V11 Daytona project

[Paul Minnaert]

And now you want it :-)

[Lucky Phil]

Awesome Paul, above and beyond the call:) You didnt need to destroy a V11 box for me though. I hope it wasn't a usable one.

Ciao

[Paul Minnaert]

it was usable. But was for another idea that never finished. 

[Lucky Phil]

Update, I've been fabricating the front tank mount which has been a challenge conceptually and in a manufacturing sense mainly because I dont have Chucks skills or equipment. A mill would have been handy and if I was making dozens of them water cutting would have been an option but as it stood it was all old fashion hand work from 4mm steel plate. The objectives were to raise the tank around 40 mm and have the fwd mount be adjustable in the horizontal and the vertical, use the original tank mounts unmolested if possible and control any tendency for the new mount to rock back and forth.

The mount here in the images still needs the brass spacers replaced with Titanium ones which I'll machine up from stock which I have. These are just bushes I had around that fit the purpose for mocking up. The vertical plates holding the tank rubbers are tapped to accept 6mm bolts and I'll use some ti nuts as lock nuts, just belt and braces. Originally I was going to use internally threaded Ti rods between the side plates to not only anchor the them together but also to rest on the frame top surface front and rear to prevent the mounts rocking. I have instead tapped the vertical plates the front and rear feet of which contact the top face of the frame to prevent rocking. I'll bond some SS shims onto the frame to prevent chafing.    

The vertical plates will be joined by some 18mm hex alloy bar necked down (so I can get a spanner on it) in the middle and tapped internally both ends to eliminate the mount rubber nuts seen here and connect the two sides together. So I have around 20 mm for and aft adjustment and 15 mm vertical. I also need to make up the spacers between the mount rubbers and the vertical pieces. All the spacers and fasteners will be Ti with the 4 horizontal side plate ones hex head bolts.  

I will then Blue the steel stuff. I'd rather passive cad plate them but that's always problematical these finding platers that will do small stuff.  

The tank outlet and return with the reg will change sides as will the fuel pump to give better clearance to the throttle bodies and the TPS. I have fitted the fuel filter and I need to make an alloy bracket to mount the regulator laying flat on top of the frame backbone in front of the fuel filter using the old fuel filter mounts.

Final tank position

 

reg clearance

Fuel tap clearance

Tank Mount

Fuel filter in the background now sharing the the airbox bracket mount. I'll still run the airbox lid but most of the snorkels will go to make room for the fuel filter. The Alt Reg will mount flat in front of the filter using the old filter mount. Not my first choice for a location due to the engine heat but my 1198 unit is in a lot worse location right behind the oil cooler.    

Ciao

[Lucky Phil]

So I managed to make a mount for the regulator from 4 mm aluminium plate just need to pretty it up a little. I also found a new place for the stupid horn. I totally dont need a horn fitted to a bike but its a legal requirement here so its fitted. Getting rid of the 2nd one though. There's plenty of space under the tank now but real estate between the V is tight.

I had to re think the swapping of the reg and feed tap as there's no real room on the rhs of the frame to mount the pump as the main wiring loom runs there. The only issue is the reg body is close to the TPS connector but it should be ok. The benefit is it simplifies the fuel hose routing.

The fuel will come from the pump on the rhs to the filter then over to the throttle body on the lhs then cross over to the rhs tb then from there to the reg and back into the tank. 

Found out I need a Centy throttle cable as well. 

 

Ciao

 

[68C]

Really impressed.  I have always done minor mods to my bikes, surprising how long it takes to just alter a mounting bracket or move a component.  The standing and thinking always takes much longer than the actual doing.  You can forgive designers making apparently odd decisions when they have a whole bike to figure out.

[Lucky Phil]

1 hour ago, 68C said:

Really impressed.  I have always done minor mods to my bikes, surprising how long it takes to just alter a mounting bracket or move a component.  The standing and thinking always takes much longer than the actual doing.  You can forgive designers making apparently odd decisions when they have a whole bike to figure out.

