Guest Fonzarelli Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Alright, I am usually my own worst enemy at self-inducing problems. Please keep in mind that my Guzzi is kept very clean, not Al R clean, but very clean. I notice tonight while detailing the exhaust that some type of light oil spatter is on my crossover (under tranny crossover). Upon further investigation, I discover traces of light blue oil that appears to be comming from the vent in the bell housing. The Redline Light Shockproof Gear Oil is a light blue in color. My Guzzi has 1968 miles on the clock. I changed to Redline Shockproof at 1000 miles. When I changed the trans oil, I added exactly 850ml to the box after a thorough draining. Could this be a leaking input shaft seal? I'm assuming that it is. Is this caused by an overfilled gearbox? Well, I did add the specified amount. Is this caused by the fact that I switched to a thinner, synthetic oil? I don't know. Will the leak dissapear by either- 1. changing the oil level. 2. switching back to conventional gear lube 3. replacing the input shaft seal 4. selling the bike Anyhow, I plan on stopping by my dealer in the morning to get the wrenches advice. I did have a discussion with him a few weeks ago regarding Redline in the tranny. He asked me if it had leaked yet. I said, 'no'. He said I would probably be OK. I'm hoping I will not have to take her in for warranty; the weathers getting real nice... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
callison Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 The vent is much higher than the input or output seal, if you see fluid that high up, why would you assume it's the seal? Plus, the input seal is at the clutch end of the transmission, so you would never see a leak from there at the rear. You might have: A bit of blow out the vent. A loose clutch actuator so lubricant is seeping past (and the Redline is VERY slippery). A cracked transmission case (I did, nearly the same spot). A porous transmission case. Something else weirdly Guzzi in nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Fonzarelli Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 The vent I'm referring to is on the bottom, between the engine case and the gearbox. It's a very small rectangular port that is open to the trans side. This is where the Redline is comming from. There is also reminants of the 'blue' gear oil on the back of the oil pan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldini Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 small rectangular port...is where the Redline is comming from If you got trans fluid leaking out there seal on input to box could be leaking. It's not engine oil? Have you looked inside bell housing thru timing inspection hole on right (rubber plug)? Any oil in there? It would probably weep out that hole too if seal had blown. Clutch slip? just a little superslippysynth oil getting past seal that would be ok with thicker stuff??? KB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Fonzarelli Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 No, it's not engine oil. It's blue, as in Redline Shockproof Lightweight. I have looked throught the inspection hole, the flywheel appears to be dry. The clutch does not slip. The blue gear oil is definintely comming from the inputshaft seal. Question is: Did this start with the use of the thinner synthetic gear oil? I'm starting to suspect... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldini Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 I have looked throught the inspection hole, the flywheel appears to be dry. Oil gets flung onto inside of bell housing - check there for oil film. If there's a big leak it will appear outside around timing inspection hole. Doesn't sound like much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
callison Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Sorry. Every time someone mentions vent, I think of the vent at the back of the transmission case. The thing at the bottom of the clutch housing is probably more of a drain semantically speaking. Be glad it's only the seal although getting at it is a tremendous pain in the ass. FWIW, on the 2002's, which is not what you have, the factory painted the cases - including the holes and bores where there were seals and case bolts etc. The painted surface let oil past where there where bolts, and provided an inferior surface for the seals to work with, so there were a lot of 2002's that had various leaking spots. Possibly, because things don't all change at the same time on the production line, you got a case with a painted bore and the seal has unseated as a result. Equally probable, is the possibility that the seal is simply not seated correctly or that the seal itself has taken exception to the use of the super slippery lubricant and has started to leak. I don't think the seal materials themselves react to the lubricant, but the fit of the seal may be the compromised to the point where the super lubricity of the Redline allows it to seep past. Unfortunately, oil in the clutch housing will eventually contaminate the plates. Engine oil you can somewhat rinse off, but I'm not certain about the Redline. In the USA, the clutch plates will set you back more than $200 for the pair, so I would suggest biting the bullet and having the transmission yanked before the plates can get contaminated. Hopefully, you're under warranty, the dealer is good and will honor the warranty and that MGNA will also honor the warranty. That's like hoping for a home run when the bases are loaded, the pitcher can throw a 110 mph curve ball and the batter is blind in one eye with a bad arm and a gimp leg, but that's how it goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Fonzarelli Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Here's an update: This morning I visited my friendly and helpful MG dealer and spoke with the two wrenches. They informed me that the seepage is comming from the front input shaft seal and that some bikes leak and some don't. A pretty basic answer, but they both said to try a standard gear lube, chances are it will no longer weep. They also mentioned that it took a fair amount of oil to contaminate the clutch and that I would probably be fine. One of their answers was that the tolerances on the Guzzi engines and trans are not as 'high tech' as the modern synthetics. Apparently it's not just Guzzi's as they are also a Triumph dealer. So, I removed the inspection plug on the right side of the case and liberally sprayed brake cleaner inside the walls of the bellhousing to hopfully remove any excess Redline. I then blew out the area with compressed air to aid the drying process. The Redline shockproof was drained. I then added 850ml of regular 80W120 gear oil that was purchased from my dealer. With everything cleaned-up, we will see if any weepage occurs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_roethlisberger Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 I hope the switch back fixes your problem I know you mentioned that you were careful not to overfill the transmission when you switched to the Redline, but just to stress this point.... it has been suggested by more than a couple old-skool MG wrenches that many of our various transmission leaks are due to the tranny being a bit sensitive to being overfilled So, just something to be aware of as well. al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Fonzarelli Posted May 8, 2004 Share Posted May 8, 2004 I hope the switch back fixes your problem I know you mentioned that you were careful not to overfill the transmission when you switched to the Redline, but just to stress this point.... it has been suggested by more than a couple old-skool MG wrenches that many of our various transmission leaks are due to the tranny being a bit sensitive to being overfilled So, just something to be aware of as well. al It was also interesting that the two Guzzi wrenches said that there are different therories as to where the lube should be in the sight glass. Some say just at the bottom of the sight glass, others say to fill it 850ml. For a motorcycle that has been around so long, you would think that the maintenance details would be well sorted. Thanks for everyones input! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TX REDNECK (R.I.P.) Posted May 8, 2004 Share Posted May 8, 2004 Bike vertical, halfway across the sight glass, never had a problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_roethlisberger Posted May 8, 2004 Share Posted May 8, 2004 Bike vertical, halfway across the sight glass, never had a problem Indeed, aery important point when checking all the fluids, not on the side-stand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest geezerx Posted May 9, 2004 Share Posted May 9, 2004 Fonz, if the tranny input shaft is leaking, get it fixed asap. I didn't. I ran the bike and eventually the clutch started slipping. An ignored $20 dollar seal eventually cost me the seal, clutch plates, pressure plate, intermediate plate, and had to have the fly wheel turned slightly to remove scorching. Out of warranty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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