Is there a condensed thread about Startus Interruptus...?

[radguzzi]

Hey,
A friend dropped his 2002 V11 LeMans off here asking if I would track down the reason for the intermittent starting, actually, not starting. 

I had seen posts about the subject on other forums some time ago regarding the Norge and possibly others.   A search has a myriad of different threads but some of that is hard to follow and use for diagnosis of this Guzzi.

The symptoms are an on and off starting situation.  It will start, shut it down and it will not start immediately afterward.  Just odd.

Battery is good, holds charge and shows 12.65 at rest, load test indicates good.  I will check the grounds, starter positive cable connections, what else...?  

Are starter switches notorious for failure...?  Ignition switches...? 

Appreciate any assistance here.

Thanks,

rad__

 

 

[audiomick]

Have a look here. Mine (also a 2002/2003 Le Mans) doesn't always start on the first push of the button. There's a click, the dashboard lights dim, and that's all. After a few attempts, it will start.

Some good tips came up in the thread:

https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/topic/28565-starter-button/

 

To help in solving your problem, what exactly happens when you press the starter button and it wont start? Nothing at all, there is a click and the lights dim but the start motor doesn't turn? When you turn on the ignition, do you hear the fuel pump kick in?

[radguzzi]

1 hour ago, audiomick said:

Have a look here. Mine (also a 2002/2003 Le Mans) doesn't always start on the first push of the button. There's a click, the dashboard lights dim, and that's all. After a few attempts, it will start.

Some good tips came up in the thread:

https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/topic/28565-starter-button/

 

To help in solving your problem, what exactly happens when you press the starter button and it wont start? Nothing at all, there is a click and the lights dim but the start motor doesn't turn? When you turn on the ignition, do you hear the fuel pump kick in?

 

I'll take a look at that topic and go pay close attention to what all goes on when the key is turned.  I do always hear the fuel pump, when the starter does not engage I do hear the clicking of a relay, I will check on whether the lights dim or not. 

Thanks, back soon,

rad

 

[docc]

"Startus Interuptus " afflicts V11 after the early (1999-2001) and involve the Ignition Switch over the relays.

Like so many afflictions, these matters are often "multi-causal" . . .  (requiring "some owner involvement" . . .  )

[LowRyter]

I'm thinking it's that flukey kill switch.   (designed by George Jetson)

[gstallons]

Whew , there would have to be a flowchart built to be able to diagnose this "no-start" condition.

 There are so many problems [when  it is a no-start] w/this bike it would take some time to do. For now you just have to be on top of things when experiencing a no-start . A test light , a wiring diagram and deduction .

[gstallons]

For now , you start at the end . The starter solenoid wire , or the beginning. The ign. switch. If you want to call it the beginning .

[radguzzi]

So in typical fashion, the V11 will not exhibit any non-starting issues this AM.   Dash and gauge lights are on and fuel pump, friggin' thing fires right up, repeatedly.  Tried it four times...! 

I'll still go check and clean all contacts before doing any major dismantling. 

Oh, I did not check for a side stand cutout switch but I will, assume there is one, many other Guzzis do.  Are these troublesome on the V1s also...? 

@audiomick,

Did you find any issues with the bullet connectors under the tank...?  

I sent a note to MPH asking about availability of the Startus Interruptus fix kit and no replay yet,  I'll give a call later today. 

Thanks all,

rad__

 

 

 

[audiomick]

1 hour ago, radguzzi said:

@audiomick,

Did you find any issues with the bullet connectors under the tank...? 

I haven't had a chance to have a look yet. Have to get the bike into the garage I share with 3 other blokes, and space is a bit tight in there.

Hopefully soon.

[al_roethlisberger]

There must have been some cosmic energy around this topic floating around the Universe today 

MPH Cycles makes a pre-made kit for this issue, and sells the kit for newer models on their website:

 

Moto Guzzi | Startus Interuptus | Starter Relay Kit | MPH Cycles | Texas | Norge | Breva | Griso |

 

The kits listed on the website are only for Breva, Norge and Griso models.  MPH developed an entirely different kit for the earlier bikes (V11 Sports / LeMans, V10 Centauro) late last year but it is not advertised on the website.

Cost for the V11 kit is $70.00 which includes postage within USA.

I just heard from MPH today that they how have those kits for the earlier (V11) bikes available again.

Please reach out to MPH directly if interested.

 

[p6x]

I am glad this came up; not the "no crank" V11 issue, but the fact that finding information buried in multiple posts in a thread is often difficult.

I have the idea to coalesce the information into one single ePub embedable short story write up including photos.

Sort of a single read instead of multiple posts, multiple threads.

RadGuzzi is proving that it is not easy to understand the root cause and the ways to mitigate the problem. Not for all the topics though.

But the V11 cranking problem is a really puzzling one. There are various opinions on how to solve it.

[p6x]

@radguzzi

Are the symptoms identical to those in the video below?

 

[radguzzi]

4 hours ago, p6x said:

@radguzzi

Are the symptoms identical to those in the video below?

No sir.   More like this...  The non starting situation here is Directly after having started and then shutting it down.

On another attempt, I turned the bars left to right and on the swing at about 2 o'clock to the right there was a moment of cranking and then back to clicking, no start. 

Is that a hint...?  Can it be the ignition switch or the aforementioned bullet connectors under the tank. God forbid...

Edit:

I had just finished removing positive connection on the starter, cleaning it and putting it ack on.

rad__

[docc]

Well, it's not the clutch bullet connectors. More like not enough current.

You had said the battery is 12.65v (85% for an AGM). What does the voltage read when it tries to engage the starter?

Certainly, it could be the starter magnets have come loose. Yet, I would thoroughly clean and service the main ground at the back of the gearbox on the right as well as both of the starter fastening bolts and where the starter seats against the gearbox to ensure the grounding path is solid.

[radguzzi]

1 hour ago, docc said:

Well, it's not the clutch bullet connectors. More like not enough current.

You had said the battery is 12.65v (85% for an AGM). What does the voltage read when it tries to engage the starter?

Certainly, it could be the starter magnets have come loose. Yet, I would thoroughly clean and service the main ground at the back of the gearbox on the right as well as both of the starter fastening bolts and where the starter seats against the gearbox to ensure the grounding path is solid.

I have not taken a reading while cranking.. ahh when it does lol      I had checked the charging across the battery while it was running a couple of days ago.  I'll check the cranking volts with assistance from wife, Sue..   Is 12.65 too low for that battery...?

Also do the ground, that was next, and I ran out of time this afternoon, lot goin' on...  Bummer about the starter mounting bolts,  I Just had the cover off and moved the shock reservoir to clean the positive lug.   I will be able to do that again quicker this time.

Any thoughts on the clutch lever cut out...?  

I had a 2000 Quota that lost its magnets and that just jammed them against the starter case and locked up the starter.  This V11 still does run so there's that...

Thanks,

rad__