2004 Lemans - won't start

[Taxguy]

The other day my Lemans was vapour locking but I managed to coax it back to my house.  A few days later I went to start it and there is nothing.  I have power but the fuel injection is not priming and there is nothing when I hit the starter. I have checked battery connections and fuses and all is OK there.  Any ideas of what to check next?  Thanks.

[docc]

When you turn the key on all lights come on? Brake light works and horn?

If so, thumb the starter button. Not even a click? Holding the clutch in and the keeping the starter button pressed, sweep the steering lock-to-lock. Starter engages suddenly? This will be the two weak "bullet connectors" along the forward, left side of the frame needing attention (clean, crimp, Caig DeOxit or Vaseline, heat shrink, and groom them into place where the steering will not tug them open).

[Taxguy]

Thanks Docc.  It appears that a previous owner has already addressed this issue. Turning the bars didn't make a difference.

[docc]

So, those Scotch Locks are to eliminate the bullet connectors? Might as well take them apart and make more secure connections (Lap splice, crimp connectors, etc.) and seal them well against the weather and blow. Those connections could still be problematic.

Lights come on? Horn? (Edging toward relays next . . . .)

[footgoose]

The vapor lock issue is an interesting one, on it's own. I am not versed in it. I did however, have an issue similar to yours some time ago. I thought it was vapor lock. I would shut it off to get gas, and it would not restart. It would crank, no fire. Let cool, and it started. This happened 3 times, the last time no start at all. It was relay #5 and I'm fairly sure what I experienced was that it failed "gradually" .. similar to an incandescent light filament that will break and sometimes repair itself.  

It gets hot in Indiana, and I have a fuel filter between the jugs. I've never had any symptoms of what I might describe as vapor lock, other than what turned out to be a failed relay for the fuel pump. What were your vapor lock symptoms?

[Kiwi_Roy]

If its not priming you are not getting power to the ECU relay (49) via the single way connector (57)

This also explains why the starter will not turn over, no power at the Start button (35)

The Sidestand switch or side stand relay is where I would start looking. Note how the side stand switch (known point of failure) feeds power to the Kill Switch. When in Neutral the relay bypasses the switch.

Your lemans wiring may be a little different than this but the same basic idea, pull the Stand relay and poke a wire in the socket 30 to 87, note some bikes use the 87A contact but you will be able to tell by looking for the brass contact, they only put it in the one they are using.

Its also possible you have a broken wire at the ignition switch, a quick check for 12 Volts at the fuses would clear that up

Of course there's also the possibility of a bad relay (46) or (49) use the bypassed stand relay and headlight relay in slot 4 & 5 to test.

 

I agree with Chuck, those connectors are awful but that's not the problem in this case, the bike is not priming which is independent of the start button, it primes when the ECU relay closes. 

[Chuck]

1 hour ago, Taxguy said:

Thanks Docc.  It appears that a previous owner has already addressed this issue. Turning the bars didn't make a difference.

Eewww, that's ugly. That's *not* an airworthy connection.

[Tomchri]

1 hour ago, Taxguy said:

Thanks Docc.  It appears that a previous owner has already addressed this issue. Turning the bars didn't make a difference.

And it seems to have been hot already,, greenish melting plastic.

Cheers tom.

[andy york]

2004 should not be very prone to vapor lock. I do believe you have the in tank filter and pump.Earlier models had the pump and filter 

mounted on the spine under the tank....definitely vapor lock candidate.

If the starter switch ever doesn't "work", try to jump the starter. It will spark, but if the starter engages, it eliminates a few things.

If the pump is not priming ...as said...look at the relays...you can also find the fuel pump connector some where under there and give it 

12volts. Should be fairly simple...Check all your grounds too!!!   magic smoke seems to disappear on these bikes

[gstallons]

2 hours ago, Tomchri said:

And it seems to have been hot already,, greenish melting plastic.

Cheers tom.

ScotchLock connectors are all time $hit .

[Taxguy]

I finally got around to pulling the Lemans out of the corner of the garage, and sure enough the problem is related to the side stand switch.  Once I put the stand up it fired right up.  But, I noticed that I have no neutral light, I am thinking there must be a sensor not working so it doesn’t know its in neutral and so won’t start with the stand down.

[gstallons]

Disconnect and ground the N switch wire . It should start .

[docc]

2 hours ago, gstallons said:

Disconnect and ground the N switch wire . It should start .

As gstallons says . . .

If you roll the bike back & fro to make sure it is really in neutral and only one click up from first (not a 'false' neutral), it should crank with the stand down.

If not, it's the middle relay/ neutral switch/ connection on the left of the gearbox sideplate.

That neutral switch spade connector is so vulnerable under its wee rubber boot . . .

[gstallons]

Yeah N is good . I don't think you wanna post pics of your bike starting in gear . Or should I say , the results of your bike having started in gear . 

[docc]

I remember once having a no start/ no neutral light and I could roll the bike back in forth like it was in neutral. But it was between gears and wouldn't start since the neutral switch and its middle relay were not activated.

Felt pretty stupid. At least I figured it out before taking the bike completely down to bits . . .