/product_pdf/200001620.pdf

[gstallons]

I am not close to my bike . You could remove the starter and give it a look.  If you own a Scura and it has the original clutch assy. it (as with all MG parts MAYBE it is ) is aluminum.

[Scud]

It may be difficult to get past the starter ring with a magnet. If I were you, I would operate under the assumption that your Scura has an aluminum flywheel and that it is deteriorating. From what I can gather, OEM Scura flywheels fall into one of these categories:

1. Failed catastrophically.
2. Replaced preemptively - and found cracks starting around mounting holes. I have not heard of any flywheel that was replaced without finding evidence of deterioration.
3. Still in use; ticking time-bomb that makes owner apprehensive and not want to put too many miles on the bike.

Here is my new RAM unit with steel flywheel, next to an aluminum flywheel and clutch assembly that did 180,000 miles in a BMW K75s.

 

 

The clutches use the same basic technology. However the aluminum flywheel on the BMW is attached with 12 rivets in a bigger circle. (FWIW - there is no starter ring on the BMW, the starter engages elsewhere and the flywheel rotates in the opposite direction of the crankshaft.)

[Lucky Phil]

Measured my RAM clutch and flywheel today. Older style brand new 10lbs 4oz

 

Ciao

[Scud]

That's just a bit less than what mine weighed, but I think I had the bolts on the scale with it. Are you going to put that in your Greenie soon?

[Lucky Phil]

That's just a bit less than what mine weighed, but I think I had the bolts on the scale with it. Are you going to put that in your Greenie soon?

Bolts not weighed as they are the same no matter what flywheel and clutch assy you use. Interesting the new RAM units use a steel flywheel.

This clutch assy will go onto the Daytona engine I am currently rebuilding to fit to my V11. Rods are currently at Carrillo for a refresh and when I get them back I'll start putting the engine back together.

Total rebuild....everything in the top end was worn out,but I'm doing the bottom as well with lightened and balanced crank, Joe Caruso timing/oil pump gears and German needle roller oil pump. 

Should be quit nice when done.

 

Ciao