My 2003 V11 Sport Modifications

[docc]

Plus, I recall something about the first 6,000 revolutions using a richer mixture?

[gstallons]

Yep . it does this trick after every start . 

[BLIGHT]

Plus, I recall something about the first 6,000 revolutions using a richer mixture?

 

Wow, that's really interesting!

 

So.... if you let the bike idle from a cold start for 5 or 6 minutes at 1000-1200 rpm, that's 6000 total revs before it clears up.

 

If it does this after every start, then it might run pretty crappy (too rich) on a warm or HOT start.

 

By the way... I've been checking MPG, and it runs right about 30 mpg consistently with my particular riding style.

 

Is this normal or am I just pushing it pretty hard? That's the same mpg I get on my 1975 Kawasaki H1 500cc 2 stroke triple. 

 

I have to rev the V11 pretty high at large throttle openings to make good power... way more fun, but that uses a lot more fuel.

 

Kind of like riding an older 750 UJM.... you had to wring it's neck compared to a similar-age UJM liter-bike.

 

My old Honda VTR 996 SuperHawk v-twin was a monster... 120 hp at the crank, and I could short-shift all day long and still go way too fast.

 

Not complaining mind you, I do love the Guzzi! Just a little surprised it doesn't really feel like an 1100cc v-twin to me.

 

I've owned about 70 motorcycles in my 62 years (still have 19 of them) so I have a lot of comparisons to draw from.

 

This is my 1st Moto Guzzi, and I'm very glad I bought it! 

 

BLIGHT

[swooshdave]

I don't baby mine and I don't think I've gotten mileage that low. docc will be along shortly to renin to to give it a proper tune up. Of course you didn't take off the airbox, right? That could cause the lower fuel economy.

[czakky]

I get around 36mpg, I mostly beat the heck out of my bike. Power comes on around 4500rpm you're really in the power by 6500, revving past 7k torque starts to taper.

 

You're running pods? Have you set the TPS? Valve adjust? CO trim?

 

That's where I'd start.

[Chuck]

For whatever reason, you are running way too rich. 

[docc]

 

Plus, I recall something about the first 6,000 revolutions using a richer mixture?

 

So.... if you let the bike idle from a cold start for 5 or 6 minutes at 1000-1200 rpm, that's 6000 total revs before it clears up.

 

If it does this after every start, then it might run pretty crappy (too rich) on a warm or HOT start.

I just pull away once she cranks up, keeping revs below 5,000 until I feel the oil is warm (maybe 6-8 miles). I never notice crappy running on hot start. In fact, she sparks right up

 

docc will be along shortly to renin to to give it a proper tune up.

And install High Current Relays!

http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=19755&p=216605

 

I get around 36mpg, I mostly beat the heck out of my bike. Power comes on around 4500rpm you're really in the power by 6500, revving past 7k torque starts to taper.

 

You're running pods? Have you set the TPS? Valve adjust? CO trim?

 

That's where I'd start.

All of the above!

[got'yer Decent Tune-up rat'cheer):

http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=19610

 

For whatever reason, you are running way too rich. 

Aye, bringing all the various parameters into spec will likely put you in the mid-30s mpg (or better).

 

Unless someone has done some creative modifications (deleted the airbox or unhooked the right side head temperature sensor), or the air filter needs a serious service to take the mouse nest out.

[BLIGHT]

I've finally gotten the bike to run very well... I reset the valves, it is running pods without an airbox, Power Commander III (now with a proper map), free-flow mufflers, new plugs, clipped NGK wires & caps, tightened all ground connections, new battery, OMRON relays, synched TB, etc.

 

It actually spins the rear tire in 1st when I gas it hard...pulls strongly in the midrange now too (no 3K stumbles) and pulls hard to redline.

 

The PO had the valves adjusted, and yes.... they were too tight. I set them to .006/.008. A little ticking now, but carb farts are gone.

 

To be fair, on the Monterey peninsula where I ride it's a lot of stop and go riding (tourist traffic and long signal lights!) and much of my rides involve going back and forth quickly over a steep, curvy grade (Laureles) to visit other twisty roads.

 

I don't feel it's running rich at all.. the muffler tips are a light grey, and the plugs are clean and what I would call a perfect color.

