Fuel Injection, stream or spray?

[PJPR01]

How long does it run after you spray starter fluid?  You can take it for a drive and it will not die?

If it will run forever and idle (with a fan blowing on it to not overheat the bike sitting and idling for 10-15 minutes), then you're getting spark, fuel delivered, so you're saying the problem is only in the ignition phase, i.e. getting it started.  I assume you haven't hooked up Guzzidiag yet to it to see if there are any other faults being thrown?

That has to mean that injectors are working, plugs/wires are working since you're burning off the starter fluid almost instantaneously, if idling decently, TPS is OK enough to let it run etc.  The "choke" isn't really a choke per se...but you've figured that out now.

Bugger...what else could contribute to the lack of starting?   I take it the process for trying to start with starter fluid vs. standard process involves the same parameters, side stand up or down, clutch lever in or out...all the same?  

[MartyNZ]

5 hours ago, LaGrasta said:

 

I see that your pump is on top of the spine. Mine is actually underneath, but I imagine that there's no functional difference.

There is also a lot of hoses shown in the picture. As I understand it, the outlet from the pump goes to the filter, then injector, then other injector, then regulator return to tank. There's no other fuel pressure hoses needed.

[Tomchri]

What a clean bike, but waiting for PJPR01's question, can you ride it ?  Did you say no sign of fuel inside the trottle house ? Ign on = 1 spray, finger inside trottlehouse, shoud be a little wet ? You will get there.

Cheers Tom.

[LaGrasta]

The fact each of you are from very different and far away places is fantastic! Thank you! @PJPR01 @MartyNZ @Tomchri  I appreciate your suggestions, but you misunderstand.

It fires on starter fluid, and will run only as long as it is being sprayed. At no time does it continue to run after the fluid stops being sprayed.

Thus, it's a fuel problem. This weekend I plan to crank it with the injectors removed, but hooked-up. I hope to see fuel being squirt from each. Then, I will pull each plug to confirm spark. This will help confirm a few details.

[PJPR01]

Aha...that makes it crystal clear then!!  Sounds like you have spark...no problem.

Just out of curiosity...is the fuel injector model for the V11 the same as it is for your V7 (single TB, not double right??)  If so, you could do an easy swap of one, then the other from the V11 into your V7 and see if it runs or both if your V7 has a double TB setup.

Considering how reasonable non OEM injectors are on Ebay, and I know others here will not support buying non OEM injectors...but it's worth a shot.  For what it's worth, I bought non OEM injectors for my Norge several years ago, and they work perfectly...no issues at all.

[LaGrasta]

The seat spring and choke spring do not interchange, completely different sizes, will not fit vice versa.

[LaGrasta]

I still don't have this thing running, gonna reach out to a friend for his expertise. It has to be something simple as everything looks correct. 

This past weekend, I confirmed injectors are being signaled and spark plugs are  firing. The injectors are getting fuel, and they are clean and squirting proper.

The choke hardly moves anything, regardless if I adjust it, there is very little mechanical movement on the throttle cam. Am I correct n thinking the choke, merely gives more fuel when engaged?

[docc]

1 hour ago, LaGrasta said:

I still don't have this thing running, gonna reach out to a friend for his expertise. It has to be something simple as everything looks correct. 

This past weekend, I confirmed injectors are being signaled and spark plugs are  firing. The injectors are getting fuel, and they are clean and squirting proper.

The choke hardly moves anything, regardless if I adjust it, there is very little mechanical movement on the throttle cam. Am I correct n thinking the choke, merely gives more fuel when engaged?

Actually, the "high idle lever" simply nudges the throttle slightly open. The start-up enrichening is handled by the ECU on every start-up regardless of ambient or engine temperatures.

[LaGrasta]

docc, thanks for confirming, what I suspected.

[PJPR01]

Sorry if this was mentioned earlier, but how old is the gas in the tank?   Did you try draining it completely, and then put in fresh gas (non ethanol even better if possible).  Given that the starter fluid works, but the gas doesn't leads me to believe this gas is not igniting...maybe full of water?

Any chance the fuel filter is blocked somehow, the tube is clean and has been inspected?

[HRC_V4]

Just to confirm, you have;

*Spark 

*Signal to injectors

*Fuel to injectors

*Fuel flow through the injectors

The only thing left is timing and air, starting fluid should over come any bad programming on the cold start enrichment, that is a head scratcher.

 

 

 

[PJPR01]

By the way, if it hasn't already been done, cleaning out the fuel downspout is a necessity, with the bike sitting for 10 years, it's likely to have accumulated a lot of sediment or rust in the fine mesh filter...but again, not sure if you have already done that part already?

[MartyNZ]

I suggest a quick troubleshooting test: take the fuel hose off the pressure regulator, point the hose into a tin, and turn on the ignition. You should hear the pump run for a few seconds, and you should see a few ccs of fuel run into the tin.

If not, find out why not. 

[LaGrasta]

I so very much appreciate all of your suggestions, and general interest.

The bike was stored in a cool SoCal garage/man-cave since it was purchased by the PO. After he added about 1000 miles to the 9000 that was already on the bike, he let it sit for over 10 years. I bought it, and went through it. I removed everything and ensured all was proper. Overall, it was impressively clean. Just the same, injectors, filters, hoses, plugs, etc were replaced or treated as needed. Tank, petcock, regulator was taken part and cleaned.

It has good fuel and spark and I expect good timing as it was not touched by me. One note, I've kept the timing cover off while I've been trying to start it because I plan to adjust valves once it starts. That shouldn't cause it to not start, correct?

It does light and run on starting fluid. I plan to attached my 10amp batter charger and crank it, crank it, crank it while a friend helps play with the throttle and clutch. Maybe it just needs more cranking time. I've not stayed on it too long when trying.

[docc]

Why not do as much of the "Decent Tune-up" as possible at the outset?

> adjust valves, baseline the TPS with a quality voltmeter, and check the CO Fuel Trim with guzzidiag.