Ground truthing '02 Lemans purchase

[footgoose]

also, the head mounted fairing brackets are easily bent. If it was laid down the bracket will be pushing the fairing tail up close to the tank. An easy repair would be to bend it back away from the tank... maybe it was bent to far??? The 'silent block' mount "nuts" are easily worn out and are cheap to replace.

The difference in 'noise' between the two bikes could be the difference in clutch/flywheel assemblies.

[80CX100]

1 hour ago, docc said:

Remember, the V11 ECU richens the start-up mixture the first 6,000 rpm (IIRC) every time it is started. This aspect certainly can drizzle raw fuel out the throttle body shafts. 

Docc,  Does the ignition key have to be turned off for the ECU to reset and send that "richen" signal for the first 6000 rpm, or just back to run then start?

 

           Does it only go through that richen cycle when it's cold, or even if it's hot at running temps?

           tia

[FreyZI]

3 minutes ago, footgoose said:

The difference in 'noise' between the two bikes could be the difference in clutch/flywheel assemblies.

Interesting idea. Incidentally, the Tenni exploding clutch/flywheel problem was resolved by POx1.  Bubbles just sounds a bit clanky.

Seems that switching the brackets L to R resolved the fairing problem.

[docc]

12 hours ago, 80CX100 said:

Docc,  Does the ignition key have to be turned off for the ECU to reset and send that "richen" signal for the first 6000 rpm, or just back to run then start?

 

           Does it only go through that richen cycle when it's cold, or even if it's hot at running temps?

           tia

My understanding is that the ECU reverts to the rich revolutions (is it 6,000?) every time the ignition is switched back on, regardless of temperature. Does this involve the Run/"Kill" Switch as well? IDK, I always use them both to start and stop.

I have a backstory on this, but the technical specificity has been reported to support this ECU function.

[Scud]

44 minutes ago, FreyZI said:

Incidentally, the Tenni exploding clutch/flywheel problem was resolved by POx1.  Bubbles just sounds a bit clanky.

Does Bubbles' clankiness go away when you pull the clutch lever in? If so, you may have yourself a bike with a RAM single-plate clutch and flywheel.

[Lucky Phil]

2 hours ago, docc said:

My understanding is that the ECU reverts to the rich revolutions (is it 6,000 rpm ?) every time the ignition is switched back on, regardless of temperature. Does this involve the Run/"Kill" Switch as well? IDK, I always use them both to start and stop.

I have a backstory on this, but the technical specificity has been reported to support this ECU function.

The ecu reverts to/applies the Start Enrichment trim on every start irrespective of the engine temp or OAT for 3984 engine revolutions, note not RPM. So it tapers off counting down from 3984 to zero revolutions of the engine until it reaches zero enrichment. It's why you cant realistically adjust the CO and hear/measure it's effect for around 3 minutes after starting the engine unless you hold it above idle rpm to reduce the time.

Ciao  

[docc]

Thanks for the clarification, @Lucky Phil! I knew I only had that "close" while stating RPM instead of "revolutions" was nonsensical on my part.

[Lucky Phil]

4 hours ago, docc said:

Thanks for the clarification, @Lucky Phil! I knew I only had that "close" while stating RPM instead of "revolutions" was nonsensical on my part.

Wasn't trying to correct just clarify docc. It's just a bit confusing if you're not aware and revolutions can be mixed up with rpm.

Ciao  

[docc]

3 hours ago, Lucky Phil said:

Wasn't trying to correct just clarify docc. It's just a bit confusing if you're not aware and revolutions can be mixed up with rpm.

Ciao  

Thanks, really. The correction/clarification is appropriate. I was being hasty and erred. I appreciate your clarification!

And also the confirmation on the enrichening function number of revolutions, that it is independent of all parameters besides startup, and that the mixture tapers over the revolutions (I did not know this).

My backstory is that my throttle bodies dripped from the shafts from new. I reported this to my dealer and he replaced the entire Throttle Body/ injector/ TPS rail under warranty. And told me, "If your turn the key on or start it just briefly, you will get that drip still." Of course, the Sport was new to me and I was starting her every time I walked by and for everyone I could get to listen to the song!

