Spring is sprung

[al_roethlisberger]

And more info here:

 

Forum Trans Spring FAQ - With Photos

 

al

[Guest Marcel]

Ok. Thanks for the explanation and taking away my worries about my gearbox. And indeed, the Rosso Mandello is a '01 model, although I've got one from the second batch (i.e. without a Limited Edition number).

 

So I thought there were two springs but there are two sizes spring bosses. I got lost somewhere

[andy york]

It seems this issue has been dead for awhile and I hesitate to piss off the Guzzi gods but here goes.

My rachet spring broke at 24,000 miles . I did the quick fix ,pulled the side covr off and slapped a new spring in and was on my way.

Now I have pulled the tranny to fix the weeping of fluid. I found the top 6mm bolt on the intermediate plate as I call it, loose. I think there are 4 6mm and 4 or 5 5mm bolts here.

Anyway, I have decided to have everything in the gearbox coated with a friction reducing coating.As I pulled all the gears and syncros(flexible coupling for the Italians out there )apart, I dicovered 5 broken needle bearing cages. I can't pin point what happened here, I'm still working on that.

Shift Springs.I have three rachet arms and two springs.

Spring # 92295702 has a 16.93mm hole in the center.

Spring #04238300 has a 19mm hole in the center.

Rachet arm #04235101 has a 15.03mm boss for the spring.

Rachet arm #012351300 has a 16.25mm boss for the spring.

I can not locate where I got the smaller spring from...its not in the parts cat. now but I got the # somewhere .

so it apperars that there are 2 springs and 2 rachet arms.The smaller of the springs is a round wire spring. the larger of the 2 has a bit of a flat surface on 2 sides and is rounded on the other 2.

The space under the button head as I call it , where the long arm of the spring rests varies a little also.The 15mm rachet 2.4mm of clearance whereas the 16.25mm rachet has 2.15mm of clearance. Now .2mm isn't much but it is there.

I don't recall all the details of everyone springs failure but I had the larger spring on the larger rachet boss and made it 24-25000 miles. At 31000m my replacement spring still looks good so I don't know what to do right now.

I took pics so I will email to Jaap and maybe he can post them.

Actually this solves nothing

 

later andy

[Baldini]

Andy,

 

Ratchet arm is listed as 04 23 51 01 (as you give for arm w/15mm boss). My understanding is that this is the correct arm/boss.

 

Spring is listed as 04 23 83 00 (as you give for 19mm ID spring). All springs I have seen have been around 16.9mm ID.

 

Where do you get those other part#'s from?

 

Is the 19mm ID spring the replacement, or is it the broken original (in which case the ID would have opened up)? If you had 19mm ID spring on 16.25mm boss, it would give similar clearance to correct (?) 16.9mm spring on 15mm boss so binding would not have been an issue. My breakages were small springs on large boss (as I thought was the case for others), caused (I hope) by spring becoming coilbound in use.

 

KB

[TX REDNECK (R.I.P.)]

[andy york]

The part #'s came direct from the parts cat., although I can't seem to find the # for the smaller ID spring. So......?

For simpler terms ...I put big spring on big rachet =no coil bind

Little spring on little rachet = no coil bind

Big spring on little rachet = no coil bind

Little spring on big rachet = major coil bind

 

I'm off to search part #s again

 

andy

[Baldini]

The part #'s came direct from the parts cat...

 

You have a parts book that lists 2 different spec springs & 2 different spec ratchet arms with part #'s??????????

 

KB

[big J]

Great article,getting the dealer to check mine before I pick mine up[ hopefully next week........hopefully..]. Be returning from Scotland via Belfast, around 200 miles trip,maybe Icould get you to hold onto one of those springs if you dont need it anymore,by the sound of things Imight need it before I get to Drogheda! . Not that Idont trust dealers or anything......

[andy york]

hopefully this is a picture of the springs and rachet arms

 

andy

[Guzzirider]

Just received a new replacement ratchet arm (part no 04 23 51 01) in the post this morning to help with the repair of Helen's broken spring and guess what? The boss is actually bigger than the original and is well over 16mm. I ordered the new part because the boss on the original was 16mm and after reading the very helpful FAQs on this subject I wanted to fit the updated part and was expecting to get one with a 15mm boss.

 

In the interests of getting a fast repair done, I am getting both bosses (the new and the original) machined down to 15mm tomorrow, meaning I will have a spare in case my Rosso does the same.

 

But it seems that you are not guaranteed to get a ratchet arm with a 15mm boss if you order a new one.

 

Guy

 

P.S. Big thanks to Mal who is helping me with this job!!!

[belfastguzzi]

boss is actually bigger

55169[/snapback]

:!: etc

 

Did it come as a 'repair kit' with a new spring?

Seems like it didn't, but if it did, what size is the new spring coil?

I think you're doing the right thing, reducing the boss size, anyway.

[Guzzirider]

:!:   etc

 

Did it come as a 'repair kit' with a new spring?

Seems like it didn't, but if it did, what size is the new spring coil?

I think you're doing the right thing, reducing the boss size, anyway.

55182[/snapback]

 

I got the spring from Mal who had a spare (I have ordered 2 more, one to replace his and another as a spare).

 

Ordered the ratchet arm from Motomecca yesterday and it arrived today- I wonder whether it was old stock on the shelf- not going to worry about it too much as the factory are now out of stock of this part (Jason at Moto Strada checked on his computer) and I need to get the bike back on the road.

 

Have not measured the spring yet- will do so tomorrow- but its the same size as the old one I reckon.

 

Off to the local motocycle engineers tomorrow to get the ratchet arms machined down- they are beardy Harley types so I wil have to walk "bad" and stick my gut out when I go in.

 

Out of interest, has anyone who has replaced the ratchet arm for one with a 15mm boss had another failure yet?

 

Guy

[belfastguzzi]

Out of interest, has anyone who has replaced the ratchet arm for one with a 15mm boss had another failure yet?

 

55184[/snapback]

 

Back in the old days, when this topic was raging, there were reports of some multiple spring failures. Maybe because there was still a mismatch in sizes of boss and spring coil (can't remember).

 

Mine worked fine with old spring and filed-down boss and then since replacing with a new arm of correct size it has done many more miles than had been covered at the time when spring first broke.

[slug]

Synchronicity, I tell ya...

 

The topic gets resurrected today, and what happens? The f*****g spring on my '03 sport finally breaks on me tonight. Oh well, after 9500 miles I can't complain too much. I'll tear in to it tomorrow (and pray tonight that MI has some in stock...). It was pretty dark outside when it happened, so it looks like I have to remove the starter, disconnect the shift lever, pull a doodad or two and get the rear shock thingus moved to pull the plate off to access the spring?

 

Thanks to all for all the info and pics on this, erm, joy of ownership...

 

-Slug

[belfastguzzi]

so it looks like I have to remove the starter, disconnect ...., pull a doodad or two and get the rear shock thingus moved to pull the plate off to access the spring?

55207[/snapback]

 

no, not so much removing and pulling