It will not Start

[Robinhood45]

My 02 V11 had an intermittent issue of not starting...that is we had enough battery voltage so everything works.....but the fuel pump won't start and no electrical crank.

 

Now I have a feeling this is somewhat common on this machine.....the second relay is clicking but nothing!!!  I just pray that the quiet reassurance of the fuel pump will kick in...BUT NOTHING HAPPENS 

 

Now it won't start at all...I went through the fuses and to me it seems like a relay....oh, the kick stand switch has been disabled ...

 

Help

[czakky]

Clutch switch? Ignition switch? Relays?

 

Clutch switch is left side of the tank up front two bullet connectors. They need a grooming on occasion.

 

Just cleaned my ignition switch and my bike has been starting as good as ever! Take it apart and give it a good lubing and cleaning.

 

You can switch around the relays I believe only the front is a five pin. If they're old get some new ones (all 5 pin) Omron or GEI are the best/better choice... Also check there connections at the base.

That's the easy stuff.

[Kiwi_Roy]

 

Check for 12 Volts on the far most large socket (30) of relay 3 (aka TP-b ), that comes from the ignition switch, if it's not there could be a wire broken off the switch.

The switch is very easy to remove, it's attached to the key mechanism by 2 Phillips screws underneath at the rear.

 

From relay 3 (87) power goes to the kill switch then back to fuse 8 (if you have an electric petcock). If you don't have a petcock try to find 12 Volts on one of small pins of relay 4 

 

When relay 4 picks up it triggers the ECU to prime the pump.

[Kiwi_Roy]

Only the start relay needs to be 5 pin but most owners install them in all slots.

Actually a 4 pin relay will appear to work in all slots it will cause the starter to crank but the 5th pin in the start slot feeds power to the headlight relay when the relay is not energized, without power to the headlight relay the charging will not work (unless you have an aftermarket direct connected regulator)

 

If you have never changed out the relays I suggest you get a new set from Pyro Dan or Omrons from www.digikey.com part No Z2247-ND  Last time I bought them the Omrons were made in Italy, your V11 can hardly complain about that.

 

I should first of all asked if you had checked the battery connections and main ground.
Scrape the battery posts and apply some grease, this protects the lead from Oxygen in the air which causes it to Oxidize, Lead Oxide is an insulator. The main ground should be connected to a gearbox bolt down near the seat release key, again with a little grease to prevent corrosion.
Vaseline is my grease of choice.

Sent you a PM
 

[Rox Lemans]

How old is your battery?

[Kiwi_Roy]

If you look at the sketch I posted, read it from left to right, everything to the right relies on what's to the left to be ok e.g the stand relay won't get power until the fuse is ok and the switch is on.
Test for power at the stand relay 30 (because it's easy to access), if it's not there look back to the left. If it's there look at a point further right.
 

[Robinhood45]

Thanks for the input...I've got some real items to go through...this was an intermittent issue until it finally gave out completely.....and yes the battery is in good shape....everything else works great...just no fuel pump or crank motor engagement (it does nothing)

[rossi46]

kill switch?

[fotoguzzi]

kill switch?

wouldn't that be a great solution?

[Kiwi_Roy]

Here's another sketch, with an ohmmeter you can check all the switches from under the seat, disconnect the battery and pull the relays and fuses.

 

With the key On you should get zero Ohms between the bottom of fuse 4 to Relay 3/30

I'm not sure how you have the stand switch jumpered but you should get zero Ohms between  Relay 3/30 and 3/87

Test the kill switch between 3/30 and fuse 8 or if you don't have electric petcock Relay 3/30 to Relay 4/85

 

In later years the wiring changed around the relays 

BTW note Relay 1 is the only one with a wire on terminal 87A (the only one that needs a 5 pin relay)

[Robinhood45]

OK...thanks for all the great input....I changed all 5 relays with 5 pin units and ...IT RUNS

 

I'm not sure if the change out from 4 pin to 5 pin makes any difference....it appears that pin position 4 would go to a "dead" connection so "no harm no foul".........

 

I'm defiantly getting a new manual!!!

 

THANKS ALL!!

[Kiwi_Roy]

Congratulations

 

You are right, 4 pins are fine for most slots but what's the difference in cost to have all interchangeable relays?

 

Every new to me Guzzi I get I swap all the relays for a new set, start off on the right foot.

 

I'm still puzzled why it wouldn't crank, would you mind looking into the base of relay 3 to see if there's a metal contact in the middle of the 3 small ones.

-----

-----

|  |  |

   ^ this one here.

Thanks

Roy

[fotoguzzi]

http://www.thisoldtractor.com/mg_manuals/owners_manual_v11_le_mans_2002_it-en-fr-de.pdf

 

 

I'm defiantly getting a new manual!!!

 

THANKS ALL!!

[plexiform]

I have a starting problem also and hoping someone could help.  I just picked up a 2002 v11 scura and it started initially but the battery was dead when i brought the bike home so i put it on the trickle charger and got it reading 12.48v.  When i try to start it now i can hear a pump turn on i can here starter turning but then it slows down real fast and eventually blows fuse #4 for the ignition switch.  is that because i am pressing the engine start button for longer than 5 seconds?  Anyway i changed out the fuse and it happened again.  I can't get the bike started now.  Battery is less than a yr old assuming the previous owner is honest but he hadn't been riding much and did not have it on a tender.  Where do I start troubleshooting this?

[GuzziMoto]

First off, 12.48 volts is pretty much a dead battery. It should show up around 12.8 volts, I know that seems like a small difference but it is not.

You either need to fully charge the battery (if it will take it) or replace the battery.

That could explain the blown fuse.