Sealing tank for E10 gas

[brlawson]

I figure this has been discussed at length and I have read through several threads here and various other forums (i.e. Buell, Ducati) about sealing the Nylon tank to prevent shape shifting.

 

To start, I have located and purchased an in tank fuel pump version to go on an earlier model from a Gentleman in Italy for a great price mainly due to the fact that the paint is separating badly from the tank. Good news is the tank has never been on a bike or even had fuel in it. 

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/112040315850

 

I bought it mainly to clean up all the external fuel components as I recently experienced the dreaded overheated fuel scenario after an extended period in slow moving traffic

 

I figure since I will have a virgin tank I should do my due diligence on properly treating the tank so I can just put in whatever fuel is available and not need to worry about additives or mapping non-ethonal stations as I have ridden with folks that trips to rallies revolve around station hopping.

 

Anyway,  I figure chemistry has improved over the last few years and there may be some better options available.

 

After much research I have narrowed it down to 3 products.

 

1. Blue Lightning seem to be the go to for all the off road guys:

 

http://www.blulightning.com/

 

2. An out fit in the UK called Tank Care Products:

 

http://www.tankcareproducts.co.uk/

 

    These folks will even do the job for you. Hoping maybe some of you folk on the other side of the pond may have some incite with this product.

 

3. PPG formulated aerospace product:

 

http://www.ppgaerospace.com/Products/Sealants/Specialty-Products/PR-1005-L-Buna-N-Slosh-Coating.aspx

 

Experience tells me that this is probably the way to go. One, for its simplicity and two, these folks tend to do their homework as well as extensive testing.

 

 

Of course there will be the issue of paint but I am sure this can qualify for its own topic. Of course, it would be great to find someone to send the tank off to for the whole Monty if anyone has a suggestion in that regard. 

 

Thanks

 

[gstallons]

I would go with the PPG product and use alcohol FREE gasoline.

[gstallons]

Anything I have that is not operated on the highway and used year 'round gets alcohol free gasoline. If you have worked on something that has been out of operation for some time that any amount of ethanol you will understand. The ethanol is VERY hygroscopic and captures moisture then bad things happen.

[Lucky Phil]

The issue with tank sealers is getting them to stick to the Nylon used in motorcycle tanks. The PPG product isn't rated for ad hearing to Nylon and I believe I have used this for years in the Aviation industry as a coating over the main tank sealant we used. Nylon certainly isn't a substrate in aviation fuel tanks.

As for the others the same applies, apart from the first one which just says "plastic" tanks, which seems a bit of an off the cuff mention with no detailed product sheet.

For those that don't know its not actually the fuel that causes the swelling issue but the water that's held in suspension that causes the Nylon tanks to swell and Ethonol fuels carry higher concentrations of water in suspension and also attract water more readily. 

Emptying the tanks and drying it out for a month or two in the dry climates seems to recover them it appears.

Prevention is better though, obviously.

BTW the reason the tank you have bought has the paint in that condition is because its had something heavy dropped on it and flexed enough for the paint to crack and peel. Make sure you have a very good look inside it for damage before you use it and or spend money on it. I have one the same in the workshop from an accident damaged bike. 

Ciao

[brlawson]

 

BTW the reason the tank you have bought has the paint in that condition is because its had something heavy dropped on it and flexed enough for the paint to crack and peel. Make sure you have a very good look inside it for damage before you use it and or spend money on it. I have one the same in the workshop from an accident damaged bike. 

Ciao

 

Thanks, this is good info and will give it a thorough inspection. Fortunately, I have very little invested at this point.

 

 

I had interest in the PPG product due to some feedback they provided to an inquiry from a gentleman on a Buell forum that they did in fact include nylon tanks in their testing.

 

Buell forum: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/47623/296201.html

 

Their response:

 

"It should stick to nylon fine. Actually we have a small nylon tank from a UCAV in our lab for testing with PR-1005L. 

Do three or four fill & drain slosh coats to get a good thickness. Allow several hours to air dry between coatings. Since it cures solely by solvent evaporation, getting good air circulation in the tank is very important. You might want to put an airline into promote air exchange. After final coat let dry at least three days. "

 

The multiple coatings may be the ticket.

[Lucky Phil]

 

 

BTW the reason the tank you have bought has the paint in that condition is because its had something heavy dropped on it and flexed enough for the paint to crack and peel. Make sure you have a very good look inside it for damage before you use it and or spend money on it. I have one the same in the workshop from an accident damaged bike. 