Sure enough, if we cycle the key on and off or briefly start the combination of enrichening and pressurizing is likely to drip fuel past the throttle body shafts.

[Scud]

17 minutes ago, docc said:

Sure enough, if we cycle the key on and off or briefly start the combination of enrichening and pressurizing is likely to drip fuel past the throttle body shafts.

That means I have to retract what I said earlier about turning the key on and off several times to look for a leak. In fact, doing that could CAUSE the leak.

[Lucky Phil]

21 minutes ago, docc said:

Thanks, really. The correction/clarification is appropriate. I was being hasty and erred. I appreciate your clarification!

And also the confirmation on the enrichening function number of revolutions, that it is independent of all parameters besides startup, and that the mixture tapers over the revolutions (I did not know this).

My backstory is that my throttle bodies dripped from the shafts from new. I reported this to my dealer and he replaced the entire Throttle Body/ injector/ TPS rail under warranty. And told me, "If your turn the key on or start it just briefly, you will get that drip still." Of course, the Sport was new to me and I was starting her every time I walked by and for everyone I could get to listen to the song!

Sure enough, if we cycle the key on and off or briefly start the combination of enrichening and pressurizing is likely to drip fuel past the throttle body shafts.

Yea, even after you rebuild them with new bushes and seals they do that under the conditions you mention. The fuel just puddles in the inlet tract when cold and without the vacuum it will drip out. The seals also don't seal 100% without a differential pressure across them. That's the disadvantage of the vertical throttle blades. Ducati's dont have this issue with their horizontal blades. 

Can you see what a great idea it was for Guzzi to fit the TPS on the bottom of the L/H throttle body on the California's! What were they thinking.

 

Ciao 

[Lucky Phil]

Just now, Scud said:

That means I have to retract what I said earlier about turning the key on and off several times to look for a leak. In fact, doing that could CAUSE the leak.

I always pull the fuel pump fuse if I'm going to cycle the ignition switch a few times for whatever reason during maintenance work. Nothing to be gained by continually squirting a shot of fuel down the inlets every time you cycle the ignition switch.

Ciao

[FreyZI]

On 3/8/2022 at 10:49 PM, Scud said:

Does Bubbles' clankiness go away when you pull the clutch lever in? If so, you may have yourself a bike with a RAM single-plate clutch and flywheel.

Yes.

[Took Bubbles for another ride today (probably 70 miles).  I'm working through the niggles on this now road-going parts bike.  Last year was aft of the transmission.  This year, working toward the middle.  This week: changed front wheel bearings and tire.  Dramatic difference.]

I'm gaining confidence that nothing is going to explode, but I'm not sure how to feel when at a stop in traffic and this thing is loudly clattering.  Should I be embarrassed?  Should I be amused?    Should I care about the gaze of the other at all?  Is there a point, knowing how these clutches rattle, when I should nonetheless take preventative measures?

[audiomick]

7 hours ago, FreyZI said:

Should I care about the gaze of the other at all? 

No.

They're all just jealous, and don't want to admit it.

[GuzziMoto]

9 hours ago, FreyZI said:

Yes.

[Took Bubbles for another ride today (probably 70 miles).  I'm working through the niggles on this now road-going parts bike.  Last year was aft of the transmission.  This year, working toward the middle.  This week: changed front wheel bearings and tire.  Dramatic difference.]

I'm gaining confidence that nothing is going to explode, but I'm not sure how to feel when at a stop in traffic and this thing is loudly clattering.  Should I be embarrassed?  Should I be amused?    Should I care about the gaze of the other at all?  Is there a point, knowing how these clutches rattle, when I should nonetheless take preventative measures?

I know a number of people who's favorite aspect of their Ducati is all the clattering and mechanical noises they make.

All that noise is just telling you that it is working.

As long as you don't have a single plate clutch, it isn't a sign of impending doom.