OMRON G8HE-1C7T-R-DC12 DC12V or Equivalent (CIT A11CSQ12VDC1.5R?)

[p6x]

Yesterday, October 6th 2021, the starter motor did not crank immediately upon pushing the switch. The Neutral and low oil pressure lights dimmed, so the current was drawn, but the starter only kicked in after about one second.

This morning, the same situation happened, but it blew the 15 amps mains fuse.

The battery is fine.

I changed the fuse, and started the bike. Same issue without blowing the fuse. The starter motor did not crank right at the button push. The light intensity showed the current was drawn but the motor did not turn run away. It took about one second.

Could be a sticky starter motor, or a going bad relay.

Unfortunately, the OMRON G8HE-1C7T-R-DC12 DC12V does not seem to be available from a trusted seller. I found some on Amazon or eBay, but the sellers have warnings from "fakeguard".

Anybody has any available for purchase?

LMK

[paulnaz]

 If this doesn't suit the bill, seller gives the Mopar part# for your local jeep dealer.  https://www.ebay.com/itm/332626544016

    Paul B

[p6x]

@paulnaz however those are "R1" and not "R".

The middle prong of the three prongs side is larger than the one currently installed, made in Portugal. I don't think it would fit in the socket. As you can see in the pictures below. I am looking if I can find an equivalent relay from another brand.

All the other relays have only two prongs.

Fortunately, there was a spare 15 A fuse....

 

[dbarb3]

I believe MG Cycle has relays but not positive if they are the ones you need

[Pressureangle]

1 hour ago, paulnaz said:

 If this doesn't suit the bill, seller gives the Mopar part# for your local jeep dealer.  https://www.ebay.com/itm/332626544016

    Paul B

These are legit, I did the research and bought them myself. Was considering buying another batch to store and toss out all the used spares I have.

[p6x]

I found a company who still has them: OMRON G8HE-1CT7T-R-DC12

Here's the link.

The G8HE- 1CT7T is top of the list.

I bought 10.

[p6x]

1 minute ago, Pressureangle said:

These are legit, I did the research and bought them myself. Was considering buying another batch to store and toss out all the used spares I have.

I found a company that had them in stock, same part, so I purchased them.

https://www.todaycomponents.com/relay/omron-g8he-1c7t-r-dc12-relay.html

 

[p6x]

16 hours ago, docc said:

 

Can you, please, help me understand the difference between "R" and "R1?"

Look at the data sheet from Omron: "R" stands for "Surge Suppressor". It is a built in resistor which is described at the line: coil rating: surge suppressor resistance.1/2 watt 680 ohms.

I bet they updated the surge suppressor specs at some point and it became R1. @Pressureangle confirmed he installed an R1 on his bike with no trouble.

When I did my search (I am not using Google by the way), the OMRON G8HE-1CT7T-R1-DC12 popped all the time. It seems it is easier to find, and may confirm it is a later spec.

And before you ask: This is an SPDT relay type that stands for Single Pole Double Throw. IN the G8HE line there is also another type named SPST for Single Pole Single Throw.

 

[docc]

 I saw you noted the wider and narrower blade sizes. The narrower blades concerned me initially, but I have found that either the narrow or wide blades work equally well in the V11. There are only the two sizes (of blades), and either will fit.

[docc]

@p6x, I see a Tyco in your images. Are  all of your relays the same Tycos? FWIW, those have been the very worst performers in the many options we have tried for the V11 (in my observations).

You will be very happy with your High Current OMRONs!

[p6x]

9 minutes ago, docc said:

 I saw you noted the wider and narrower blade sizes. The narrower blades concerned me initially, but I have found that either the narrow or wide blades work equally well in the V11. There are only the two sizes, and either will fit.

Thanks for confirming. OMRON did specify ISO norms for the socket, as we can expect Moto Guzzi to have followed those rather than SAE.

However, I have not yet confirmed the relay is the culprit.

By the way, I have checked all the 5 relays, and only the 1st one from the left has three prongs. The others only have two. Which identify it as the starter motor relay.

Also, the other relays have different labels, although all of them come from that same company in Portugal. Tyco. Tyco still exists: here's the company's business information: https://www.dnb.com/business-directory/company-profiles.tyco_electronics_-_componentes_electromecânicos_lda.f29e2be2ec2a21e03d9274c17c7f7af1.html

[p6x]

16 minutes ago, docc said:

@p6x, I see a Tyco in your images. Are  all of your relays the same Tycos? FWIW, those have been the very worst performers in the many options we have tried for the V11 (in my observations).

You will be very happy with your High Current OMRONs!

Correct! All the five relays currently installed are made in Portugal from Tyco. The starter motor relay is the only one with that "A403" spec. The others have "A103" or A203".

Incidentally, I got two replies from two different sellers of "R1" OMRON G8HE; they don't know the difference. One stated that OMRON no longer manufactures either.

I purchased 10; I will replace my current 5, and will have 5 spare. We can expect those to eventually go out of stock for good.

We should maybe try to find a replacement that is still being manufactured today. Although the number of V11 Guzzi owners will decrease as we slowly vanish from earth. It appears the future will only be electric....

[docc]

For the sake of clarity, let me suggest that what @p6x calls "two prong" and "three prong" we have commonly referred to as "4-pin" and "5-pin", respectively. Technically, these are specified  "Form A" (4-pin) and "Form C" (5-pin), seen in the part of the number "1C7T." Yes, only V11 position #1/ Start (front) requires the 5-pin (Form C), but these will "rest" in all the other positions as spares.

Thank you, p6x, for clarifying the R vs R1. Agreed that this change is about the suppressor (resistor), and not the connection form or configuration.

With regard to the part of the thread title, "...or Equivalent anyone? "

Indeed, if anyone finds a true, honestly rated High Current equivalent of this "best" OMRON G8HE, please share! Must be rated 20/35 amps (NC/NO) and not rated by cheaters using lesser materials, weaker springs, smaller contact surfaces and all of the other short cuts commonly foisted upon us.  10/20 relays need NOT apply!

[paulnaz]

Quote

4 hours ago, paulnaz said:

 If this doesn't suit the bill, seller gives the Mopar part# for your local jeep dealer.  https://www.ebay.com/itm/332626544016

    Paul B

 

 These are rated at 40 amps and as you point out will fit in all receptacles.

     Paul B

[docc]

27 minutes ago, paulnaz said:

 These are rated at 40 amps and as you point out will fit in all receptacles.

     Paul B

Oh, yes. Another nuance to be aware of that can make the relay look rated "higher."

The 40 amp is the "Inrush Current", NC only.  Look at that Inrush Current rating on the NO side: 120 amps! Run your hair dryer on that, baby! (nope)

Be very careful to go by the  "Continuous Carry Current" or "Rated Load" ratings.  Endeavor to understand where your application is using "NC" (Normally Closed/ weaker side/ lower number) vs "NO" (Normally Open/ stronger side/"pulled in"/ higher number).

https://omronfs.omron.com/en_US/ecb/products/pdf/en-g8he.pdf