Decent Tune-up

[gstallons]

You want to get the max vacuum reading on each individual cylinder . This vacuum tube is not connected to the other port . The balance tube is connected to both ports and is used to balance the cylinders to get the same power output . 

This is my opinion on the results you are looking for .

[docc]

After struggling mightily to get my Sport to run right after the last Decent Tune-up, I tracked down a series of contributors. As is common,  so many issues are "multi-causal."

I found a slightly flinky TPS and replaced it with a PF3C from cacycleworks. Spraying throttle body cleaner on the ends of the throttle plate shafts revealed a significant leak on the bottom left. I recommend this simple test for vacuum leaks when you tune-up, especially as these V11 get up in age and mileage. Check the shafts, rubber mounting boots to the intake manifolds, as well as the vacuum taps. I neglected this last step and later noticed discoloration around the left tap. Snugged up almost 1/4 turn! Also replaced the dried-out cracked rubber caps that have been on there for years.

The difference in idle stability, popping and backfiring from that leak has been an amazement!

[footgoose]

thanks Docc, for your continued care and attention. 

[fubar guzzi]

Doc I"m havin ah hell of a good time gettin to the tps setting,please show us in DETAIL how u connect the break out harness to the multi meter. By chance do u connect both outer tps wires together,then connect to the multi meter? You show a yellow wire(middle) but none with the end to the tps(on the multi meter). With mine I get mV through all 3 wires,I am not using the middle(yellow) wire at all for testing. the engine will not start due to excess flooding,any idea what thats about??? 98ev11 calif----thanks

[docc]

Hi,fubar guzzi!

Connect the break out harness to the TPS by simply unplugging the connector and inserting the break out harness plugging it all back together. The violet/black wire is positive and the violet is negative. The yellow wire is not used for the measurement.

Looking at Post#1, first image, you can see I put bullet connectors on the wire ends to make it easier to connect the alligator clips of the multimeter. Also, I used red and black heat shrink to mark the + and - .

[edited the original post to reference the +/-  connections. Thanks, fubar guzzi! ]

Good luck, buddy! No doubt a well set TPS is crucial to these bikes running their best . . .

[fubar guzzi]

  Thanks for your quick response + interest with my problem.For some reason I have 3 hot wires,the middle or yellow wire we don't worry about,its the other 2 that concern me.Somewhere I read the multi tester is connected to the battery,so if striped wire is hot + plain wire is neg. then things just got a lot easier. When connected I find the multi meter is in overload mode + the numbers are different each time I check (roaming ????). While checking the harness separately I find exactly the same multi readings as when connected to the tps----SOOOOOO what that tells me is there must be a short between the bike harness + the ecu,I will perform a continuity test + see what the outcome is!   I purchased a engine temp sensor from MG Cycle however it is not made for the 98 ev ,so beware---they are happy to except a return (there mistake) then I'll purchase the correct one.

     thank you for your input .

[po18guy]

As to idle speed adjustment, I backed out the left throttle plate stop screw a turn or so. No change. Applying "slight" counter-clockwise (anti-clockwise) torque to the cable attachment "spindle" atop the left throttle body slowed the idle. Thus, I went to the other side. That screw is not as out-in-the-open as the left side, but it is doable. However, it was rather tight from not being moved for 15 years as well as the electrolytic activity between the steel screw and alloy throttle body.

The Eklind 2.5mm ball-end wrench was a so-so fit, slightly on the loose side to suit me. Scanning my eclectic assortment of otherwise useless sockets and bits, I spied a WIHA T10 hex bit. Torx bits have essentially the same contact surface as a standard hex wrench, so why not give it a try. Aha! And, using it with a Pittsburgh (Harbor Freight) right angle ratcheting screwdriver (an exorbitant $2.99) did the trick. Idle now being too low, I brought it up to 1050 +/- using the left throttle body screw. All is right with the world once again**

**A few notable exceptions, but all-in-all rather good.  

 

*

[docc]

Progress! For best outcome, perform the entire "Decent Tune-up" . . .

[po18guy]

Well, at 5300 miles everything seems pretty good. Being a perennial rider of twins, I am sensitive to throttle imbalance. It seems that Big Red does quite well in that regard. New Iridium plugs already and the air filter is more old than dirty. The valves are not terribly noisy, which is a concern… ;-) 

[Tom in Virginia]

After changing exhaust gaskets I used these (Docc) guidelines to retune my 03 V11.  Old exhaust gasket leaks (at the front crossover) definitely contributed to my 3-4K rpm cough.  After replacement it was better but had returned albeit a weaker "spit".  After removing and cleaning the air bleed screws (very sooty) and rebalancing the throttle bodies and then a test run of 60km this morning .... at long last problem resolved.  All in all I found it to be an amazingly simple fix.  The bike has never run better (since I purchased 7 years ago).  All smiles here (and I saved some bank $$$).  Thanks to Docc and the rest of the contributing forum members!  Happy miles to all

