Light rattle in gearbox when pushing my bike.

[Walterg]

Rolling the bike in neutral with or without the clutch lever pulled in makes no sound at all.

Rotating with and without the gearbox cover makes no sounds. Just the normal silent sound of rotating gears.

@Pete and Pressureangle: Just to be clear: With drive shaft you mean the shaft with the universal joints that goes from the gearbox to the rear wheel?
I'm asking because I don't see any pegs. Just two bolts per universal joint.

I just made a simple clutch plate allignment tool so will continue with the disassembly.

 

[Walterg]

I removed the clutch assembly and everything looks fine to me. The blue colouring of the plates is the reflection of the wonderfull blue sky we have at the moment.
The first repair task that I came across so far is replacing the leaking crankshaft seal.

Here are some pictures of the clutch parts.
Clutch parts I
Clutch parts II
Leaking seal

And my workplace here

[Scud]

A leaking breather hose may be your oil problem. It's possible that the rear seal is OK. Notice how the oil seems to com in from above, and find its way down past the seal. 

Have you measured the clutch parts? It's hard to tell for sure from the angle of your pictures, but they seem a bit worn.

If you replace some of the internals, consider replacing the springs as well, I found that alternating stiffer springs with the original springs gave the best feel. And while we're talking about springs - your picture shows 9. There should be 10. Did you remove 10 springs during disassembly?

[Lucky Phil]

8 hours ago, Scud said:

A leaking breather hose may be your oil problem. It's possible that the rear seal is OK. Notice how the oil seems to com in from above, and find its way down past the seal. 

Have you measured the clutch parts? It's hard to tell for sure from the angle of your pictures, but they seem a bit worn.

If you replace some of the internals, consider replacing the springs as well, I found that alternating stiffer springs with the original springs gave the best feel. And while we're talking about springs - your picture shows 9. There should be 10. Did you remove 10 springs during disassembly?

This.

Phil

[docc]

This is a beautiful thing and shows great determination:

Know the eight places a V11 can leak oil into that "clutch" space!

 

[docc]

With regard to the "rattle", @Lucky Phil had mentioned my input hub retention failure. I am not sure this could cause your noise, but the retention "nut" and "safety washer" should always be inspected when the gearbox is on the shop floor . . .

This image shows the retention "nut" having loosened almost off the threads allowing the input hub to spin, and rattle, and rock, and roll . . .

And here, fully fastened:

 

[Pressureangle]

12 hours ago, Walterg said:

Rolling the bike in neutral with or without the clutch lever pulled in makes no sound at all.

Rotating with and without the gearbox cover makes no sounds. Just the normal silent sound of rotating gears.

@Pete and Pressureangle: Just to be clear: With drive shaft you mean the shaft with the universal joints that goes from the gearbox to the rear wheel?
I'm asking because I don't see any pegs. Just two bolts per universal joint.

I just made a simple clutch plate allignment tool so will continue with the disassembly.

 

Yes that's what I meant, but you're well past that. Despite the 'maintenance' items in your bellhousing, I'm behind Pete's simple suggestion that your shaft retaining nut(s) is not tight, allowing misalignment in the gearbox. Unless you've missed a broken tooth on a gear, it's just about the only possibility remaining.

[docc]

7 minutes ago, Pressureangle said:

Yes that's what I meant, but you're well past that. Despite the 'maintenance' items in your bellhousing, I'm behind Pete's simple suggestion that your shaft retaining nut(s) is not tight, allowing misalignment in the gearbox. Unless you've missed a broken tooth on a gear, it's just about the only possibility remaining.

Just to clarify, you are referring to the internal gearbox shafts that carry the various gears inside the gearbox?

(To differentiate from the external "driveshaft" that carries the motive power from the gearbox to the final/bevel drive at the wheel hub.)

[footgoose]

On 7/10/2022 at 2:41 PM, Walterg said:

In first gear the rattle is the loudest and has the highest frequenty (RPM). Going up the gears seems to make the rattle a bit quieter per gear.

the rattle in my head  is asking.. what turns faster in first gear besides the affected gears and the clutch? With the rattle heard through the gears but inconsistent with gear change/rpm, doesn't it have to be coming from the clutch?

[pete roper]

15 hours ago, docc said:

Just to clarify, you are referring to the internal gearbox shafts that carry the various gears inside the gearbox?

(To differentiate from the external "driveshaft" that carries the motive power from the gearbox to the final/bevel drive at the wheel hub.)

Yeah. These ones.

[Walterg]

Thanks for all the great reactions. With your help I'm sure I will get everything sorted.

At first I thought that the oil that was leaking through the seal was swung upwards to the left by the rotation of clutch.
Then I thought that one or two of those bolts were leaking but they seem to be torqued down ok.
I did not arrive at the idea that the vent could be leaking. I will check that tonight.

The thickness of the plates looks ok but after 85K kilometers they are a little thin indeed. I intent to replace them together with the 10 springs.
Good observation about the 10th spring Scud. It rolled away just before I took the picture.

The input hub retention nut looks ok to me. It also did not feel lose when I tried to hold it with my hand while rotating the drive shaft with a gear selected but I will definitely double-check it.

I still need to check the gears and nuts that are behind the rear gearbox cover. One of the cover bolts broke off while trying to get it off so I decided to focus on the clutch first.

 

 

[Pressureangle]

13 hours ago, docc said:

Just to clarify, you are referring to the internal gearbox shafts that carry the various gears inside the gearbox?

(To differentiate from the external "driveshaft" that carries the motive power from the gearbox to the final/bevel drive at the wheel hub.)

Yes, the clutch input spline nut, and the output shaft nut accessible after removing the driveshaft. I'm not at all familiar with the 6-speed to know exactly what's there.

[docc]

@Walterg,

On the matter of the oil leaks, do take time to investigate the eight leak sources while they are accessible. The two bolts at the bottom can be torqued and still leak past their thread sealant which should be renewed.

Preferably with something not olive oil based like the factory sealant . . .

[Pressureangle]

10 hours ago, pete roper said:

Yeah. These ones.

Oh man there's a lot going on in there I didn't know about. 
I think that pretty much says everything.

[pete roper]

Once the peg nuts loosen and eventually flog their threads out it unloads the shafts and therefore the gear positions. The forks keep the dogs pretty much where they should be so the gear dogs can try and engage gears not meant to be engaged. It can get very, very nasty if you get a double engagement....