Ciao

 

Thanks, this is good info and will give it a thorough inspection. Fortunately, I have very little invested at this point.

 

 

I had interest in the PPG product due to some feedback they provided to an inquiry from a gentleman on a Buell forum that they did in fact include nylon tanks in their testing.

 

Buell forum: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/47623/296201.html

 

Their response:

 

"It should stick to nylon fine. Actually we have a small nylon tank from a UCAV in our lab for testing with PR-1005L. 

Do three or four fill & drain slosh coats to get a good thickness. Allow several hours to air dry between coatings. Since it cures solely by solvent evaporation, getting good air circulation in the tank is very important. You might want to put an airline into promote air exchange. After final coat let dry at least three days. "

 

The multiple coatings may be the ticket.

 

You're tank should be fine, I've dealt with that seller before and he is reputable. My accident damaged tank has paint that looks like yours but internally its fine.

That PPG info is very interesting, will be keen to see the outcome of testing.

Thanks for the info

 

Ciao 

[sp838]

I wouldn't risk it. I've heard many horror stories about do it yourself products delaminating, which can (in a worst case scenario) ruin your engine. I did the same thing you did, ie upgraded my '01 to an in tank pump and filter setup, but I sent my tank to be professionally lined by these guys: http://www.gastanklining.com

Not worth it to me personally to mess around with something as critical as this.

[docc]

I wouldn't risk it. I've heard many horror stories about do it yourself products delaminating, which can (in a worst case scenario) ruin your engine. I did the same thing you did, ie upgraded my '01 to an in tank pump and filter setup, but I sent my tank to be professionally lined by these guys: http://www.gastanklining.com

Not worth it to me personally to mess around with something as critical as this.

What was the approximate cost of professional lining/ date of service?

 

thanks!

[GuzziMoto]

I have used Caswells epoxy tank sealer with good results, including on the wifes V11. As with any paint or coating, good preparation is key.

[sp838]

This thread made me reconsider doing it myself using Caswells: http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=16928&hl=caswell%26%2339%3Bs

 

The cost of doing it by GTL Advantage was not cheap by any means, I think it was around $400 when it was all said and done, shipped back and forth to CA. Well worth it in my opinion, for something this important and that is guaranteed and should last the lifetime of the bike.

[sculler2x]

I would go with the PPG product and use alcohol FREE gasoline.

What fuel are you using?  I had to pay $12 per gallon for Sunoco alcohol free race fuel, ouch.

[GuzziMoto]

 

I would go with the PPG product and use alcohol FREE gasoline.

What fuel are you using?  I had to pay $12 per gallon for Sunoco alcohol free race fuel, ouch.

 

In some areas of the USA you can still buy non-ethanol gasoline at the normal pump, at a normal price.

Other areas, including where I live (and likely where you live) that is not possible and race gas or high dollar small engine fuel is the only way you can buy fuel without 10% ethanol.

Other than sealing the tank on the V11, and that was not so much done because I had to but rather done because I had he tank apart and dried out, I have not had any issues running 10% ethanol fuel in my motorcycles. In my area we have had 10% ethanol for so long I can't remember not having it. I stopped worrying about it a long time ago. I have had issues with some small engines, including the poor excuse for fuel line on my snow blower turning to taffy. But by and large we have not had much in the way of issues. I wish Guzzi made their gas tanks from a better plastic, one that was fully compatible with ethanol as was required at the time the V11 was sold. But that is milk under the bridge, or is that spilled water......

[gstallons]

 

I would go with the PPG product and use alcohol FREE gasoline.

What fuel are you using?  I had to pay $12 per gallon for Sunoco alcohol free race fuel, ouch.

 

www.pure-gas.com  I think is the website you can use to find alcohol free pumps.

[gstallons]

www.pure-gas.org is the site I found to locate alcohol free pumps. Sorry about the first entry.

[JBBenson]

I wouldn't risk it. I've heard many horror stories about do it yourself products delaminating, which can (in a worst case scenario) ruin your engine. I did the same thing you did, ie upgraded my '01 to an in tank pump and filter setup, but I sent my tank to be professionally lined by these guys: http://www.gastanklining.com

Not worth it to me personally to mess around with something as critical as this.

Huh. These guys are like 10 minutes from me. Maybe I will stop by and show them my V11 and see what they say.