 

[Lucky Phil]

57 minutes ago, Tom in Virginia said:

After changing exhaust gaskets I used these (Docc) guidelines to retune my 03 V11.  Old exhaust gasket leaks (at the front crossover) definitely contributed to my 3-4K rpm cough.  After replacement it was better but had returned albeit a weaker "spit".  After removing and cleaning the air bleed screws (very sooty) and rebalancing the throttle bodies and then a test run of 60km this morning .... at long last problem resolved.  All in all I found it to be an amazingly simple fix.  The bike has never run better (since I purchased 7 years ago).  All smiles here (and I saved some bank $$$).  Thanks to Docc and the rest of the contributing forum members!  Happy miles to all

 

Dont bet on it yet.

Ciao

[Tom in Virginia]

1 hour ago, Lucky Phil said:

Dont bet on it yet.

Ciao

OK, I won't.  Maybe just overly optimistic...  Any suggestions or advice?

 

[Lucky Phil]

52 minutes ago, Tom in Virginia said:

OK, I won't.  Maybe just overly optimistic...  Any suggestions or advice?

 

I had the same response when I swapped to gear driven cams after hearing that timing chain wear caused the hiccuping. Rode around a bit and it seemed cured with the gears but then the weather changed and warmed up a bit and it was back. I think its just mapping and a lot more prevalent under certain atmospheric conditions.

The EFI experts may have a better handle on it than me though.

Ciao     

[docc]

18 hours ago, Lucky Phil said:

Dont bet on it yet.

Ciao

No question my Sport has offered up hiccups for a myriad reasons from tune-up to relays to coil wire connections and on (and on). She absolutely hates ethanol fuel with high ambient temperatures stuck in traffic.

Yet, a regular "decent" tune-up and quality fuel, along with keeping the motor "on the cam" (not "lugging it)  can yield some awesome running even on the apparently flawed factory map. If a complete "decent" tune-up doesn't yield adequate results, time to look for flaws and other issues. Chasing other issues before a decent tune-up will be a formula for frustration and may lead to a craigslist ad.

Currently, Meinolf's latest map version (v.93?) would provide the cleanest, most well developed map available for those inclined. Some of the tuning parameters differ for his map, yet no map is a substitute for a complete tune-up.

[Gmc28]

Tune Maestro’s- 

A quick question or two on throttle body sync for the guzzi:  I ran through finishing up the tune on Red yesterday.  First time using Guzzidiag, so aside from a few “ah, that’s how that works....” moments, seems all good.

but on the TBS, i used my old Twinmax.  It’s been used quite a lot over the years on my Oilhead, which i sold a couple years ago.  It needed sync work far too often over the 77k miles that i had it (but that’s another story, of only mild interest...).  But when syncing that flat twin with the twinmax, going to the fully “sensitive” setting and then twisting throttle to typical operating RPM, the needle would bounce around and in fact be very sensitive, as the setting would imply.  On the V11 though, even in that most sensitive setting, there’s not much bouncing around of the needle.  In fact, at max sensitivity, its shockingly easy to adjust the sync, which is something I’m not used to.  

I’ll take that as a good thing, but it does seem a little out of place for what I’m used to, so can’t but wonder whether the TB’s just aren’t as finicky on the V11’s, or if i have something wrong somehow.  

Another thing, while I’m sitting here thinking about it......Turning the white knob also presented an unexpected, albeit very minor issue:  I’d adjust the knob up and down to watch and see that i was in fact able to effect the sync, and then adjust it to a centered twinmax needle.  But adjusting the knob caused the linkage arm to twist and cock the arm to its max rotation at the ball joint each time. So I’d just twist the arm/ball-Joint back to neutral, which in turn had a minor but actual effect on sync.  Seems all fine, with just a little extra monkey-motion required to get things right by twisting the white knob, then verifying things again once i moved the ball joint back to neutral, but does that sound normal, or i am missing something in my technique?  The ball joint does like to stay where it should once i move it back to neutral, but always cant’s To the side and stays canted when i adjust the white knob till I manually re-center it.   The effect is Very small, almost negligible, but you can see the effect on the twin max when messing with the joint.   

Anyway, just running that by you experienced guzzi tuners.

 Next, and later when i find time, I’ll plug in Goldie and see if i can find any clues as to why she runs so different than Red.  When i first got Goldie, Dave Blue was in town so i got him to tune her for me, and he did a great job (and was a real pleasure to meet him).  She sings at high rpm.   Docc mentions riding the V11 “on the cam”, and Goldie is certainly that way, whereas Red loves to be in that “tractor” range, just pulling clean and smooth below about 4500 rpm, but flat after that....she really seems to love the lower rpm, torquey zone, whereas Goldie never wants to be below 4500-5000 rpm.