Triumph Speed RR versus Ducati Panigale V2?

[p6x]

33 minutes ago, Kane said:

Oooo….. a 911 . Love those cars! Which 911 do you have? 

A 996; all manual, no driving assistance. Red and convertible. This was my compromise before I got the red Le Mans.

[p6x]

1 hour ago, Kane said:

Have you seen the Bayliss edition of the V2?
https://www.ducati.com/us/en/bikes/panigale/panigale-v2-bayliss-1st-championship-20th-anniversary

 

It comes with Ohlins suspension. I don’t believe the standard V2 has the “S” option for Ohlins. I guess Ducati figures that if someone were to pay the extra for Ohlins on a V2 they would just go for V4.

Yes, I did. Substantially more expensive than the basic V2 with appointments which I never put through their paces.

I would be happy to get a used V2 at a decent price. I thought I found one on cycle trader, a 2022 V2 with 839 miles for about 10k, but it was white. So no go. It said it had a salvage title, but on the photos, the bike looked normal.

[Kane]

Your Porsche was a compromise? Ummmm….ok.

$10k for a salvage title is too high. You can find a nice Duc 959 Panigale V2 for around that. One thing to be mindful of: people sell off their Ducatis when they are due for a Desmo valve service or new timing belts, but I don’t think Panigales engines have belts. If the bike is due for a Desmo service (or belts if that applies to the bike you’re considering) factor that into the price of the bike.
 

[p6x]

32 minutes ago, Kane said:

Your Porsche was a compromise? Ummmm….ok.

$10k for a salvage title is too high. You can find a nice Duc 959 Panigale V2 for around that. One thing to be mindful of: people sell off their Ducatis when they are due for a Desmo valve service or new timing belts, but I don’t think Panigales engines have belts. If the bike is due for a Desmo service (or belts if that applies to the bike you’re considering) factor that into the price of the bike.
 

Not a compromise. The model from year 1998 until 2005 was the 996; then 997.

https://www.classic.com/m/porsche/911/996/carrera/cabriolet-manual/

If I am not wrong, the valve service is at 15,000 miles. How much is the service? 1k?

[Kane]

That sounds right for the mileage, like every 15k or 18k. The Desmo service for my old air cooled 2 valve Hypermotard was around $1000 at a dealer. They do more things than just the valves, and they used expensive MOTUL oil, but that’s on a simpler 2 valve motor with not as much stuff to take off to get to the valves. My valves were also still in spec. To save money, a lot of people will do the bulk of the maintenance items themselves and bring the bike in for just the valves.  Check with AMS Ducati, and maybe join the Ducati.ms forum and see if anyone will recommend a good non-dealer Ducati shop in your area as you will probably save some money.

[p6x]

2 hours ago, Kane said:

That sounds right for the mileage, like every 15k or 18k. The Desmo service for my old air cooled 2 valve Hypermotard was around $1000 at a dealer. They do more things than just the valves, and they used expensive MOTUL oil, but that’s on a simpler 2 valve motor with not as much stuff to take off to get to the valves. My valves were also still in spec. To save money, a lot of people will do the bulk of the maintenance items themselves and bring the bike in for just the valves.  Check with AMS Ducati, and maybe join the Ducati.ms forum and see if anyone will recommend a good non-dealer Ducati shop in your area as you will probably save some money.

I am going to check MPH Cycles if they do Ducati.

But when you own a Porsche 911, the going rates to maintain a Ducati will never frighten you.

I recently changed all the carpets, with "Porsche" logo embroiled in red; all made in Germany... 

I am taking the car for an inspection at https://rennsportporscheworks.com/

These guys are the best, they only work on Porsche, and they solved an oil leak than none of the other "generalist" workshop that advertises "expertise" on German exotics could identify. I now only use those "experts" to change oil and do menial tasks.

The guys at Rennsport took 5 minutes to diagnose an oil drip that puzzled two generalists, and 30 minutes to change the rubber boots on the spark plugs. Six boots, total 1k USD with work. But they are located in Sealy Texas. Not next door to me.

So, bring on the Ducati valve adjustment....

 

[p6x]

Spoke with Davey of MPH Cycle yesterday.

I asked him if he would maintain a Panigale V2 if I was to jump the gun for it, and he politely declined.

He said that valve adjustment on a Ducati Desmo is really no picnic, and should be left to those mechanics that do it on a regular basis.

I remember back in 2011, I was at a Motorcycle exhibition and Ducati had an cut out engine exposed, which I took photographs of. It really looks like a beautiful piece of machinery, and the Desmodromic system is part of it.

So, no Ducati V2 then....