Your'e exactly right, its the working stuff out that takes the time plus I'm slow at that. I can come up with solutions but i'm not fast at it. I have a good mate that arrives at the same solutions as me usually but he figures out in 5 min what it takes me a week to work out. He has a really strong ability to visualise things and it's a fantastic gift. Interestingly after he had a course of chemotherapy he lost the ability but after a year or two he gradually regained it. I often need to see stuff in the flesh and then modify and refine it.

Ciao  

[68C]

I often use bits of cardboard glue etc to make a rough pattern gives me something to measure from for the next bit.

[Lucky Phil]

So here's the airbox task. Hole needs to be raised 16mm or there abouts and the bottom filled in. The airbox looks like its made of cross linked Polyethylene which isnt weldable....naturally:)Typically I just looked at it and thought it was. I've learned quite a bit about plastic in the last week and I now have a plan.

Ciao

 

 

[po18guy]

Hmmm. Some late-night musing here, as the snow falls. It's either a thermoplastic (weldable) or a thermo-setting plastic (bondable). Have you had it off recently to see the recycling mark molded into it? Or, do you have the bits trimmed off? It either melts to the soldering iron or you can epoxy a like plastic to it. If a local plastics supply has a sheet of similar stuff, you could make up a ring which would be concentric with the intake boot,covering the gap and appearing somewhat "factory."

[Lucky Phil]

40 minutes ago, po18guy said:

Hmmm. Some late-night musing here, as the snow falls. It's either a thermoplastic (weldable) or a thermo-setting plastic (bondable). Have you had it off recently to see the recycling mark molded into it? Or, do you have the bits trimmed off? It either melts to the soldering iron or you can epoxy a like plastic to it. If a local plastics supply has a sheet of similar stuff, you could make up a ring which would be concentric with the intake boot,covering the gap and appearing somewhat "factory."

No identification of any sort. I have now found it can be well bonded by using a Polyethylene welding rod as a hot melt glue. Gives a strong bond. The airbox material itself doesnt melt but the rod bonds it well. 

Ciao

[stewgnu]

What about bonding a fresh piece of plastic over the whole front box area? Then you could cut new holes anywhere you like..?

[po18guy]

1 hour ago, Lucky Phil said:

No identification of any sort. I have now found it can be well bonded by using a Polyethylene welding rod as a hot melt glue. Gives a strong bond. The airbox material itself doesnt melt but the rod bonds it well. 

Ciao

If it is made of the same stuff as the lid, I have a spare which I can check and advise of the type of plastic it is. From the pic which Paul Minnaert posted above, it appears that it might be glass-filled nylon, which can be bonded with liquid epoxy, JB Weld (steel-reinforced epoxy) or similar. If it did not melt and ball up on the hole saw, it is probably a thermo-setting plastic.

[Lucky Phil]

1 hour ago, po18guy said:

If it is made of the same stuff as the lid, I have a spare which I can check and advise of the type of plastic it is. From the pic which Paul Minnaert posted above, it appears that it might be glass-filled nylon, which can be bonded with liquid epoxy, JB Weld (steel-reinforced epoxy) or similar. If it did not melt and ball up on the hole saw, it is probably a thermo-setting plastic.

No fibres present in the plastic and JB steel weld can be picked off with your fingernail even with a well prepared surface. It would be interesting to know what it is exactly but the Polyethylene welding rod seems to work which is a recognised process for cross linked poly, although as I said its not really welding more hot gluing. Been reading up on high surface energy plastics, interesting stuff. I tried several adhesives I know work well and all of them were a failure. Fortunately the fill piece doesn't have a big job to do just support about 1/3 of the seal and keep the dust out.

Ciao 

[docc]

I recall how hard I found the lid's intake material was to "bellmouth" back in 2015. I went looking through that thread for any reference to the material, but found more fun than science.

I know that surprises you guys about me.