Let's talk about the elephant in the room: Ebikes! they are coming. Wheither we want it or not... what will you do?

[po18guy]

My response will be to add two additional Fiamm horns to blast them out of the way.

[po18guy]

6 hours ago, footgoose said:

yes all of that, yes. They haven't figured out where the ''clean'' electricity comes from.

 

That, good sir, is someone else's problem. As long as the source is in Cali - where everything causes cancer, no problem.

[Chuck]

Ok, I'll chime in. While I *love* airplane noise, especially a "gaggle" of these boogers roaring around.. Mother Earth is saying we really need to quit burning fossil fuels. Yesterday. The energy companies knew in the 70s that continued use of fossil fuels would upset the earth's natural carbon balance and decided to hire scientists to muddy the "climate change" waters. (Yes, there is proof of that.) It is the same scenario as when GM and the Ethyl corporation hired scientists to say the lead in the air that was causing birth defects, etc. were "normal" and "always" had been there. Finally, climate scientists did bore samples and determined that no, that wasn't true at all. We've cleaned that up. Remember the "ozone holes?" Fixed that.

We have the capability to use renewable energy.. it will take a concerted effort, but we need to do it.

Off the soap box.

[Scud]

Where I live, electric bicycles seem to be everywhere, and the dealers are having a hard time keeping supply. I'm seeing more of the cargo and other utility bikes too - going to the grocery store, out for dinner, doing errands. Street legal electric carts too - 3 or 4 wheelers.

We just got an electric bicycle for my wife. All set up with basket on the back. I'm thinking about getting one myself. One of my neighbors has 6 e-bikes, one for everyone in the family. They go a lot of places together that they would previously have driven a car. They are having more fun, getting a bit of exercise, and burning less fossil fuels. One of the bike just rolled over 5,000 miles.

This is in line with the video @Lucky Phil posted on the previous page. While I am not ready to give up my gas powered motorcycles, or my F250 that tows my trailer, I should be willing to ride an electric bike whenever practical. And if I had solar panels on my house, that would make it even "greener" - but I don't.

[GuzziMoto]

We already have an electric car, a Chevy Bolt. I was one of those that thought I would never drive an electric car. I do love the sound and feel of an internal combustion engine (ICE). But the Bolt does what I need it to do, and it does it really well. It has enough range for someone who drive 190+ miles round trip to go to work and back. It goes faster, quicker, than any of my ICE powered cars. And it was cost effective, it cost us about the same as an equivalent ICE powered car, while being cheaper to operate.

Clean electricity does exist, wind, solar, and hydro-electric are all around us. Is some electricity not clean, sure. There are still coal powered plants. But currently in this country electricity production makes less pollution than cars and trucks do burning fossil fuels as I understand it. 

While I do like the HD LiveWire, it isn't my style of motorcycle. But I have thought about an electric Dual Sport. That would be a great option where I live. Noise is an issue when Dual Sporting around here, most places to ride aren't exactly 100% legal. So having something quiet would be helpful. My KTM 440 doesn't fit that bill.

I will pretty much keep our Guzzi's, although I have considered selling the Griso cheap to a good home. It needs a new clutch and I have not found the time and / or money to finish that job. It has sat half disassembled in the corner of the garage for too long now. But the other Guzzi's I will keep and ride until I die. But that doesn't mean I would not also own an E bike.

As a side note, we are having solar panels installed soon. A sign of the times. A Luddite like me with an electric car and solar panels, who would have thunk?

[Chuck]

If I were uhhh, even 10 years younger, I'd be putting up solar panels.. but I can read the actuarial tables as well as the next guy..

[80CX100]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5nEboAQNcQ

 

I've got no desire nor the time, to get into circular arguments or a pissing match; but if you're inclined and you have an hour, this interview with Dr Patrick Moore one of the original founding members of Greenpeace is enlightening.

His credibility and scientific background cuts through a ton of eco hysteria crap.

I was just forced to spend a little under $10k to remove a perfectly functioning HW tank & high efficiency furnace and a double walled composite furnace oil tank and haul them off to the dump; logically that somehow doesn't seem good for the environment, but it's a losing proposition when the powers that be, climb onto the eco green wagon.

fwiw ymmv

[Pressureangle]

Let me throw some kindling around the conversation.

1. These are motorcycles. In no universe can either electric or ICE be construed as "Good for the environment". It's an argument of degree and scale, not + or -.
2. ICE and electric are not mutually exclusive. They both exist to serve your leisure. So does your pool, and your pool table, and lawn mower. There is no philosophical difference. 
3. The debate about the origins of the electricity do not encompass any place in the positive end of 'good for the environment'. Only the degree of the negative end. 

That said, I would not trade any one of my ICE bikes for any electric, regardless of the economic stupidity of that statement. But given the right circumstances, I'd absolutely add one to the stable.

[LowRyter]

Chuck, The energy co's knew that greenhouse was a threat before the '70s.  It was a topic in my Biology class in 1970.  

And the same fossil fuel companies did some much investment in "research" in "alternatives" back in the '70s.  Was this for PR or did they lock up a lot of patents?  After the '80s it all changed.

Anyway, whether you like noise or not, the Tesla sedan is faster than about anything on the road,

100-150 mph (240 km/h) - 4.67 seconds. 1/4 mile - 9.25 seconds at 151.99 mph.

.....a housewife with a baby seat running a McLaren, and saying "bye."

[Lucky Phil]

11 hours ago, Chuck said:

Ok, I'll chime in. While I *love* airplane noise, especially a "gaggle" of these boogers roaring around.. Mother Earth is saying we really need to quit burning fossil fuels. Yesterday. The energy companies knew in the 70s that continued use of fossil fuels would upset the earth's natural carbon balance and decided to hire scientists to muddy the "climate change" waters. (Yes, there is proof of that.) It is the same scenario as when GM and the Ethyl corporation hired scientists to say the lead in the air that was causing birth defects, etc. were "normal" and "always" had been there. Finally, climate scientists did bore samples and determined that no, that wasn't true at all. We've cleaned that up. Remember the "ozone holes?" Fixed that.

We have the capability to use renewable energy.. it will take a concerted effort, but we need to do it.

Off the soap box.

I totally agree with all your points and the same for the other posters as well. All great arguments and valid positions. I just don't think it's an "all or nothing" equation and as typically happens the pendulum will hopefully swing back to the null position at some point. So I'm hoping for a future mix of vehicles where electric is used where it's most efficient and the ICE still remains for certain roles and for those that enjoy them. That would be a win all round for the ICE fans and the environmentalists and reduce the consumption of oil so it lasts longer . It won't be a "perfect" solution but maybe good enough until a new and better energy source is found. The down side is that petrol will become bespoke and expensive if the balance goes too much towards electric.

Ciao

[Chris Wilson]

I think that by the time IC engines are outlawed the laws on transport will have changed.

The freedoms we take in travel may not exist and personal forms could become less and less.

Could all be a moot argument.

Chris.

[Chuck]

I have a Tesla on order.. and just this week, Ford is investing 22 billion in electric. It will happen faster than most realize.

[LowRyter]

1 hour ago, Chuck said:

I have a Tesla on order.. and just this week, Ford is investing 22 billion in electric. It will happen faster than most realize.

Details please.  Model, color, equip.

 

Stick or automatic?  

[Chuck]

Model Y dual motor long range. Red. Towing package. Didn't click full self driving on the order form.

[po18guy]

I suspect that we in the west will hobble ourselves via subjection to ideology while the gross polluting nations will continue to run roughshod over us. History will record that we extincted ourselves for the most noble of motives.