Loss of oil pressure

[Jake]

Hi guys, anyone experienced this problem before?

bike (2002/3 V11 Sport) was running strong until the oil light came on, I also have an analog gauge installed that shows me the pressure, this was also now at zero. Upon revving the engine up to about 4k the needle on the gauge would lift slightly and the oil light would go out. Otherwise needle at zero and red oil light on. Any ideas? Oil pump kaput maybe? I had a similar problem before when changing the oil filter, the rubber ring from the old filter was still stuck in the crankcase when I fitted the new filter, but when I found & removed it, all good, so it’s not that I guess… any input would be appreciated, thanks!

Jake 

[MartyNZ]

Has the oil filter partly unwound?

[Jake]

Pretty sure I put a jubilee clip on it but I’ll definitely check… I know I put one on the LM 4 oil filter anyway 😂

[Weegie]

There are a few likely culprits, first off I wouldn't conduct any experiments that involved running the engine

Was the bike likely to have been overheating?

Its improbable, but if the bike got super hot then you could loose pressure, but I've never seen that on a 2v/v engine. I'm assuming there's oil in the engine

As @MartyNZ said most likely culprit is the oil filter. Drop the pan and check, if that's not it the relief valve is in there too and check the gaskets

Sounds like the filter to me, leaking and dropping the pressure when the engine is above 2k rpm pressure really starts to build up to 3k rpm when the engine's developing more or less full pressure (but you probably know that as you've a gauge), I reckon that's why you seen the small rise when you rev'd it.

I think a gauge is a good idea, but I've encountered a lot of stiff competition on that philosophy, if you didn't have one you'd now be dicking around with oil pressure warning switch.

Good Luck, be interested to know what you find.

[Jake]

Unfortunately the bike WAS running for a while before I noticed the light coming on at low revs / idle, and then saw the gauge. Bike sounded fine but I stopped as soon as I could, hope I haven’t done any permanent damage… I also noticed that it would stay around 2k at idle for about 20 seconds before dropping to its normal 1200 at idle, so yes, overheating but I would assume this was connected to very low oil pressure. No leaks, and yes it has oil 😂 also have a Roper plate installed, but can’t see how that would affect anything - as I said bike was running great until this…

[Weegie]

Sorry for the oil level comment, but just checking there was plenty in it

I don't own a V11, basing my experience on my Sporti, but that's exactly the sort of behaviour I see when the bike is overheating, which could be a cause or a symptom of the low pressure I guess.

If you were at speed and with not much traffic on the open road, almost certainly a symptom but if stuck in town and crawling along in traffic it might be, at least, a partial cause.

If you don't want to drain the oil and drop the sump immediately, although I'd recommend you do.

You could remove the plugs to allow the starter to spin faster and reduce load on the big ends.

Ensure battery is fully charged then crank it over on the starter, it should develop pressure almost immediately although it won't rise as high as with the engine running, it should be well over 20psi, seem to recall on the Sport it will easily rise to 40 plus.

Keep the plugs in the HT leads and ground them, preferably away from the plug hole.

Spin it for a 5-10 seconds max, providing you haven't drained off the oil then that should be more than enough time to see if it's developing pressure.

What viscosity oil are you using and what pressures do you normally see? I run the Sport on 15W/50 and oil pressure at 3k rpm and above is a solid 60psi (usually a bit above when cold), at idle when hot it's around 15-20 psi

As far as the Roper Plate it should have no impact, unless you got this issue just after the install, then it might be.

This isn't typical of values you'll see but, here is a HiCam engine being spun over after an oil change (with oil filter pre-filled) just to give an indication of how quick pressure develops, your values will be a lot lower.

 

[MartyNZ]

@Scud had low oil pressure in a V11. I think he found a broken out bit of gasket where the oil module meets the block. With a Roper plate, you have 2 gaskets to check.

https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/topic/22545-low-pressure-oil-light-on-at-idle/page/2/#elControls_259408_menu

 

[gstallons]

What work has been performed prior to this event? You mentioned a jubilee clip (hose clamp) I suppose installed to the oil filter. If you can , drop the pan and start looking for the problem .  

A oil pump is unlikely to be the problem , Inspect everything as you disassemble the engine. 

[Scud]

3 hours ago, MartyNZ said:

@Scud had low oil pressure in a V11. I think he found a broken out bit of gasket where the oil module meets the block. With a Roper plate, you have 2 gaskets to check.

 

True, here is the topic I created for it.  

 

@Jake it sounds like the problem appeared somewhat suddenly after a reasonable period of normal operation. To me, this suggests that you either have a big gap somewhere, or a failed pump. My bet would be on the gap. First suspect would be the oil filter - but for it to drop to zero, whatever is going on there should be totally obvious. The problem I has was a bit of gasket missing - that reduced the pressure, but did not drop it to zero. It would have to be a mighty-big bit of missing gasket to drop the pressure to zero. 

[Jake]

Thanks for all the input guys,
I’m running fully synth 20W50.

I did have a similar problem when installing the last filter and it was because the rubber ring from the previous filter was still stuck up there - but once that was found & removed it was all good. I was having trouble with the bike overheating and stalling, but after pulling all the injector feeds apart I found what looked like Bakelite (!?) partially clogging the left injector banjo… the right head was noticeably hotter than the left. But after I cleared it out it’s been fine, until I suddenly lost oil pressure half way home from work… I’m going to drain the oil and drop the sump tonight - I’ll let you know what I find… 

[Jake]

I think I may have found the problem… 

[Jake]

The other half of the seal dropped out of the case about a minute after I removed the filter. I’ve a new filter on hand so I’ll chuck that in and hopefully that’s that… 

[80CX100]

1 hour ago, Jake said:

I think I may have found the problem… 

That's nasty looking. You're very lucky that didn't happen unnoticed on a long ride.

What type of filter is it?

I've never experienced problems with them myself(Other than whole gaskets coming off and being left behind out of sight)

but I've read lots of negative comments on UFIs fwiw

[MartyNZ]

Did you lubricate the seal with new oil before you fitted the new filter? It lets you tighten the filter without tearing the seal.

[Jake]

Yeah I always smear a bit of oil on the ring as I install it. The filter was Mahle… not sure how or why the ring would split like that in situ but there you go 🤷