Pilot Debrief.

[audiomick]

23 minutes ago, docc said:

I don't ride for "fun."

I do. Not frivolously, but per defintion:

Quote

You refer to an activity or situation as fun if you think it is pleasant and enjoyable and it causes you to feel happy.

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/fun

 

Riding is dangerous (which sometimes adds to the kick), requires a lot of concentration, and is definitely not to be taken lightly. But I find it pleasant and enjoyable, and it makes me feel happy, particularly when I get it right and everything flows.

[docc]

24 minutes ago, audiomick said:

Riding is dangerous (which sometimes adds to the kick), requires a lot of concentration, and is definitely not to be taken lightly. But I find it pleasant and enjoyable, and it makes me feel happy, particularly when I get it right and everything flows.

That. There have so many attempts to define "THAT."

Somehow, "fun" just does not entirely translate the fullness of the experience.

"Welcome home, dear! Did you experience that surreal , uplifting,

transcendental, existential experience on your ride ? "

"Why, yes, darling, the ride was fun . . ."

"Did you cheat death with your awareness and skillset,

mastering the physical realm with intensity and purpose ?"

"Yes, yes. Quite fun, actually."

[audiomick]

The nail has a very sore head.

[Lucky Phil]

Yes I know my definition of "fun" isn't entirely in alignment with the dictionary definition same as a definition of a "sport" I read somewhere and liked. One who defined sport as a "physical activity with an element of physical danger or personal risk". Everything else is an "activity" or "pastime". So Motorcycle racing is a "sport", boxing is a "sport" and golf and tennis are not, they are "activities and or "pastimes". I like this definition 

Phil

[audiomick]

15 minutes ago, Lucky Phil said:

 boxing is a "sport"

Whilst I understand what you are getting at, and agree, I must say that I don't like boxing as an example. I consider boxing to be an anachronism, an activity that should have died out some time ago. Two blokes getting paid to beat the shit out of each other just doesn't work for me, and several hundred watching and getting excited about it, even less.

[docc]

55 minutes ago, audiomick said:

Whilst I understand what you are getting at, and agree, I must say that I don't like boxing as an example. I consider boxing to be an anachronism, an activity that should have died out some time ago. Two blokes getting paid to beat the shit out of each other just doesn't work for me, and several hundred watching and getting excited about it, even less.

Well, once "betting" enters the equation, all matters of "sport" are off . . .

[guzzler]

Yep, whenever money is involved the definition of sport goes out the window...

[Lucky Phil]

3 hours ago, audiomick said:

Whilst I understand what you are getting at, and agree, I must say that I don't like boxing as an example. I consider boxing to be an anachronism, an activity that should have died out some time ago. Two blokes getting paid to beat the shit out of each other just doesn't work for me, and several hundred watching and getting excited about it, even less.

Well these days compared to MMA cage fighting boxing is pretty benign. The thing I like about boxing is apart from being some of the fittest athletes there are there is nowhere to hide in the ring if you haven't trained hard and done the work. Unlike many sports where there is still scope to go in less than prepared and still come out a winner or at least OK in boxing that's never going to happen. Not 100% committed to the prep then you will get punished severely. I'm not even a particular boxing fan to be honest but I admire the skill and commitment they have. Plus they don't spend their retirement bleating and whining about how they were brain damaged in their careers unlike the football players of every code here looking for excuses for being ordinary in their post football life. Boxers accept if you're going to have a pro boxing career then you may end up punchy at the end of it. If you don't like that then find another sport, simple. Like a pro motorcycle racer complaining about limping or having missing fingers after his career is over. It never happens because they all accept the risks and consequences like real men.

Phil  

[activpop]

Well that was "fun". Aviation to boxing with a ride in between. 

[Lucky Phil]

1 hour ago, activpop said:

Well that was "fun". Aviation to boxing with a ride in between. 

If you wait long enough it will circle back around.

Phil

[Pressureangle]

12 hours ago, Lucky Phil said:

If you wait long enough it will circle back around.

Phil

Just like her airplane.

[activpop]

1 hour ago, Pressureangle said:

Just like her airplane.

Sad, but true.

I have read many stories about aviation fatalities, mainly to learn from mistakes that were made. The story that demonstrated the most lack of situational awareness that I can remember is Eastern flight 401 in 1972. Many changes were made in commercial aviation training after that incident. The fact that there were four people in the cockpit and no one was flying the plane turned out to be devastating.  I am not sure of this but there were good odds that some of them were military trained, the best training you can get. But they still made a fatal mistake. They broke the main rule of flying...fly the plane.

https://www.faa.gov/lessons_learned/transport_airplane/accidents/N310EA

[Gmc28]

Flying, It’s like everything else in life…. Requires some degree of natural skill, and then experience to compliment that skill set.  
if someone doesn’t have the basic skill set, it will not ultimately work out well.  If they don’t have or acquire experience, same problem.

plenty of skilled folks, “naturals”, who don’t learn from experience, and bad things happen. Or folks who manage to amass a lot of experience and survive by luck (or thanks to all the systems now available to pilots which make things safer), but without the natural skill set they are still not a great option as a PIC (pilot in command).

to complicate it more, there are the very distinctly different skill sets involved:  “stick and rudder” skills, akin to riding skills, and then there’s  “instrument flying/competence skillset”, which is more like a video game skill set.  Different parts of the brain.  Bush pilots need stick and rudder skills, airline pilots just need the instrument skills, but the best pilots have both.  I’ve come across plenty of airline pilots who were truly horrible pilots, but survived with the instrument skills and in an airline environment designed wisely over the decades to minimize risk via lots of amazing systems.

 Oh, and the final major issue is ego…. Male pride is the most common issue, but the American dream BS of “if you can dream it you can do it” ideology is just as bad at causing people to think they can do what they either can’t or shouldn’t. 

same for operating cars 😏, motorbikes, welding, surgery, etc 

[gstallons]

I watched the 19 min video of Flight 401 this morning . Incredible. 

 Coming up w/solutions and safety rules ex post facto is extremely costly. Not having 200 lbs of knowledge on board to at least diagnose  issues in the air could have and would help with any small issues .

[audiomick]

8 hours ago, Gmc28 said:

... Bush pilots need stick and rudder skills, airline pilots just need the instrument skills, but the best pilots have both. ....

I reckon the bloke who parked his Airbus on the Hudson a few years back was one of the "have both" category. I rather hope that there is one of those in the cockpit when I am on a commercial flight.