 

Probably, if I was cruising along a highway at 65-75 (how boring!) it would get another 8 to 10 mpg. Just don't ride that way unless I have to.

 

None of my bikes have the 'flat-center' rear treads... they wear evenly edge to edge!

 

Thanks for all the tips guys. She is running so much better now than when I got it thanks to your inputs... like night and day.

 

Guess I'm just 'spoiled' power-wise with my VFR1200... 97 ft-lbs of torque and ~170 crank hp can quickly spoil you for anything less. 

BLIGHT

[GuzziMoto]

I've finally gotten the bike to run very well... I reset the valves, it is running pods without an airbox, Power Commander III (now with a proper map), free-flow mufflers, new plugs, clipped NGK wires & caps, tightened all ground connections, new battery, synched TB, etc.

 

It actually spins the rear tire in 1st when I gas it hard...pulls strongly in the midrange now too (no 3K stumbles) and pulls hard to redline.

 

The PO had the valves adjusted, and yes.... they were too tight. I set them to .006/.008. A little ticking now, but carb farts are gone.

 

To be fair, on the Monterey peninsula where I ride it's a lot of stop and go riding (tourist traffic and long signal lights!) and much of my rides involve going back and forth quickly over a steep, curvy grade (Laureles) to visit other twisty roads.

 

I don't feel it's running rich at all.. the muffler tips are a light grey, and the plugs are clean and what I would call a perfect color.

 

Probably, if I was cruising along a highway at 65-75 (how boring!) it would get another 8 to 10 mpg. Just don't ride that way unless I have to.

 

None of my bikes have the 'flat-center' rear treads... they wear evenly edge to edge!

 

Thanks for all the tips guys. She is running so much better now than when I got it thanks to your inputs... like night and day.

 

Guess I'm just 'spoiled' power-wise with my VFR1200... 97 ft-lbs of torque and ~170 crank hp can quickly spoil you for anything less. 

BLIGHT

The V11 should have almost as much torque as your VFR 1200.

I find the V11 does like to rev, but it is also a midrange motor. I remember ages ago riding with a buddy on an R1 (this was over 10 years ago). The V11 would just gap him out of corners without downshifting. If he downshifted the R1 was clearly faster, but the R1 had to spin up before it made more power, The V11 was so easy to ride, you just twist and go.

[BLIGHT]

I get around 36mpg, I mostly beat the heck out of my bike. Power comes on around 4500rpm you're really in the power by 6500, revving past 7k torque starts to taper.

 

You're running pods? Have you set the TPS? Valve adjust? CO trim?

 

That's where I'd start.

hmm, my old V11 (15 years old now) pulls the hardest at 6000 to 8500... with no power tapering, and increasing harder all the way to the rev limiter.

 

I just hate revving the pee out it! I think of those big old parts flying around in there and I worry it will all fly to pieces!

 

Let's face it.... we all have varying states of tune, varying fuel quality, varying compression, varying ambient temps, varying barometric pressure, varying valve clearances, and varying humidity.

 

And all of these variables change by the minute!!!

 

Clearly there is no "one recipe fits all" when you consider all of these physical and regional variables.

 

And that includes EFI maps.... the maps and hardware do what they can to compensate for the variables, but they are not perfect all of the time.

BLIGHT

[BLIGHT]

 

I've finally gotten the bike to run very well... I reset the valves, it is running pods without an airbox, Power Commander III (now with a proper map), free-flow mufflers, new plugs, clipped NGK wires & caps, tightened all ground connections, new battery, synched TB, etc.

 

It actually spins the rear tire in 1st when I gas it hard...pulls strongly in the midrange now too (no 3K stumbles) and pulls hard to redline.

 

The PO had the valves adjusted, and yes.... they were too tight. I set them to .006/.008. A little ticking now, but carb farts are gone.

 

To be fair, on the Monterey peninsula where I ride it's a lot of stop and go riding (tourist traffic and long signal lights!) and much of my rides involve going back and forth quickly over a steep, curvy grade (Laureles) to visit other twisty roads.

 

I don't feel it's running rich at all.. the muffler tips are a light grey, and the plugs are clean and what I would call a perfect color.

 

Probably, if I was cruising along a highway at 65-75 (how boring!) it would get another 8 to 10 mpg. Just don't ride that way unless I have to.

