Oil Leak - Transmission Left Side Cover

[ChrisPDX]

Hi friends:

I have a 2001 Greenie I've been working to bring back to life (thanks for all the forum assistance and info).

I've ridden it a bit around town, and have one current oil leak that I'm hoping for advice on.

It's on the left side of the transmission case, visible just under the starter, adjacent to and slightly above the neutral warning light.  It's a circular piece of steel that pokes through the case and is a little recessed (see photo - I'm pointing at it with a screwdriver).  

I have a manual, but can't see where that piece is named anything in the Section N Gearbox chapter.  It does show up in one VERY small diagram there (see photo - I'm pointing at it with an Xacto) on p. 26 section N, but I can't work it out.  And because it has no slot or fastener head on it, I'm struggling to imagine how to get it out (to put on a new o-ring or whatever) other than take that side cover off.  Before such bold exploratory surgery, I thought it's best to ask :).

Attached are a couple photos.  

The leak is just a small drip, but it does run down the side of the case and onto the pipe.  I haven't ridden the bike extended miles yet, but am concerned I'd end up on the side of the road out of town with abundant hot oil on the outside, not the inside of the tranny.  It does form a drip VERY slowly, maybe once a week, while cold in my garage.

All advice appreciated!

[docc]

Look at your Workshop Manual Section N, page 14, and you can see that mounting shaft for the lower shift wheel from the inside (toward the left side of the photographic image next to the plunger for the Neutral Switch.

I am thinking it is pressed into/ part of the sideplate? Perhaps, clean the accessible outer area and apply a bead of RTV silicone?

[p6x]

It looks to me that you are going to need to remove that cover as what appears to be a recess looking from the outside, is where the axle of item 12, Selector 2a-4a-6a is connected. Maybe it is a post. As you see in the drawing, there is a discontinued line going through the middle of that recess, on the other side of the selector item 12, there is a circlip. This leads me to believe this is some axle maybe a cold insert which leaks on the outside.

Hopefuly, someone who has opened the gearbox should be able to shed better light.

It think I have a picture of it when my geabox was opened because the pawl spring broke; you can see the axle coming out from that cover. I don't know how there could be a leak there, but you may be able to fix it from the inside.

But it looks like you have to remove that cover in any case.

 

Edited October 24 by p6x

[Tomchri]

docc is probably correct, pressed in. Never heard, seen a leak there before. Everything else seems A1 cleaned. You need to take the cover of, if the bike doesn't have the Chuck unbreakeable shift spring. Note some different lenght bolts. When putting back the cover, it's easy to hear it's all in, clack.  Not much pressure in there, oil level correct ?   Silicone, JB W. as proposed.

Cheers Tom.

 

[MartyNZ]

If the post for the lower gear selector cam is loose in the side plate, it explains why later gearboxes have a reinforcing "banana plate". If the post is loose, I suggest pushing it out, degreasing it and reassembling with epoxy in the joint. It's important that the height of the post is maintained.

Or you could find a later side plate. It bolts up in exactly the same way as the earlier plate..   

 

Later plate has longer posts and a reinforcing banana plate.

 

Edited October 28 by MartyNZ

[MartyNZ]

Harper's is listing the kit to upgrade earlier V11 6 speed gearboxes. 

Edited October 28 by MartyNZ

[Lucky Phil]

Pull the side cover. If the post isn't loose clean the area down with solvent to flush out the oil thats migrated between the pin and the housing then apply Loctite wicking grade compound and re assemble.

Phil

[gstallons]

Have you got a part # ?

[Chuck]

5 hours ago, Lucky Phil said:

Pull the side cover. If the post isn't loose clean the area down with solvent to flush out the oil thats migrated between the pin and the housing then apply Loctite wicking grade compound and re assemble.

Phil

Beat me to it..

[ChrisPDX]

This is such great feedback and gives me good direction.  Many, many thanks.  Photos and diagrams thumbs up.  

Not sure if it's a "this weekend" project or a "next weekend" project.  But @swooshdave won't let it drift much beyond that :).  

Appreciated!

Chris

[ChrisPDX]

Minor update.  