 

[Guzzimax]

Totally differently focused bikes

I’ve had 3 big Triumph triples in recent years, including the previous generation 1050 Speed Triple. Loved it, no issues with reliability or build quality with any; the 1050 triple motor was a peach, smooth & torquey with the characteristic triple howl helped by an Arrow titanium system. Great hooligan bike, felt I wanted to ride it everywhere at 100+ mph, just couldn’t gently bimble around on it. Sold it because I was spending more time on the Griso and V11 Sport just riding less aggressively, and in its place I bought a MT01. Whilst I love the look of the new Speed 1200 RR I don’t think I’d now be able to get on with the ergos

[Kane]

Great pics! If you want to understand what is involved, check out L T Snyder’s books on DIY Desmo maintenance. I think he runs the Desmotimes site. Before you give up on the idea perhaps talk to AMS in Dallas. I have heard good things about them. Too bad you’re not looking for an adventure bike: the V4 Multistrada makes 170hp and is a valve spring motor, not a Desmo, and has something like 35,000 miles between valve checks. That’s a lot of trips to the bakery! 

[p6x]

@GuzzimaxWhen the first Triple appeared on the market, I was interested. I always liked the three cylinder bikes. I also liked the "frog eyes".

But I was always moving from one country to the next, with little notice and time in between. I only managed to purchase one bike while in Italy, got transferred to Norway then Nigeria. Had to practically give away my bike since I had just the time it was going to take to get a work permit. Most of the time, I rented bikes during my time off. In Europe, there isn't a large choice of make and models that are available for rental. The triple was not one of them. It seems the Suzuki Bandit was popular, and that's what I ended up with most of the time.

 

[p6x]

@Kane

I am planning to go to Dallas on April 15th, so I may take that opportunity to check out AMS. On the practical side, getting your vehicle maintained far away from where you live presents some challenges.

My 911 is maintained in Sealy Tx, 50 miles from where I live. When you need to leave the car there for a few days it complicates everything.

[PJPR01]

13 minutes ago, p6x said:

@Kane

My 911 is maintained in Sealy Tx, 50 miles from where I live. When you need to leave the car there for a few days it complicates everything.

I realize this is a bit of thread drift, but there are 2 Porsche garages of extremely high quality a lot closer to you, both of which have stellar reputations in the Lone Star Porsche community.  I don't know if you've tried their services in the past...but for convenience, would be a lot easier!

Einar's garage (10 miles) and Modern Air Cooled (5 miles)...

[p6x]

33 minutes ago, PJPR01 said:

I realize this is a bit of thread drift, but there are 2 Porsche garages of extremely high quality a lot closer to you, both of which have stellar reputations in the Lone Star Porsche community.  I don't know if you've tried their services in the past...but for convenience, would be a lot easier!

Einar's garage (10 miles) and Modern Air Cooled (5 miles)...

Thanks!

Since I got the 911, I used the Swiss Garage in West Alabama Street. Last year, I noticed an oil drip, brought the car to them, they kept it several days and told me they could not identify the origin of the problem. This was disappointing. I took it for what it was. MPH Cycle suggested Rennsport in Sealy. The garage is owned by the widow of an all time 911 enthusiast. I went there as a nobody, they put my 911 on the elevator and diagnosed the issue in what... 5 minutes?!

We convened on a day, brought the car early morning and they fix the easy part of the problem on the spot while I had a long conversation with the widow, who told me the owners life story and hers since.

Anyway, thanks for the tip, I will check Einar's and M.A.C.

[LowRyter]

So far as Desmo service as mentioned above, the adjustment interval is 15k miles on the V2 and 18k miles for the 11 Degree engine.  If you're a DIY guy, there is a service that leases a Desmo maintenance kit, you can keep the kit for a few weeks, use that tools, purchase the consumables and get video instructions.  

I'll also share that the Duc branded parts, like timing belts and spark plugs are exorbitant but generic and discount parts are available- so shop around and you may find that a Duc isn't much more difficult than any 4 cyl sportbike to maintain with the same labor hours.  I was told the biggest trick is making sure not drop the valve into the engine when making the adjustment.  And each valve has two shim, closing & opening.  So a Duc twin was the same number of adjustments as 4 cyl conventional bike 

In my case, Don's shop did the 18k service.   Besides being a Guzzi dealer, he used to be the head wrench at the Duc shop here.  Next time, I'll work with him for the service and get some hands-on training,  just another 14k miles to go.

The labor bill was something like $600, which was all the 18k mile maintenance list, including desmo, servicing the forks and additionally replacing the drive chain.

[p6x]

On 3/31/2022 at 9:31 AM, PJPR01 said:

I realize this is a bit of thread drift, but there are 2 Porsche garages of extremely high quality a lot closer to you, both of which have stellar reputations in the Lone Star Porsche community.  I don't know if you've tried their services in the past...but for convenience, would be a lot easier!

Einar's garage (10 miles) and Modern Air Cooled (5 miles)...

I went to Einar's on Friday morning (with the Le Mans).

It is like day and night with Rennsport Sealy. Not judging by the way. Just saying.

Einar's, receptionist, waiting lounge with windows looking out on the immaculate workshop. I got an appointment for Wednesday morning at 09:00 to check the car. The receptionist gave me the tour and a low down on the three technicians that currently work there.

Rennsport: no receptionist, no lounge, workshop full of equipment and flat 6 at various states of maintenance. When I went there, they took my car in immediately to have a look underneath, abandoning what they were doing before. Then told me to schedule an appointment after identifying the leaks' root causes.