 

None of my bikes have the 'flat-center' rear treads... they wear evenly edge to edge!

 

Thanks for all the tips guys. She is running so much better now than when I got it thanks to your inputs... like night and day.

 

Guess I'm just 'spoiled' power-wise with my VFR1200... 97 ft-lbs of torque and ~170 crank hp can quickly spoil you for anything less. 

BLIGHT

The V11 should have almost as much torque as your VFR 1200.

I find the V11 does like to rev, but it is also a midrange motor. I remember ages ago riding with a buddy on an R1 (this was over 10 years ago). The V11 would just gap him out of corners without downshifting. If he downshifted the R1 was clearly faster, but the R1 had to spin up before it made more power, The V11 was so easy to ride, you just twist and go.

 

Sorry, but the V11 Sport makes ~70 ft-lbs max at the crank... the VFR1200 makes 97 ft-lbs (and it's a very flat torque curve to 10,200 redline).... that's a big difference. (160-170 crank hp!)

 

Just have to put it in perspective I'd say though: The VFR is a V4 1237cc liquid-cooled four-valve motor with a 10,200 redline, so it's gonna have more HP power than a 2 valve air-cooled v-twin with a lower compression (9.8 vs. 12.0 to 1) and a lower engine redline. 

 

The VFR1200 has more low end, mid-range, and top-end rush than any bike I've ever owned or ridden.

 

BTW, the 97 ft-lbs is for a stock VFR1200 motor.... I've done some EFI tuning and a custom exhaust on mine. It's now way stronger than a stocker.

 

Oh, and because I normally short-shift and lug the VFR around most of the time (still going way fast!) it gets 40 mpg in the same riding cycle.

 

Honestly... I've only taken it to redline a few times (because you don't need to), and then felt like I was a real hoodlum.

 

It can do 62 mph in 1st gear and 94 mph in 2nd gear. You can go to jail in 2nd gear! Hard to keep the front down in 1st.

 

Still 4 more gears to go... it's too much for the street really, but then it's no track bike either.

 

It does handle very well as a sporty tourer (I have the hard bags too) with some definite weight reduction and suspension mods like I've done.

 

But hey, it's really like comparing sushi to linguini... the bikes are just so different!

 

I really love the Guzzi for what it is, how it looks, and how it rides... it's actually a very good handler with great brakes and suspension.

 

The best part is, with 80 hp on tap I can ride the V11 like I stole it and still not get in over my head!

 

BLIGHT

[LowRyter]

the interceptor is a rocketship.

[BLIGHT]

Hi guys,

 

Disconnected the PCIII last night, and it starts and idles just fine running on the 15M ECU alone.

 

After I had uploaded the 'Mistral' .djm map (shown below) to the PCIII, it had a lot more power everywhere.

 

(the PO had installed the PCIII, but it had no map in it!)

 

Unplugged?? Now it's just a lot softer power in low to midrange, and doesn't pull as hard to redline either.

 

No mid-range (3-4K) stumbling as many complain of either....

 

The PCIII richer map was prolly why I've been getting ~30mpg (US)... it's been getting more air from the big pods, and more fuel with the Mistral map...that's the recipe for more power.... it was really happy!

 

Very little muffler restriction either... both cans are 2" ID all the way thru!

 

 

These adjustments above to the stock ECU injection 'pulse widths' are all over the map, eh?! (pun?)

 

Doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to them... some cells have no changes, some have positive, and some have negative.

 

Still, I don't like the idea of a 'band-aid', when we actually have the ability to re-flash our own ECU's!

 

Anyway.... today I will download the ECU stock .bin file and save it to my hard-drive AND a labeled USB drive for safe-keeping!

 

Then, I'll upload the Titanium 2 .bin file that I got off of this forum in another thread.

 

Hopefully that will restore some power, at least back to the PCIII enrichment levels?

 

I'll let you know my 'the seat of the pants' dyno results!

 

Cheers!

BLIGHT

 

PS: Just refueled tonight with 98% of the miles while still on the PCIII + ECU.... ~34 mpg.

I've been shutting it off at our really long signals (like 4 minutes!) because it's pretty dumb to sit there and idle for so long!

Ran outta time to do the map up & down-loads tonight.... stupid work got in the way!