Before disassembly, I wanted to be 110% sure the oil is coming from the spot, so I cleaned it again.  As I was messing about in that are with paper towels and mini screwdrivers to get the last of the oil out of the crevices, I noticed...that post is absolutely loose.  I can spin it quite easily with the tip of a screwdriver pushed just off center of the post from the outside.  Round and round and round, no problem.

So, my intention is to remove, degrease, and glue/epoxy the post in place.

At the risk of instigating a "which oil is best" conversation , is the consensus on best adhesive for this steel post to aluminum case application - JB Weld?  

My default is probably that, but I'm a little concerned, while the post currently spins, it's actually quite a tight tolerance fit.  Obviously not (successfully) press fit, but maybe...only a couple thousandths (imperial) undersize.  So probably need a relatively thin adhesive to achieve the bond the full 360 and still allow a fully seated post to maintain parts alignment.  Thoughts about:

  a. JB Weld

  b. Cyanoacrylate based adhesive, gel or thin

  c.  Red Loctite

  d. Other

[docc]

21 minutes ago, ChrisPDX said:

Minor update.  

Before disassembly, I wanted to be 110% sure the oil is coming from the spot, so I cleaned it again.  As I was messing about in that are with paper towels and mini screwdrivers to get the last of the oil out of the crevices, I noticed...that post is absolutely loose.  I can spin it quite easily with the tip of a screwdriver pushed just off center of the post from the outside.  Round and round and round, no problem.

So, my intention is to remove, degrease, and glue/epoxy the post in place.

At the risk of instigating a "which oil is best" conversation , is the consensus on best adhesive for this steel post to aluminum case application - JB Weld?  

My default is probably that, but I'm a little concerned, while the post currently spins, it's actually quite a tight tolerance fit.  Obviously not (successfully) press fit, but maybe...only a couple thousandths (imperial) undersize.  So probably need a relatively thin adhesive to achieve the bond the full 360 and still allow a fully seated post to maintain parts alignment.  Thoughts about:

  a. JB Weld

  b. Cyanoacrylate based adhesive, gel or thin

  c.  Red Loctite

  d. Other

What is the "wicking" LocTite that Lucky_Phil and Chuck both suggested?

While you are in there, perhaps a Chuck-designed/Scud SuperSpring?

Plus, certainly worth this effort:

 

[Lucky Phil]

1 hour ago, ChrisPDX said:

Minor update.  

Before disassembly, I wanted to be 110% sure the oil is coming from the spot, so I cleaned it again.  As I was messing about in that are with paper towels and mini screwdrivers to get the last of the oil out of the crevices, I noticed...that post is absolutely loose.  I can spin it quite easily with the tip of a screwdriver pushed just off center of the post from the outside.  Round and round and round, no problem.

So, my intention is to remove, degrease, and glue/epoxy the post in place.

At the risk of instigating a "which oil is best" conversation , is the consensus on best adhesive for this steel post to aluminum case application - JB Weld?  

My default is probably that, but I'm a little concerned, while the post currently spins, it's actually quite a tight tolerance fit.  Obviously not (successfully) press fit, but maybe...only a couple thousandths (imperial) undersize.  So probably need a relatively thin adhesive to achieve the bond the full 360 and still allow a fully seated post to maintain parts alignment.  Thoughts about:

  a. JB Weld

  b. Cyanoacrylate based adhesive, gel or thin

  c.  Red Loctite

  d. Other

Use some loctite 638.

Phil

[Lucky Phil]

43 minutes ago, docc said:

What is the "wicking" LocTite that Lucky_Phil and Chuck both suggested?

While you are in there, perhaps a Chuck-designed/Scud SuperSpring?

Plus, certainly worth this effort:

 

Wicking grade is low viscosity loctite and is designed to migrate into threads with the fastener already installed and torqued. It's also used extensively as a porosity filler when having porose castings commercially repaired. I used it to fix the porosity on my Daytona heads and did a how to thread on it.

Phil 

[MartyNZ]

Henkel make LocTite, and give good advice on product selection, depending on load, gap filling needs, and temperature. 

Retaining solutions | Henkel Adhesives

I have an old pre-modification plate I can measure for you if you need to confirm protrusion and spacing of the posts.

Edited October 27 by MartyNZ